Instigator
Points: 14

Should anime be watched in sub instead of dub?

Finished

The voting period has ended

After 2 votes the winner is ...
King_8
Debate details
Publication date
Last update
Category
TV
Time for argument
Three days
Voting system
Open voting
Voting period
One month
Point system
Four points
Rating mode
Rated
Characters per argument
30,000
Points: 11
Description
For the viewers who are unfamiliar with anime, dub means watching anime in English audio with no subtitles, and sub means watching anime in Japanese audio with English subtitles. This will help in your voting decisions. I am on the DUB side (Con), and my opponent is on the SUB side (Pro). I will let my opponent make their first argument.
Round 1
Published:
Hey Ralph, thanks for taking up the debate. Hopefully I learn something from this, so enlighten me on your side as well. 

Opening arguments:
This seems to be an ongoing issue/debate that will never end. I'm going to give my ultimate take on it. Looking at every aspect down to the last detail. Hopefully this opens up someone's eyes, especially someone who is a sub only person and who is anti-dub. I grew up watching Naruto in dub, that was my first anime that I officially got into. On Toonami, they showed Naruto in English. So naturally, every other anime I watched was in English since it is my native language. Just as I watch anime in English, for me, it is no different for movies or regular TV shows. For example, a sitcom. If you are going to a movie theater, the movie will be in English, right? Well for me, anime is no different. I'm watching it in English, simply put.

Theory: 
Please correct me if I'm wrong: There are people who grew up watching anime in dub (like myself) so they will be used to it and naturally watch other anime in dub. The same goes for people who may have grew up watching anime in sub so of course they are going to be used to it as well. If they watch an anime in dub they are going to feel weird watching it and it won't feel right or normal. My theory leads up to these two points.

1. I never understood the whole "Dub is so bad" or "Dub is trash" I can't fathom my head around it because how could someone say something like that especially if it's your native language? Meaning a language that you speak and understand? How does it not resonate with people? I have watched pretty much everything in dub, and they sound fine to me. So what sounds good to me, may sound bad to a person who prefers sub. (Is that right?) Since that's all I watch.

2. The golden question: "Sub vs Dub, which do you prefer?" It was never a preference for me. How is preference even being brought up? I speak English so I'm going to watch any form of entertainment in English. People who are sub only AND bashes people who watch dub act like it's so taboo to watch something that's in your native language. I also never understood the "dub ruins the experience" thing. I connect with characters more emotionally in English since I can comprehend what's being said.

Elaboration:
I feel like you shouldn't watch it in sub just because it's anime and written by Japanese people. Someone once told me that I'm not a real anime fan if I watch anime dubbed instead subbed, which I find ridiculous. Let people like what they like whether it be sub or dub. Even sub bias people and people who are strictly sub admit that there are great dubs out there that excel their original/sub counterparts. Some people for the most part love to say dub is bad just to say it, just to hate and to ride this hate train it seems. It's a shame how I'm even hesitant of telling people that I watch dub because they will more than likely overreact as if it's the end of the world just because they watch sub. Just as people say dubs are bad, there are also bad subs. For example I've heard from many people that they don't like the main character's Japanese voice from Black Clover at all.

I do watch sub. I'm used to it and I have to deal with it since I have no other choice. Overall I've seen 30+ anime and 99% of them I've seen in dub of course. The only series I've seen in sub are: Food wars, Attack on Titan S3, Inuyashiki, Boruto, Sword Art Online S3, I finished the rest of Naruto Shippuden in sub, and I'm watching One piece in sub (up to date). I watched Naruto & One piece dubbed mostly, But I reached up to date for them in dub so I switched to the sub since dub updates take forever. I'm now watching One punch man S2 in sub. I wanted to wait for the dub to drop but it's taking too long. I'm glad I started watching it, it's breathtaking right now. I do give credit where credit is due. The voice actors are good so I understand people who prefer sub. Even so, sub is still annoying.

