Instigator / Con
1
1500
rating
25
debates
42.0%
won
Topic
#3522

Islam is a religion that supports terrorism

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Winner
1
0

After 1 vote and with 1 point ahead, the winner is...

rayhan16
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
3
Time for argument
One day
Max argument characters
12,000
Voting period
One week
Point system
Winner selection
Voting system
Open
Contender / Pro
0
1687
rating
555
debates
68.11%
won
Description

Islam is a terrorist supporting religion
I am against this statement

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@Public-Choice

Schedule it whenever you would like.
1 week writing
1 month voting
20,000 words

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@rayhan16

I'd be happy to schedule it. I have two upcoming debates with AustinL and Whiteflame.

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@Public-Choice

And there is it, the outrage has come out of you. If one is not following Islam, they are not following the Quran also

But you won't get that. Send a debate request to me, if you want to debate on this issue, instead of commenting

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@rayhan16

"they are not following islam"

But they ARE following the Quran and pedophile rapist Muhammad.

Last I checked, the Quran is the gold standard of Islam, not imams and councils.

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@Sir.Lancelot

I don't get emotional and outraged unless one falsifies my religion. Otherwise, if you're telling me I'll get outraged, chances are, I probably won't.
I can't wait for your arguments

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@Public-Choice

Name a terrorist attack that Muslims have committed that exceeds the amount of people affect that the US have committed.

Even if groups like ISIS are still around, they are not following Islam. They are killing innocents, this is not the teachings of Islam. Islam is a peaceful religion, that does not advocate terrorism. How can you reply to me, a non Muslim, by saying Islam promotes terrorism? Where is the proof? Where is the Quranic verses and Hadith's that consider to kill and fight INNOCENT people and spread terror to INNOCENT people? There is no such thing, get out

Everything depends on interpretation.

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@rayhan16

Oh for sure the US military commits acts of terror all the time. But so does Islam. Believing both isn't mutually exclusive.

Virtually every government commits acts of terror. That makes them all terrorists. Iran, though, commits significantly more than most, and Islam is its religion.

Ergo, Islam is a terror organization.

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@Public-Choice

Islam does not promote terrorism at all lol.

Also your claim is false. the usa killed 3 million people in Iraq, a genocide of the native Americans, this is the largest terrorist attack organisation, secular democracies

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@rayhan16

https://www.answering-islam.org/Silas/terrorism.htm
https://www.answering-islam.org/Silas/terrorist.htm
https://www.aclu.org/sites/default/files/field_document/ACLURM001331.pdf
https://www.unaoc.org/repository/8412Jihad,%20Holy%20or%20Unholy%20War,%20J.%20Esposito.pdf
https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/jihad-crime-and-internet-content-analysis-jihadist-forum

I could go on and on, but the point is, there's a reason Islam is the religion with the most amount of terrorists and terrorist sympathizers.

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@Public-Choice

Which physical act of terror does Islam push? Just curious to know

It may be too late to chime in here, but to me, if a religion pushes acts of terror, it is pushing terrorism. RM conclusively proved Islam pushes acts of terror. So it is a terrorist religion. Wish I could have voted but I'm seeing this too late.

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@rayhan16

I agree your opponent's opening argument holds no weight and can be seen as hearsay; however, "It has been an absolutely disgraceful 1st argument from Pro. Not only did he lie and defame the beautiful religion of Islam but he also gave no evidence for his claims. This is a mockery on his behalf. Absolutely unprofessional, his heart got in the way of a civilized debate and has now turned it into an emotional back and forth" this is hypocritical, within the same breath you are condemning the very acts you to are partaking in by making that statement.

LOL. Islam is the only?

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@FLRW

The Holy War Critera is something which you may not have heard of

-Enemy has to attack first to go to war
-Innocents must not be killed
-Wildlife and the environment must not be harmed

These 3 things dismiss every quote that you can think of

Islam absolutely supports terrorism. What does Allah say about unbelievers?
"Slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them," Allah instructs the Prophet Muhammad (Quran, 9:5). He continues: "Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites! ... Hell shall be their home, an evil fate."

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@RationalMadman

I took away that trying to determine which group is authentic is too difficult to manage anything meaningful for either side. That uncertainty wasn’t biased against you, though considering that you had the burden of demonstrating that Islam supports terrorism, it meant you lacked a means to do so.

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@RationalMadman

The assassins I already went over. Very quickly, not following Islam, like ISIS, should be condemned
That is that out of the way
Then Khalid, you never gave me anything that he did which was a terrorist act. Remember the definitions, and you can give the terrorist acts that Khalid had committed.

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@rayhan16

most voters, including whiteflame do not respect or allow brand new stuff in final round.

