Instigator / Pro
11
1706
rating
33
debates
80.3%
won
Topic
#2818

Resolved: Abstinence only sex-education is not effective in reducing teen pregnancy

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
3
3
Better sources
4
2
Better legibility
2
2
Better conduct
2
2

After 2 votes and with 2 points ahead, the winner is...

Theweakeredge
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
4
Time for argument
One week
Max argument characters
20,000
Voting period
Two weeks
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
9
1702
rating
77
debates
70.13%
won
Description

Abstinence: "the fact of not doing something, such as drinking alcohol or having sex:" [1]
Only: "used to show that there is a single one or very few of something, or that there are no others:" [2]
Sex Education: "a school course about sexual reproduction and sexual feelings" [3]
Effective: "successful or achieving the results that you want:" [4]
Reducing: "to become or to make something become smaller in size, amount, degree, importance, etc.:" [5]
Teenage: "aged between 13 and 19:" [6]
Pregnancy: "the state of being pregnant:" [7]

[1]: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/abstinence
[2]: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/only
[3]: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/sex-education
[4]: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/effective
[5]: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/reduce?q=reducing+
[6]: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/teenage
[7]: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/pregnancy

General Rules:
1. No new arguments in the last round
2. Sources should be posted in the debate rounds, hyperlinked or otherwise
3. Burden of Proof is shared

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@Undefeatable

I’d say it was also largely decided by R3. We clearly saw certain points differently, but I can see where you’re coming from.

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@Theweakeredge

also, sorry if my "source bombing" (Systemic Racism) may have influenced your debating style in that direction.... I mostly wanted more rigorous research, intimidation effect, and proving beyond a reasonable doubt XD [Most times, three or fewer articles might be good enough]

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@whiteflame

interesting decision! What did you think of my interpretation? I thought the debate was basically decided by Round 3 since Con was basically repeating points by round 4...

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@fauxlaw

Appreciate that. I don't think I'll miss the deadline.

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@whiteflame

Regardless of how you vote, I hope you get your vote posted in time. Thanks.

Do note, however, that I'm working and will have limited time to get at this. Might not be able to post the actual RFD until just after work and close to the deadline, so if it gets close, just know I'm still on it.

I am still trying to get through this. I've just got fauxlaw's final round left, and I've already got notes based on what I've read so far.

Suffice it to say, at least for now, this is a closer debate than I anticipated.

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@Undefeatable

I am not confused.

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@fauxlaw
@Theweakeredge

again, if you are confused please ask questions

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@fauxlaw

Except Jesus' mom lol

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@fauxlaw

Key word here; "For people who..." that's the problem

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@Undefeatable

For 100% of people who practice abstinence 100% of the time, it works 100% of the time.
What other contraceptive has that record? None. Memes be damned.

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@Theweakeredge

you know, this debate reminds me of the meme "it works 100% of the time, 20% of the time." Funny how that works in real life.

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@Theweakeredge

Sorry about the delay on voting, will try to finish it.

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@whiteflame

Vote bump

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@Barney

If that's what you feel is right, then abstain, thank you for your consideration

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@fauxlaw
@Theweakeredge

At a glance it looks like you each offered compelling cases. However, I likely have too much bias on this topic to be a fair judge.

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@whiteflame

thanks

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@Undefeatable

lol, all I ask is for you to do your best

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@Theweakeredge

You give me too much credit assuming my voting prowess is near my debating prowess XD but I will try

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@Theweakeredge

Shouldn’t be a problem.

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@Barney
@whiteflame
@Undefeatable

Vote bump

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@fauxlaw

Disregard the thing in my second rebuttal about that being the last round argument- I thought that I was in the position of Con in the structure of the debate my bad.

No idea why - probably cause I was rushing to type that all out

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@Theweakeredge

See my R3, "maintenance" section, when published, which should come in the next two days.

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@fauxlaw

#17 - because it means that IF you do bring it back up then it reduces how long I can reply and argue back - if not then you just dropped an argument

In general - I apologize for the briefness of my arguments, personal stuff has forced me to be a tad more concise.

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@Theweakeredge

Don't be confused by the term, ibid. It's citation-speak for "use the full reference listed immediately above." In other words, for [3], [4], [5] use full reference [2].

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@fauxlaw

I've finished almost everything else, but I am unable to access three of your sources; 3,4, and 5, would you mind listing them?