If it's a long running series such as Naruto, One piece, Hunter x Hunter, Fairy Tail or Bleach I'm definitely not watching it in sub. I'd rather watch a short series that's 12 or 24 episodes long in sub, since it's not an abundant amount of episodes. If a short series is amazing and one that's been recommended to me which happens to be a sub-only series, then I'll watch it. Again, as you can tell I only watch sub if I have no other choice which means 1. There is no dub version of the series at all. 2. I've reached up to date in dub, and I switch to sub since dub updates take literally forever to come. 3. The dub version of a new season of an anime or a whole new anime hasn't dropped yet since the sub is superior. For ex. One punch man S2 -- I have no clue when the dub will drop but I already know it might take a long time. So, I'm watching the sub because of the hype and I couldn't wait, and I'll re-watch it in dub. If a series has both sub and dub options then I'm going with dub.

To conclude, more respect should be shown for dub and it shouldn't be so condemned and looked down upon just because people watch it.

Next round I will respond to your rebuttals and I will list the other half of my argument which will be me naming the Cons for sub (as to why I am a dub person)









Published:
I'm going to approach this intuitively. 


Ultimately, the answer to this question is subjective.  That means there are a few key ways to approach it.  


1.  Collective subjective.   

This is not an argument but rather a methodology.  We can pull ad populum preferences out of the system and asses the base subjective reasons that people judge anime.  

This would be where we get the "if' to our "ought"  so to speak.  


2.  Arbitrary standards. 

This follows from the first method.  We basically take the subjective standards for the anime and judge them objectively.   This is where we will differ because we will take on different axioms in terms of anime watching. 


3.  Non arbitrary standards.  

This is where we judge the very act of watching anime in an apathetic and analytic fashion.  As far as I can tell, there is no way to draw a conclusion from this besides "it's subjective"  If I'm being technical, this fails specifically because of Hume's Guillotine.



Conclusion

We need to hash out the standards. 



So let's do that. 



I would say that ability to comprehend the anime is key.  I would argue that sub is better for this, because it allows you to draw upon the tone of actual Japanese voice actors.  In contrast, the dub voice actors must draw from translated or sometimes retranslated scripts that do not carry the same context.  This means that the voice actor might not have the same emotion in their voice that was suppose to be in the original.  Furthermore, the Japanese actors are drawing from the original script and have a director to tell them what they are suppose to feel.  This means that the dub voice actor will generally fair better in delivering good comprehension. 


Storyline preservation is next up for me.  I feel like the dub needs to match the original story line as much as possible.  This boils down to politics to some extent. Dubs that get filtered into America sometimes get censored or storylines get changed to get better ratings.  Yugioh and pokemon are good examples of this.  Yugioh got targeted for censorship because some people thought it had satanic messages in it.  pokemon had this as well and also had sexual connotations that were taken out, although these cases were more rare.  


I think any argument beyond this would be a matter of preference.  






Round 2
Published:
Thanks for the response. Based off your argument, I would like you to respond to each of my points and choose whether it's subjective (based off personal feelings/opinions) or objective (facts). Feel free to rebuttal each point if need be.

Cons of sub and why am I a dub person. I will demonstrate how the cons outweigh the pros for sub. 

1. Dub is simply easier to watch. I like watching anime and knowing what is being said at the same time, rather than having to keep looking down to read. I don't want to read while being entertained. At times, you tend to miss out on the visuals (for example, a series with lots of action will have intense fight scenes) I'm a visual person, I like to just focus on the art style and animation. Although I am a fast reader and everything, sub can still be annoying.

2. Sometimes the subtitles can pop up and disappear TOO fast, so you'd either have to pause or rewind to read what you missed which is annoying. Even if you are a fast reader, the subs can pop up for about 1 second and it's a very long sentence which isn't enough time to read. I notice that they do that sometimes. A minor error I suppose. 

3. It's a pain if two characters are talking at the same time and two different subtitles display on the screen representing what each character is saying. Reading two subtitles at the same time isn't the easiest thing to do, it gets confusing so you may have to stop and read them which for me personally throws me for a loop. Especially if it's two character that you aren't familiar with. Japanese voices in more than one character sometimes sound the same and it's hard to differentiate. Example, two female characters with really high pitch voices.

4. This may not be a big issue but there are typos sometimes. Simple typos, Yes - where you will still know what the word is but even so, I like things neat and in order and I have OCD, so a typo tends to slightly throw me off and annoy me a bit.

5. This isn't a big issue as well but subtitles may not show up while a character is talking. A rare case I assume because I haven't seen it happen at all, but I witnessed it happen first hand, particularly in One Piece. I don't know the exact episode but it happened during the Dressrosa arc. Once that moment happened, I assume what the character was saying or what they were talking about given the dialogue beforehand. Even so that throws me off and it could very well throw other people off as well. Some more than others but nevertheless. Yes, I know and understand that mistakes happen, but still.