Terrorism was a central part to Islam from its early days, whether by conquering and pillaging or hashashin style assassination.

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@RationalMadman

You had 3 rounds with 10k characters each. You had the last round with 9000 characters left. I had the same amount of characters as you. I never said the only non-aggressive ones are authentic, I just said that terrorism is not supported. There was no response to self defence as whiteflame had already voted.

You need to accept it and be the bigger man

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@whiteflame

I didn't say the others are not, it's Con saying that only the non-aggressive are authentic, your RFD is flawed but it's fine, the character limit really inhibited my ability to reveal how many quotes support it.

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@whiteflame

How do you define 'support'? I define it as enables and lays the groundwork for.

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@Barney
@whiteflame

Please leave a vote

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@FLRW

Not another one lol, imma challenge you to a debate

In his inaugural address of January 20, 2017, the newly sworn-in president of the United States, Donald J. Trump, announced that “We will […] unite the civilized world against Radical Islamic Terrorism, which we will eradicate completely from the face of the Earth”.

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@RationalMadman

I am not changing any topic. I simply asked you to provide me with some quotes that tell Muslims to kill innocents, that tell Muslims to act unjustly etc. That was and is my challenge,

The actions of Khalid. What did Khalid do? Did he commit terrorism? Same with the Prophet. Give me evidence.

You have a complete misconception about women in Islam, I have a debate where the opponent forfeited look at that.

Gay people I have no problem with. Obviously my religion condemns them. Lets get you educated. If some Muslims are gay, then they are gay. But it is a test. Only if they act upon being gay is it then punishable. And even that, you need 4 witnesses to punish a gay person. 4! So if a gay person has sex with another person of the same gender where 4 witnesses can see, then only is it punishable. But if it is done in a bedroom and there was not any witnesses then it is none of my business, simple as that. Now hopefully that answers your question. Gay people in Islam can be gay but not act upon it. It is part of the greater Jihad. Every day struggles, such as praying 5 times a day, it is hard but you have to have a strong iman. Same with eating non-haram foods, not drinking alcohol etc. It is a test.

Feminism I have no hatred to. Islam does not teach that women are meant to be degraded and they are not important. There is an entire chapter in the Quran about a woman. A man is not allowed to hurt a woman, not even leave a mark and not hurt her. A woman is entitled to rights such as working, voting, inheritance rights, is exempt of all financial liabilities such as debt if the man can pay it etc etc. I have a debate on this as well, so feel free to check it out.

I am not saying you are a bad person. I am saying you need to open your eyes. You can hate Islam, Muslims and the Quran. But you need to think why. Are you claims justified? If you make a claim, you have to back it up with the sufficient evidence. If you cannot do that, then your claims are invalid. Simple rules and laws of a debate. If your claims are not justified, then ask yourself why are you still believing in them? This is following blind claims. Where they don't have a base and are just there in place to set an agenda and a bias. Let it go man. I am just guessing here that you are around 20. That means if you die old, hopefully you do, then you have another 60 years on this earth. Let go of the bias and learn. If you don't want to learn, let go of the silly claims

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@RationalMadman

There are a lot of things to clear up. You are a grown up, I am assuming you are over 18, over 20 even. If you are that age, then surely you must have the knowledge. If not then alas, I am here to clear things up.

The Quran is not violent from the get go. It is not violent at all. However it is not a pacifist book. Violence is allowed under circumstances such as self defence, which is morally acceptable. I don't think you are an Islamophobe, you have the capability to debate and are very intelligent, however not on Islam. The sooner you learn, the sooner your attitude will change.

The Prophet Muhammed (PBUH) marriage to Aisha. Lets clear that up.

-He married her at 6 years old. Yet he waited until 9, for consummation. Why did he wait? If he was truly a a groomer, why did he wait 3 years?
- Girls got married very young 1400 years ago. If you are from the UK, you would know that 100 years ago, the legal age to marry was 12. Imagine 1400 years ago. When a girl turns 9 years old, she begins to hit puberty. This signifies being an adult, more mature.
-If we look at the lifetime of the Prophet, he never committed any sins. You may disagree, but the rest of the 'things' he did which people think are wrong, are not wrong, just need to be explained.
-1400 years ago, girls marrying at a young age was common. Many people did it. The Prophet married 13 women. Nearly all were widows whose husbands died in the wars and Allah commanded the Prophet to marry them because they were grieving etc.

