Instigator / Pro
11
1500
rating
16
debates
40.63%
won
Topic
#638

CNN IS FAKE NEWS

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
3
12
Better sources
4
8
Better legibility
4
4
Better conduct
0
4

After 4 votes and with 17 points ahead, the winner is...

RationalMadman
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
4
Time for argument
Three days
Max argument characters
30,000
Voting period
One month
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
28
1697
rating
556
debates
68.17%
won
Description

So this is mainly a tribute to the disproven lies of "russia collusion" that came to a sad end for libtards a couple days ago. WhAt A sHoCk!

I am arguing CNN is fake news. The main reason is they claim to be unbiased when they clearly are bias AF, but also i will present some other reasons like the Covington kid, etc.

Criterion
Pro
Tie
Con
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:

The first thing to note is that pro does not offer a concrete definition of fake news. This allows con to dominate with the definition - cons attempt to reiterate the definitions lead to a confused and arbitrary definition where it is still largely unclear as to how the flohrase fake news applies.

My issue with the resolution - is that not only does pro need to prove that articles and bias are intentionally leading to false stories - but as he claims CNN as a whole is “fake news”, he has to show this is systematic in cnn.

Pro offers four examples, Smollett, Covington, negative press against Trump, and a collection of claims about Russia. There was a throwaway comment about Acosta which wasn’t detailed enough to weigh.

For the first two, pro offers only asserted conclusions- that CNN rushed to judgement therefore it was purposefully dishonest much of the time - I feel the conclusion doesn’t automatically follow from the premise - and pro offers no arguments to convince me it does: nor does he offer any evidence that there is a wider intentional dishonesty other than these two examples; nor does he offer evidence of intent to mislead.

For the example of negative press coverage - if I assume this is factually correct, this is only evidence of widespread dishonesty if pro also shows the press coverage should not be 90% negative - which he does not; or that the specific coverage is broadly unfair - which he also does not.

The remaining Russian related points pro raises constitute a general assertion that Russian Collusion was a lie, and a couple of examples of members of CNN staff lessening the significance of Russia. In the complete absence of specific context or any detail - pro does not provide me a reason to believe that Van Jones believing that Russian Collusion is a big nothing burger means that the entirety of CNNs reported narrative is deliberately dishonest -likewise pro doesn’t offer an argument as to why the producers comments that there’s no big proof (or the rest) demonstrate their coverage is overly unfair or dishonest. At best it’s a type of heresay - rather than evidence.

Cons rebuttal to the Russian point was short - but brutal. He simply asked pro to show which of the Russian stories are made up. Pro was not able to answer this point. This is particularly devestating as it makes it apparent that despite pros wide ranging claims that the Russian narrative was faked, lies, made up - he is unable to point to a single one of the multiple stories that is actually fake. This point alone, and pros inability to show an example of where CNNs Russian narrative was fake as he claimed - demonstrates how vacuous pros position is.

The remaining issues really boils down to definitions of what fake news is: “CNN is fake news”, in my view cannot be taken to mean simply that one or two stories are inaccurate and get corrected, as con explained and justified with concrete definitions - there must be intent to deceive, and imo there must be substantial patterns of misbehaviour.

As pros primary evidences are offered prima facia as evidence of bias, bad content and fakery - yet cannot be reasonably interpreted to support the contention prima facia; this means pro doesn’t provide the necessary warrant for his main claims about Jesse Smollet, Covington, and Pro simply destroys pros fake collusion narrative with his unanswered question.

Arguments to con.

Conduct to con for the forfeit.

All other points tied.

Criterion
Pro
Tie
Con
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:

PRO failed to define their terms in the first round which slowed the conversation down. CON defined theirs right away. CON then gave examples and provided a nuance view on CNN in order to demonstrating the low percentage of "fake news" CNN has done and by putting the burden of proof on PRO.
PRO's arguments on objective reporting "Anyone who reads a CNN article or turns on their night cable news can tell everybody has a leftist bias", this is not a strong evidence. No one can argue against anecdotes and they are not worth much. PRO then failed to understand CON's argument on the differences between messing up on some details to fabricating news. CON then provided more evidence to support their side.

PRO provided highly questionable sources like infowars, stonecoldtruth and project veritas. Each one of these are known conspiracy theory websites. On the other side, CON provided proper sources like European Union related websites, independent and the actual website they were talking about.

PRO failed to define their terms and then forfeited a round which goes against debate ethics, CON defined their terms and properly made arguments the whole time, not forfeited any round.

Criterion
Pro
Tie
Con
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:

There is little debate to be had when a consensus cannot be reached in a critical definition such as fake news. The responsibility to clearly define a term with such myriad meaning falls upon the debate creator and should be done before acceptance so as to provide a fair debating environment. Pros failure in this regard should be regarded as poor conduct. And hence, along with the forfeiture of a round, conduct to to Con.

Criterion
Pro
Tie
Con
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:

https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/1634