6. Translations can (sometimes) suck compared to the dub. There are many cases and examples, Specifically in Naruto part 1. I won't go into each and every example as I don't remember them but even Shikamaru's "what a drag" in the sub initially turns into "utterly bothersome" I remember seeing that the very first time Shikamaru says that. Shikamaru's "what a drag" is more iconic. The more he said "what a drag" in the sub, it eventually turned into what a drag, but that just shows how dull the translations are.

7. What's said in the dub can sometimes be clearer, funnier and overall just sounds better than in the sub. Prime example, on Attack on Titan season 3 episode 11, Sasha told a guy at the table about a girl liking him: "Because she is a thirsty girl and she thinks you're a tall glass of water. " in the dub, whereas in the sub she says "Why? 'Cuz you two are. . . You know?". Now which one is funnier? That's my point right there. That was dull and boring compared to what she said in the dub.

One could argue that you can get used to sub, by just watching and reading the subtitles will become second nature and you won't even realize you're reading, but even still. It can be too much of a hassle. Not everyone can multitask or do something like that so easily. I watch sub and I'm used to it since I have no other choice but to watch but I don't find it fun to watch. 

Those are the reasons why I never find the enjoyment or the appeal to sub. I'm in no way shape or form bashing sub or bashing people who watch sub at all. I'm just a dub person overall.

And can you answer my theory: "Please correct me if I'm wrong: There are people who grew up watching anime in dub (like myself) so they will be used to it and naturally watch other anime in dub. The same goes for people who may have grew up watching anime in sub so of course they are going to be used to it as well. If they watch an anime in dub they are going to feel weird watching it and it won't feel right or normal."

I really want to know what you think about that. I've always wondered about if that's true or not for a really long time. Maybe you could confirm if it is or not. If you are unsure, then let me know. 




Published:
I will rebut the points that I found compelling. 


1. Dub is simply easier to watch.
It's easier to watch for you.  I would even agree that it's easier for most people. But the fact that we're even geeky enough to have this debate means that we're on in the average category of anime watchers.  This wouldn't even be a debate for the casual watcher.   I would say that it's closer to 50/50. 

Semantically speaking, Japanese people would find sub easier to watch.  small point, but made it just for fun. 

5. This isn't a big issue as well but subtitles may not show up while a character is talking.
This definitely happens a lot of fringe anime but is not a problem on a large scale.  I do concede this advantage to dub though. 


6. Translations can (sometimes) suck compared to the dub.
I anticipate and lightly addressed this argument in my last statement.  The audio translations are not any better than the subtitles.  If we're being technical, the subtitles tend to be more accurate.  Using your Naruto example.  The phrase "what a drag" was not a direct translation, but rather something that was put in to replace the more boring phrase as you put it.  An anime purist, which I am not, would be vehemently against this.  I, as a linguistics enthusiast, would say that the Japanese phrasing is entertaining in it's own right. 

7. What's said in the dub can sometimes be clearer, funnier and overall just sounds better than in the sub.
That's a category error.  A sound cannot sound better than a word.  You should be comparing the Japanese sounds made, which I find quite entertaining.  This actually lets me shamelessly plug a point I wanted to bring up.  After watching enough Sub, one is able to pick out certain phrases and tones to draw context from the anime.  This context does not always transfer over to the dub which is why dub anime is notoriously unemotional and it's also one reason why people say anime is generic and cookie cutter sometimes.  

And can you answer my theory: "Please correct me if I'm wrong: There are people who grew up watching anime in dub (like myself) so they will be used to it and naturally watch other anime in dub. The same goes for people who may have grew up watching anime in sub so of course they are going to be used to it as well. If they watch an anime in dub they are going to feel weird watching it and it won't feel right or normal."
So this might just be because I'm old, but everyone my age grew up watching dub because there was no internet (or later on, no good internet) to get any sub.  Every anime either came from a VCR tape.(Those black plastic rectangles with white wheels in them that your parents gave you as legos as a kid.)  or on Cable. (This thing that was like Netflix mixed with a car radio.) So I actually went from watching Dub to Sub quite easily.  Which brings me to my next point. 