These are all the things that happened in the Prophets lifetime

- The Quraysh were defaming him and distorting his message, they accused him of becoming a poet, a liar and insane
-A woman would throw garbage at him every single day yet he never retaliated.
-The Quraysh were ridiculing him and called him a madman whenever he was spotted to discourage him
-The Quraysh boycotted him and the Muslims. They would ban doing business with them, talking and giving food to them. Even his Uncle joined in
-He had the insides of a camel thrown at him
-Non Muslims would torture Summayah and eventually shoved a spear in her private parts and left her for dead
-Yasir was tied to two horses and had his body ripped apart
-The people at Tarif abused him and threw rocks at him, he had the option to destroy the city and refused
-Bilal was tortured, got whipped and had rocks on his body

Many other things happened and he forgave them. This narrative of your description of him is simply untrue.

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@rayhan16

I know how this works, the more candid and blunt I become the more you play into the narrative of painting me as a brainwashed Islamophobe, deflection is your entire 'thing', you and all true fundamentalists do this.

You are indeed a fundamentalist, I didn't think so at first but it is clear that you think your interpretation of Islam is the only correct one and that people can't redefine it.

What is your approach to gay people and feminism btw?

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@rayhan16

No, you are correct, it is violent from the get-go which is more horrifying. It goes from blatantly aggressive and spiteful to wishy washy by the end.

It is actually the opposite of what happens in the Hadith, where Muhammad grows more and more narcissistic and sociopathic as it goes along even truly justifying grooming a 6 year old girl and raping her at 9 which was not at all normal back then whatsoever, it is even said how shocked and resistant the parents were until he basically strongarmed them with 'it is me asking, how dare you question it' which is also how he got 5 wives while limiting others to 4.

Muhammad was completely full of himself and in these days if someone set out saying they were in touch with a god they call some new fancy name and drew symbols for Allah that symbolise the pitchfork of Satan and even have the Arabic 6 6 6 in it, we'd be like um... okay buddy, let's get you on some meds.

You are now completely changing the topic to 'promotes' as opposed to supports or condones. Islam doesn't literally in the scripture directly command that you have to do acts of terror, instead both the scripture, the actions of Khalid alongside Muhammad and the Hashashin and many ancient Islamic leaders imply that the foundation of Islam is violent, brutal and barbaric to women, disbelievers and any native cultures where they 'colonised' (they didn't just colonised they completely blackmailed pure, nationwide conversion).

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@RationalMadman

First of all, the Quran doesn't get more violent as it goes on. Nor does it get more peaceful. It is not in chronological order.

Secondly, I answered every quote.

Now you don't have to believe Islam promotes terrorism

There you go! Have fun,

Unless you want to give me quotes that I did not answer?

It is not a biased answer, it is common sense. If the Quran states kill people in self defence, then it isn't terrorism right? Unless you want to tell me it doesn't say in self defence? But look, you are too biased to even debate. Let go of it and just think,

anything else?

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@rayhan16

I gave you some, the first 5 chapters on their own already set out the foundation of Islam as spiteful and viciously aggressive to anything it sees as standing in the way of its viral spread.

Ehyeh gave you plenty in the other debate, you're not considering how to read them differently to your biased way and it is you, not us, ignoring what's written which is why we use the quotes in the debate and you avoid them when explaining them away.

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@RationalMadman

If you have read the Quran and Hadith, then give the quotes to your claims. If you cannot then your claims become invalid and respectfully go back to school. Its mad how I am the 16 year old and have more common sense!

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@rayhan16

I have read the Qur'an, Hadith and looked at Islamic history and present stories of child brides, acid attack victims and many other ex-muslim horror stories.

Tommy Robinson has nothing to do with it.

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@RationalMadman

Or are you too ignorant to actually say 'I am wrong'. All I am asking for is a verse which says kill people who are innocent. If they are guilty then they are right to be killed. I am going back to self defence. If you cannot provide it, then it isn't true. If you cannot give your evidence, then it isn't true. But you won't give evidence, and it is down to 1 of 2 things. The first thing is you don't want to admit you are wrong, so you will beat around the bush with extreme claims. The second thing is you are biased. If you are from the UK, you have been listening to too much tommy Robinson, ukip party and the EDL. If you are from the US then it goes without saying, I feel sorry for you for you have been brainwashed by the media.

Both you, RationalMadman and ISIS have at least 1 thing in common. You both believe that Islam is a terror and war like religion. You have it all in common. You both think it. However the other 1.8 billion don't. Let go of the bias please and enjoy life

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@Ehyeh

He is asking for a verse where it explicitly says you have to kill others, if we offer anything combining to amount to allowing and encouraging violence and brutality (even slaying) to achieve obedience and prove this is a theme throughout the Qur'an both domestically to one's wife and externally to non-believers and 'false Muslims' etc, he will ignore the combination and blame us for it.

