How many gods does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

Author: secularmerlin

Posts

Total: 114
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
This is not a joke. I have never seen or heard of any god(s) that have accomplished this feet. To be clear I am not talking about acting through or influencing a mortal agency. I mean physically screwing in a lightbulb for themselves.

Especially if you consider your god maximally powerful or as a creator of the universe. Such a being should find any task I can accomplish child's play and yet no god(s) seem to ever have such a simple, direct and above all physical effect on any observable part of our world.

Do you believe that any god(s) are capable of screwing in a lightbulb and if so what keeps them from doing so?
Castin
Castin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 2,219
3
2
7
Castin's avatar
Castin
3
2
7
Atheists are often heard saying that a human-centric view of the universe is arrogant. That it is vain to think some vast cosmic being is interested in our tiny doings. Why then should we turn around and ask why this vast cosmic being has never performed a trick purely for our benefit?
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@Castin
The lightbulb is just a placeholder for any discernable physical effect whatever. Many things have observable physical effects that are not for my benefit.

So far as I can tell I have never observed any god(s) doing anything. Certainly nothing that I could not think of another perfectly reasonable explanation for.

How do we identify the difference between those things which exist and those which do not if not by the physical effect it has on our universe?

Honestly even then our universe could simply be an illussion.
SkepticalOne
SkepticalOne's avatar
Debates: 9
Posts: 1,720
3
3
7
SkepticalOne's avatar
SkepticalOne
3
3
7
-->
@secularmerlin
I don't know how many gods are required, but you can be sure there will be at least one human involved. :-P


secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@SkepticalOne
In that case I don't think any god(s) necessarily involved.
vagabond
vagabond's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 277
0
1
3
vagabond's avatar
vagabond
0
1
3
-->
@secularmerlin
I think there are demarcation considerations, for instance I don't think Mesoamerican gods have an adequate knowledge of threads even if they have a rudimentary understanding of electricity. Just sayin'.
Polytheist-Witch
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 4,188
3
3
6
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Polytheist-Witch
3
3
6
Trollin', Trollin', Trollin'. 
janesix
janesix's avatar
Debates: 12
Posts: 2,049
3
3
3
janesix's avatar
janesix
3
3
3
-->
@secularmerlin
How do you know they haven't?They could be doin sht all the time.
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@janesix
Perhaps they do. Perhaps it is a god that hides people's car keys but I have never spoken with anyone who claimed a being they knew was a god did something as fundamentalmy physical as that within their observation.
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@Polytheist-Witch
This is a serious question and not meant as a jab, though of course you are under no obligation to answer whether you have an answer or not.
Polytheist-Witch
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 4,188
3
3
6
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Polytheist-Witch
3
3
6
-->
@secularmerlin
Bull. 
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@Polytheist-Witch
I would be happy to hear suggestions for how the question should have been worded. Honestly screw in a lightbulb is just a placeholder for any observable physical act.
SkepticalOne
SkepticalOne's avatar
Debates: 9
Posts: 1,720
3
3
7
SkepticalOne's avatar
SkepticalOne
3
3
7
-->
@secularmerlin
In that case I don't think any god(s) necessarily involved

Agreed.

ravensjt
ravensjt's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 123
0
1
5
ravensjt's avatar
ravensjt
0
1
5
-->
@secularmerlin
This is a serious question and not meant as a jab, though of course you are under no obligation to answer whether you have an answer or not.


There was an interesting thread in another forum about the origins of the Universe and whether something can come from nothing....

I find it interesting that some Atheists can believe thats possible but a Being that powers far surpass ours (to the point of being considered "God(s)" is impossible





secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@ravensjt
I do not claim to have evidence for or against the idea that some god(s) exist. This thread is merely asking about god claims of a particular nature.
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 555
Posts: 19,351
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@secularmerlin
Just to be clear, the mastermind or leader of a crime organisation isn't guilty unless it was done at their physical hand according to you?
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@RationalMadman
Just to be clear this has nothing to do with the op.
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 555
Posts: 19,351
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@secularmerlin
It does.
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@RationalMadman
Ok what does this have to do with some god(s) being able and willing to personally screw in a lightbulb for themselves without the intervention of mortals?
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 555
Posts: 19,351
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@secularmerlin
You seem to think 'screwing' requires a hand at all. The God can 'screw' simply through wanting it to turn.

secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@RationalMadman
I have never observed a lightbulb to be screwed in by such means have you?
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 555
Posts: 19,351
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@secularmerlin
If I had you'd call me mentally ill and if I haven't you'll say that OP is true.

You keep making debates that are either intentionally wrong to prod at people and provoke them or are the result of shallow thinking, I'm still unsure which. I like to give you the benefit of the doubt and hope you're a high IQ satirist playing a low IQ atheist.
ravensjt
ravensjt's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 123
0
1
5
ravensjt's avatar
ravensjt
0
1
5
-->
@secularmerlin
I do not claim to have evidence for or against the idea that some god(s) exist. This thread is merely asking about god claims of a particular nature.

You know I'm not making reference to you specifically Bro although my premise is still sound.

I still wonder though that as vast as the Universe is, how could someone logically discount that such an being could exist


secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@RationalMadman
As I said before on another thread I am not qualified to diagnose mental illness. My first question if ypur claim is that you have seen a lightbulb screwed in directly by a god without the intervention of a mortal would actually be "How do you know that no mortals were involved?"
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@ravensjt
Discount is perhaps a strong term. Better to say I see no reason to believe in such a being.
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 555
Posts: 19,351
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@secularmerlin
My argument wasn't that I'd seen it, it was on your inability to comprehend that the mortal is nothing more than an unnecessary tool to the God if it does use the mortal's hand.
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@RationalMadman
In that case how do we determine the difference between a god acting through or influencing a mortal agency and the mortal agency just deciding to screw in a lightbulb? Also, and I am sorry to have to keep reminding you, the op specifically excludes god(s) influencing mortals and focuses on gods getting off their god butts and doings things for themselves.
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 555
Posts: 19,351
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@secularmerlin
Please read my mafia boss retort to your entire concept. The god can do things via other entities and they are the vessel of God's will.

secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@RationalMadman
Perhaps but that is not the subject of the op. 
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 555
Posts: 19,351
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@secularmerlin
Is your issue that God doesn't have a 3d physical body to screw the bulb in with?