Watching dub is nice because you get to be ahead on the story line.  Sometimes months ahead.  This is actually the reason I started watching sub.  
Round 3
Published:
"But the fact that we're even geeky enough to have this debate means that we're on in the average category of anime watchers."
Aren't dubs easier to watch for you too? I mean, I'm sure they are. One could argue that some people just love to read. I love reading too but in this specific format in entertainment? Distracting, I'd rather focus on the screen alone, like any other show or movie that isn't anime. By "average category of anime watchers" do you mean the people who watch sub and understands the essence of it? If so, I agree with that. I am aware that people who are experienced anime watchers who've seen tons of anime are more than likely sub watchers. There are also the ones who watch both sub and dub. It's rare to find someone who is a dubber. I guess I fit in that category. Also, people who are new to anime and getting into it for the first time tend lean to dub for obvious reasons. 

"Japanese people would find sub easier to watch."
This helps my argument. If this wasn't meant to help, then explain. Just as Japanese people would find sub easier to watch, American people/people who speak English would find dub easier to watch. You don't see Japanese people watching dub anime with Japanese subtitles and praising it, while disliking sub anime. I know this may or may not make sense to you or the people viewing the debate since anime originated from Japan, so it probably wouldn't make any sense that a Japanese person would watch a dub anime rather than sub (Japanese audio which is their language), but the statement you made suggests that a Japanese person could possibly watch dub anime and perhaps hypothetically enjoy it more than sub.

I did notice that you said "Semantically speaking", so I think you were joking? If I took it too serious, then sorry. Enlighten me. 

Translations

I'm unsure if you seen Death note, but I will use it as my example here. I will use these two phrases that are closely similar. Pick which one you think is slightly better. I won't even say which is sub and which is dub. After you either choose phrase 1 or phrase 2, I will reveal to you in the next round which is which, and explain translations being a bit better (at times) not all of the time.

The character L, says this:
1. "I have to sit like this."
2. "It's not like I want to sit like this."
Two sentences that mean the same thing, but the wording is a little different. Which phrase do you like better? This might be pretty easy for you to guess which is sub and dub, so feel free to choose in the next round if you'd like. I'll keep what you said, "not a direct translation, but rather something that was put in to replace the more boring phrase as you put it." in mind for the next round.

Sound

From my experience in the anime community, I've come across many people (mainly sub watchers of course) who admit that Death note in the dub is great and is done very well. Some even preferring the dub version over the sub.
Another example, L's scream was much better in the dub than in the sub. Check them both out and compare. 
In the dub, you can hear the fear and terror in his voice, he was actually frightened.
In the sub, there was an initial yell, but he mostly gasped and it was just silent. There was barely any work put into that.
I'd say between those two, the dub was better and more compelling. 

One could argue that "most subs are superior (I hate the superior argument) and they convey emotion better" but this scene alone shows that dubs can be just as good if not better, and they should be respected more. As time passes, I notice people are starting to appreciate dubs.


"A sound cannot sound better than a word.  You should be comparing the Japanese sounds made, which I find quite entertaining." 
A word cannot be better than a sound. Which in turn sums up my whole argument. Dub in my book displays the importance of sound and the words being said, which are one in the same, since there are no subtitles being shown. By your logic, sound is better than a word since, from my understanding. sub watchers value the voices of the characters the most. This means that the voices will overshadow the words. Realistically speaking, reading words on a screen isn't a wow factor, they don't hold much weight and they aren't the source of entertainment. Yeah you need the words to help you understand what's being said, but the voices of the characters are the main entertainment. But let's briefly compare sounds made in the sub and the dub. I do admit, the sounds made from characters in Japanese are pretty good but in English, it can be just as good. Another thing, Japanese VA's can be way too over the top and annoying, sometimes hurting my ears. It's like there is screeching at time to time.

Another reason I connect more with dub is that I can actually hear the emphasis and sarcasm in character's voices. You can't really hear that from sub, which ruins the fun of it. Yes, there's italics in the subtitles representing an emphasis but like I said, it doesn't hold much weight. This proves that a word is not better than a sound. What I take from this is that watching sub lowers the importance of the actual words you understand and you can become misguided with the Japanese voices and get confused without even knowing it.  