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@RationalMadman
@Ehyeh

A thing in which you and RationalMadman are not understanding is I am challenging you to give evidence of your claims. I will then respond to the 'evidence' and debunk it. If you cannot give any evidence then your claims are wrong and unsupported. Very simple. You and the other guy both believe that Islam is a religion that supports terrorism and I am here to tell you its not. And you are saying 'I am finding a way'. No, I am just giving the answer. Self defence is not terrorism, so that is not finding a way, that is me telling you what is going on. As you are both non-Muslims and I am a Muslim, surely you would know who has more knowledge. I am not saying I have the most in the world, but more than you too.

You both still have not proved that Islam is a terrorist centric religion. I would like you to give quotes and I would like you to listen to my answer. Then, if you actually listen, let go of the bias and be sincere, all your quotes that you give will be answered and you would maybe and hopefully change your mind. But if you are stuck on a mindset of 'Islam is a terrorist religion' and not listening to why it isn't, how can i prove it and make you change your mind? The answer is there, but some do not like to listen. 'It is not the eyes that are blind, it's the heart'

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@rayhan16

It seems like you would never change your mind, irrespective of what the Quran said. It could literally tell you straight up to kill all non-believers and you would still find a way to interpret it to your mental box. Not that I'm saying your mental box is wrong. You just cant prove it sufficiently for most people who aren't moderate Sunnis' to agree with you.

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@RationalMadman

I am waiting for some quotes which prove that Islam promotes violence and terrorism to innocents

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@RationalMadman

The problem is, every single quote that you showed me does not promote violence to innocents. I debunked every single quote. So the challenge still stands

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@rayhan16

Absolutely all quotes I will show you and historical evidence of the original Muslims (before anything could be twisted or changed, the original Muslims acted with unadultered Islam surely) you will keep ignoring it, saying it is 'self defense only'.

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@rayhan16

I found quite a few, so did ehyeh in the other debate.

Innocent Jews are a real thing. Innocent ex-Muslims are a real thing too.

Islam has also been known for intraviolence amongst sects, severely so, justified by scripture encouraging deepest hatred and aggression for so-called false followers.

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@RationalMadman

Yh it's been a while so just reassuring that you got that challenge.

Find me 1 quote that promotes violence and terrorism to innocents in the Quran. I will debunk whatever quote you give.

Hope you enjoy this challenge

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@RationalMadman

Those who don't want to listen are the ignorant ones. I challenge you to give me 1 quote from the Quran that promotes violence/terrorism to innocent people

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@rayhan16

The reason that Islam is the most converted to religion is primarily due to its aggressive dogmatism, which even Christianity is letting go of.

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@rayhan16

I am indeed uneducated on Islamic fanatic propaganda, as soon as I spot most propaganda I literally look away to avoid it brainwashing me. So yes, I am relatively uneducated, I skimread such nonsense.

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@rayhan16

The enemy needn't attack, they need only be deemed in the way of Islam's spread.

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@RationalMadman

Are you not educated on this manner?

Muslims go to war for Allah, the only way war is permissable is if it is in self defence, hence the enemy attacking first.

There is nowhere in the Quran that says slay in the name of Allah unto innocents. This is because Islam does not teach to kill innocent people, I have said this in many of my arguments. Any verse that you supposedly cherry pick from the Quran about war, killing, fighting is most definitely not going to be about promoting terrorism, killing innocents nor oppressing innocents. If you can't see this then your a lost hope. Islam is the most converted to religion each year, it will be the most popular in 50 years. People are beginning to accept the message. But this narrative of Islam promoting violence when there is an option of peace is just not right and biased. Give me any quote in the Quran that is unjust and unfair and I will debunk it for you, I am that confident

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@rayhan16

Self defence? I don't see any self defence outlined at all, it just says those that stand in the way of Allah, nothing about the self.

It also specifies only to stop the inflicting of fear and agony when the person 'repents' and conforms to Islam.

I'll try to get to this as I don't want it to go without any votes. Controversial as it is, I think I can manage.

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@RationalMadman

But surely if you read my responses to that debate about the quotes that you picked, you would be a bit more lenient. nearly all the quotes you gave are only for self defence and the holy war criteria and then you gave that bit about Khalid who did no such terrorist act after reverting to Muslim, even from that website you sent, then the assassins were not following Islam. So what do you still resent? Even Allah, He is God. Of course he should be feared. The reason being is if we commit sins, and remember Allah and his punishments in hell, then we can double look these sins and tell ourselves, is it really worth it? Then we do not commit those sins at all. Here is the great part which I forgot to add in the debate. If we want to do a sin and we actually double look ourselves and be sincere and do not commit that sin, it is a reward. This is how merciful God is. But you do you. Could I ask, do you follow a religion?