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@Theweakeredge

Not until the debate is concluded can one draw the conclusion of dropped arguments, and that is a job, ultimately, for voters to conclude, isn't it? Why bother mention of it during the argument phase until the last round? Who says arguments from an opponent must be picked up and rebutted in the immediate opponent's following round? That may be your convention, but no policy enforces it. Excuse my different convention, but it is mine, and no policy prohibits it. May I suggest you make it a matter of debate protocol in your Description if you're so intent on its compliance. I'm at an end of this discussion.

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@fauxlaw

recommendation: don't discuss dropping points not in debate

Response: No. Because you dropped points and then claimed it to be "your debate style" dropping points is not a debate style, its a flaw in a debating style

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@Theweakeredge

A word to the wise: debating debate style during argument style between opponents is not recommended and I don't like engaging it. You do your way, I'll do mine, and let's end this back-and-forth other than in the debate. Okay?

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@fauxlaw

I don't think you can justify ignoring entire sources to make your contention true by saying, "I can do it later," Because you claimed at the end of the contention, " Clearly, the data demonstrates that abstinence-only education does correlate with reduction in teen pregnancy, refuting Pro’s Contention I conclusion [the “trend” clearly indicates a reduction in teen pregnancies, and that abstinence-only is contributing to it]. Therefore, the Resolution fails." After you had failed to justify it, on account, idk, ignoring the other half of my contention, actually, the latter half of the paragraph...

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@Theweakerscale

This is, by your initiation, a 4-round debate. I think that means I have fully 4 rounds. Got a train to catch?

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@fauxlaw

Except you know... ignoring half of my sources

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@fauxlaw

An interesting rebuttal, i certainly didn't expect it, but I think that comes with something that is more rarely discussed in detail. I'm looking forward to dissecting it more indepth, which, now that I'm caught up with debates that are due in less than 3 days, I can do.

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@Theweakeredge

No problem. You have set the timing, and complied with it. Some good arguments, my friend. I'm enjoying going through them and will have rebuttals, never fear. But, you have done some good research. Carry on.

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@fauxlaw

Apologies for the wait, as you are fairly comprehensive in your arguments, I wanted to make sure I exhaustively looked through my sources. Thanks to school work that is increased due to the power outages last week, homework has been a lot lately, so, that's why this is so last minute.

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@Theweakeredge

Thank you. I, too, look forward to a goods, friendly debate. Best of luck.

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@fauxlaw

Thanks for taking up the challenge, looking forward to a good debate

As usual, people will enter the debate through this comment section, but that's not how it's done. You are using abstention as an attempt to prove it does not work. Sorry, but only by proper engagement of the debate does a matter resolve one way or the other. Well, I accept the challenge. Carry on, Edge.

When a society makes porn a taboo that is strictly 18+ (or 21+ in some nations if not totally illegal and censored) and tells people to completely fight against their very natural urges, the result is them acting on those urges in very unhealthy, repressed and overly active-in-burst ways. Always has been, always will be. Ironically, this is how we went from a few hundred humans to the ~7.5 billion we have today.

If we wish to teach people to reproduce less, we must be very open and accepting of what sexual urges are and how to safely get the orgasm without unsafe penetration or anything that even approaches encouraging such ignorance.

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@MisterChris
@Theweakeredge

I would suggest that we are instinctively motivated not to abstain.

So teaching kids to abstain from intercourse, is as much a part of sex education as contraception is.

Perhaps we should also teach kids that all other forms of gratification are fun rather than taboo.... When done safely and within the law of course.

And keep religion out of schools!

Yes.

It may be possible that said education would be less effective than not teaching at all. The teachers say it as a taboo thing, and when we are teenagers, aren’t we all interested in things that would be forbidden? Now they knew something called “sex” and would suppress the urge of doing it now, instead of? Discovering and doing it later?

If you have no biology in sex Ed, then it is not that useful.

Really the only way to make abstinence only education effective is to couple it with religious indoctrination and severe social ostracism.

Or as I like to call it: do as I say, not as I do!

"It was found that those who fall into the category of generation X lost their virginity (on average) at 18.1, baby boomers at 17.6 and millennials at 17.4 years-old."

https://www.indy100.com/offbeat/average-age-people-lose-their-virginity-dred-study-gay-men-women-millenials-baby-boomers-generation-x-8204266