"Watching dub is nice because you get to be ahead on the story line.  Sometimes months ahead.  This is actually the reason I started watching sub."
Did you mean to say watching *sub? I'm sure you did. But yeah, I agree with you on that all the way. That's the only advantage of sub to me. You get to be ahead and up to date on everything, like for One punch man S2 I wanted to wait for the dub so bad, but because of the hype I went ahead and watched the sub unfortunately, but nevertheless S2 is amazing. However, I watched One punch mean season 1 in dub and I was used to it. Oh well. 

Published:
They might be easier to watch for me.  Ease isn't really my standard.  In fact.  I prefer a challenge.  You speak about entertainment being a bad medium for reading.  What if studying is entertaining for me?  I mean, we are on a debate site, lol. 

When I say average anime watchers, I wasn't implying that anime watchers would necessarily watch sub more.  My point is we don't ask who watches what.  We ask what are they trying to get out of it. 

I think most English people will be dubbers.  If we're being technical, every Japanese fan is a dubber.  Just throwing that out there.  Japanese voices are still dubs because they're being superimposed over images. 


Well it supports that Japanese people would do better understanding the language.  But not specifically for sub.  There's two way we can divide this and we need to pick one.  We either say "sub is sub and dub is dub" and in that case.  The Japanese are watching subs so it supports me.  If we say "dub and sub are relative to the watcher"  Then we tie on that point because I can espouse sub for English and sub for japs and you can do the same with dub, but in this case we muddy the waters for other points.  So how are we doing this? 


On the translation point.  I'm assuming the second one is sub because it seems counter intuitive to how an English person would say it.  But I can understand both just fine.  Depending on the context, I could make the English one sound just as strange.  What if he says "I have to sit like this"  but in the context, he's saying "I have to" in the sense of he feels like he has to because it helps him focus.  In that case, the Japanese translation works better because he doesn't literally have to.  Either way.  It's not about intelligibility for me personally.  for me it's about appreciating linguistics.  This is of course subjective.  Love me some death note either. 

Incidentally, I would probably prefer death note dubbed because I watched it before switching to sub and I'm used to the voices in that case.  Also.  I don't invariably choose subbed.  I will generally pick dubbed unless I really want to enjoy the anime.  If I'm just browsing it to see if it's good.  I'll go dub and then maybe switch to sub on a rewatch if it happens. 



Good, so we're in agreement that a word and a sound can't be called better or worse.  That's win/win for us. 


You mention voice emphasis.  this is funny because I would make this argument from my side.  You only hear the English emphasis that the voice actor inserted.  I get to hear the Japanese voice emphasis and get to hear what the mangakai wanted me to hear.  (if it was not manga based, then the director instead of the mangakai )
Round 4
Published:
"You speak about entertainment being a bad medium for reading.  What if studying is entertaining for me? I mean, we are on a debate site, lol." 
You have a point. For me, it just depends on the circumstances. Reading debates are entertaining but I wouldn't want to read while watching something at the same time.

"Well it supports that Japanese people would do better understanding the language.  But not specifically for sub.  There's two way we can divide this and we need to pick one.  We either say "sub is sub and dub is dub" and in that case.  The Japanese are watching subs so it supports me.  If we say "dub and sub are relative to the watcher"  Then we tie on that point because I can espouse sub for English and sub for japs and you can do the same with dub, but in this case we muddy the waters for other points.  So how are we doing this?"
All of this confused me, I'll take it in the best way I can. I'm on the side of "sub is sub and dub is dub" Japanese people are watching sub because it's easier for them, which would support the point of Americans watching dub making it easier for them. If I'm going in the wrong direction, then guide me and explain further.

Translations

 "I'm assuming the second one is sub because it seems counter intuitive to how an English person would say it."
1. "I have to sit like this." - Sub version.
2. "It's not like I want to sit like this." - Dub version.
The second one is actually the dub one. The first one is sub. Your point: What if he says "I have to sit like this"  but in the context, he's saying "I have to" in the sense of he feels like he has to because it helps him focus.  In that case, the Japanese translation works better because he doesn't literally have to. -- is exactly how I feel.  In other words, the English translation works better because he doesn't literally have to. I like phrase 2 better than phrase 1. I think we can both agree that, "I have to sit like this." is more forced and boring compared to the other phrase. "It's not like I want to sit like this" is better because it has a slight comedic tone to it and like you said, it shows the option that L could sit normally but it just wouldn't work because his deductive reasoning would drop. 

