Instigator / Pro
17
1495
rating
47
debates
48.94%
won
Topic
#931

Brandon Stark will be the one who leads Westeros at the end of episode 6

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
3
12
Better sources
6
8
Better legibility
4
4
Better conduct
4
3

After 4 votes and with 10 points ahead, the winner is...

Barney
Tags
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
3
Time for argument
Three days
Max argument characters
30,000
Voting period
One week
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
27
1810
rating
49
debates
100.0%
won
Description

No information

Someone came out with a GoT extended ending, and while intended as comedy, I'd say it's a nice improvement! https://twitter.com/FoldableHuman/status/1130581319593783296

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@Death23
@oromagi
@Pinkfreud08

Thanks for voting.

Note: I have zero objections to any of the votes cast.

At the top of my second half of RFD, I wrote Pro when I meant Con. Particularly confusing at the top of the argument like that. Sorry.

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@Ramshutu
@Death23
@oromagi

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Vote Reported: oromagi, Death23, Ramshutu // Mod Action: Not Removed

Reason for mod action: These votes were found to be sufficient per the site voting policy standards.


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NOTE: GOT SPOILERS HERE

Pro defines terms, establishes clearly which episode 6 he is discussing and continues to complete four solid reasons Bran is not King of anything in Episode 6 (Season 1, ep 6).

Pro calls Season 8, ep 6 in R2 but Pro has the superior responsibility to define terms up front and is given the advantage of the description section to set terms. Pro dropped 3 opportunities (title, description, R1) to clearly define which episode was under discussion. Pro fails to set up the goalposts for the game, even though its Pro's stadium. Con kindly sets up the goalposts so that Pro and Con can play. Pro doesn't get to complain about the goalpost's placement after the game has begun.

Con's deft maneuver leaves Pro beyond the wall in winter, out in the cold.

Sources to CON: Con over-sources stylistically in this debate, improving his authority to lay claim to which ep 6 was discussed. Very nicely done. Pro used no sources to back any claims.

Grammar tied: I'd give grammar to CON for using non sequitur as an adjective alone if I thought the mods would uphold.

Conduct tied: I agree with Pro that Pro's conduct in other debates makes an irrelevant argument but an irrelevant argument is not poor conduct. I considered whether failure to alert readers to spoilers is poor conduct. My rule of thumb is that spoiler alerts are appropriate for one week after tv premiere, two weeks after cinema. Since the argument was essentially a magic trick: a prediction that surprisingly comes true- I think a spoiler alert would have suggested that Pro had real insider info and so ruin the magical effect. I can't really fault Pro for withholding a spoiler alert in this case.

NOTE: GOT SPOILERS HERE

Thanks to Sparrow for another GOT debate & nice job to both debaters for rapid-fire arguments.

Arguments to CON: Loki v. Hulk

By good intuition or good information, Pro accurately predicts that Brandon Stark gets unexpectedly elevated as the new King of six kingdoms. Pro's phrasing of thesis allowed for at least two lines of attack:

not king of all Westeros
poorly specified episode info

Pro anticipated the former and with a little effort might have made a case that while the six kingdoms make less than half of the continent of Westeros, in most contexts Westeros and the seven kingdoms are used somewhat interchangeably. I've seen some maps that would support this argument. Few seem to think of Westeros as beyond the wall and the extent of the continent beyond the wall is unknown.

Pro failed to anticipate the latter even though Con pre-argued in the comments section. Con totally exploited Pro's failure to define terms and Pro's failure to anchor the assertion in proof (even a link to the a scene on youtube here might have given Pro some evidence to defend the intention of "final episode" or "Season 8, episode 6").

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@Ramshutu

Thanks for voting.

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@Death23

In case you're worried about spoilers from episodes 68-73, I have a large warning around the small bit of discussion I give to them.

there's a lot of bad press today, which makes me think I liked it more than most. I think the whole season would have worked much better in the usual season format. Mostly I think this season wanted for the sex and humor of previous seasons. I think King's Landing in winter was about as beautiful a setting as I've ever seen seen in fantasy.

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@Barney

oh no

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@oromagi

I've seen every episode. To include episode 6. I really liked how Bran met Osha as an enemy, but they were destined to be allies.

Debate title is a spoiler. Gotta watch things when they come out because the world is polluted with spoilers.

Who else has watched it all now?

SPOILER ALERT: Bran the Broken is not the leader of all Westeros at the end of GOT