Word and sound

Understood. I'll tie this into the translation point. I probably should have kept this simple and made this point earlier, so let's scratch the word/sound thing. When I said, "What's said in the dub can sometimes be clearer, funnier and overall just sounds better than in the sub." I probably should have just said "the translations are much better". Like the AOT example, the words that were said in the dub was much better than what was translated in the sub, not the actual sound of the character's voice. The voice is good and it was hilarious but it was the actual translation that wasn't all that compared to the dub. Especially me watching both the sub and dub version of the episode. 

Published:
Well my point with the sub is sub / dub is dub thing is that subs in this case are meant for the person who can't understand the dubbing.  Technically.  The Japanese watch dubs because there are no subtitles and they're listening to a dub of the original voice actor.  


On translation, My point is mostly that anything can be said more than one way and whether or not it fits depends on the language it is being implied in and the context of the situation.  Sometimes, the Japanese one won't fit so well, but that could also be in part because it's responding to another mistranslated dub in the first place. Plus the translation is never going to be 100 percent right because, of course, Japanese does not have the same grammar flow that we have.  We use VSO and I think they us OVS. 

That's mostly the extent of my contention.  I think we've covered everything that is relevant.  I'll just extent my previous arguments and call this a wrap.  
Round 5
Published:
Alright. Last round will be our brief closing arguments anyways, since we've dwindled down and have reached some common ground along the way. 

Subs in this case are meant for the person who can't understand the dubbing. 
Is this the case for Japanese people or American people? Or both. For Japanese people, that would make a lot of sense. For English people, that wouldn't make sense since that person speaks English so they would understand the dub since they know what's being said. Unless, by "can't understand the dub" you mean not understanding or resonating with the voices but connecting more with the Japanese people? If so, then alright. 

Technically.  The Japanese watch dubs because there are no subtitles and they're listening to a dub of the original voice actor.
Define Japanese dub/original. 
Is it called "sub" or could it also be called "dub"? Because what I got from that statement is how can a Japanese person watch dub (Eng. audio) they don't understand English. Unless you are talking about a Japanese person watching the original meaning Japanese audio with no subtitles? Is that possible? Sorry if I confused you. I was confused on these points. Hope to get some clarification so I understand. It's good to learn more about this. 

 We use VSO and I think they us OVS. 
What are VSOs and OVS?

In closing: 

Dub is better to me because as I said, I dislike watching anime while dealing with the subtitles. I'd like to focus just on the anime especially if there is a lot of action or fights. It's much more convenient. I connect more with what the characters are saying because I know what's being said. All of my points in R2 still stand, those are all of the reasons. 

Thanks for the debate. I never debate with my friends, in fact I don't like it because it could get heated, an argument might erupt and it's just awkward. I know you and I'm familiar with you so I didn't expect it you to accept this but nevertheless I'm glad this went well.

May the best person win.
Published:
It's both respectively.  English people watch engilsh dubs.  and Japanese people watching Japanese dubs. 


No, the version that the Japanese watch is not called subs because it doesn't have subtitles.  It only has voice dubbing just like English versions.  The only difference is the language that is being dubbed. 


VSO is an acronym used in linguistics for Verb, Subject, Object.  The arrangement of the acronym tells you have that language generally arranges their sentences. 



I'll land this plane gently a just reiterate to the voters that the answer to this is ultimately subjective and if I'm not mistaken, my opponent agrees.  This is going to have to come down to what the voters think are the best standards for judging the preferability of each side. 


Good Debate. 
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Instigator
#15
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--> @Virtuoso
Understood
Instigator
#14
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--> @King_8
Hey sorry for the delayed response. I'm not calling it a troll vote rather I am clarifying that this is not a troll debate. A troll debate is any (a) competition-style debate (e.g. rap battle, talent show, poetry competition), (b) debate primarily designed to be humorous or facetious or containing primarily humorous or facetious content, and (c) debate on a truism (e.g. "a bachelor is someone who is unmarried"). Votes on troll debates are not moderated. I am clarifying there that votes are moderated and this does not qualifty as a troll debate.
#13
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Instigator
#12
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Instigator
#11
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--> @Virtuoso
I don't even see how he picked Pro for sources when none of us provided any sources, so it should have been tied. Well, in my R3 all I did was provide youtube links and that was it, nothing serious. Probably would have been more accurate if he picked Pro for better arguments from looking at his RFD. May not have been the best vote, but how was it a troll vote?
Anyways, I hope more people vote.
Instigator
#10
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--> @RationalMadman
If there ever was an objective vote in this universe, that was it.
Contender
#9
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--> @K_Michael
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Vote Reported: K_Michael // Mod Action: Removed
Points awarded: 3 to pro for sources
RFD: I believe that the lost in translation argument by Pro is superior. The English-speaking voice actors won't necessarily carry the intended tone of voice.
Reason for mod action: This is not a troll debate and as such all votes are moderated. The arguments are not explained.
In order to award argument points, a voter must explicitly, and in the text of their RFD, perform the following tasks:

Survey the main arguments and counterarguments presented in the debate
Weigh those arguments against each other (or explain why certain arguments need not be weighed based on what transpired within the debate itself)
Explain how, through the process of weighing, they arrived at their voting decision with regard to assigning argument points
Weighing entails analyzing how the relative strength of one argument or set of arguments outweighed (that is, out-impacted) and/or precluded another argument or set of arguments. Weighing requires analyzing and situating arguments and counterarguments within the context of the debate as a whole.
The voter does none fo this.
The voter should review the COC here: https://www.debateart.com/rules
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#8
Added:
--> @King_8
You'll adjust quickly. You don't have to go off my arguments, you can just imagine my possible arguments and go off those.
Contender
#7
Added:
--> @Wrick-It-Ralph
Damn, I was planning to let Pro make their argument first, so I have something to go on and respond to. Apparently when someone accepts my debate, I must go first. I guess I can't do acceptance rounds, I'm used to DDO. (I guess you can't make a R1 argument and then put up your debate for people to accept, because in DDO you put in your argument when you make a debate, but here you can't do that) I'll just go ahead and make my first argument. I'll use half of my argument in R1, and then you come with your opening arguments and respond to mine, and in R2 I will use the other half of my argument so it won't be overbearing since I have long argument.
Still new to this site so I'm still slightly confused on some things.
Instigator
#6
Added:
--> @Club
I can't stand watching AOT dubbed because I'm so used to their Japanese voices. In particular, Hanji and Armin sound awful in English.
Contender
#5
Added:
--> @King_8
Finally! Something I can apply my collective subjective argument too. Shameless spoilers. Since this is an anime debate, I'm going to add some ass pull and say that I'll make an "unreasonable comeback". ;)
Contender
#4
Added:
I take the side that to each their own.
#3
Added:
--> @K_Michael
Yeah same, sometimes the voice actors sound so different and don't fit the character, I end up hating it.
#2
Added:
I prefer sub, but not enough to debate you. Dub is fine if the voice actors fit my picture of the character.
Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood gives Edward Elric a really annoying voice in the dubbed version.
#1
#2
Criterion Con Tie Pro Points
Better arguments 3 points
Better sources 2 points
Better spelling and grammar 1 point
Better conduct 1 point
Reason:
There’s not a lot here for me to vote on.
The biggest and most compelling argument is that dub is much easier and less distracting. This seems a pretty obvious and straightforward case.
Pro doesn’t really deny this - and agrees but specifies that ease is not part of his standard.
The translation is not a compelling argument for me - I can’t see how a translator would come up with a different translation when preparing for sub/dub.
Sound, seems mostly to be depending on which example. Con uses an example of Death note where the dub provides a better context and emotion than the sub did. While this suffers from much the same issue as the issue with translation (it could be either good or bad), the same goes for the reverse case pro raised that things are lost in the original voices
The technical benefits here raised by both don’t seem massively compelling, so I’m left to cons main case of being simpler to watch. Con spells our very well the key issues here related to easy; pro didn’t do enough to spell out the technical benefits of watching subtitles despite it being harder to follow, thus does not overturn ease for me.
As a result, the only one with a key positive case is con: arguments to con.
#1
Criterion Con Tie Pro Points
Better arguments 3 points
Better sources 2 points
Better spelling and grammar 1 point
Better conduct 1 point
Reason:
This literally was a tied debate. One side said that anime and language is about expressing things vocally (Con) while Pro retorted that it was about comprehending tone of voice but more importantly the advantages of staying ahead and as authentic to the series as is possible.
In other words, both sides literally said the other side's value system may well be correct, it just isn't to them.