The user Alec is a very clever debater.

Author: RationalMadman

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Alec is much more skilled than I first anticipated. He simply wasn't trying. I have seen in a couple of his latest debates a side to him I didn't know was there.

He is a very powerful persuader who actually comes up with arguments of his own accord and assimilation of facts. This both makes him a good liar and a good spreader of truth, that part is up to him.

It is very impressive to see.


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I wonder if you call out a compliment thread if it gets locked.

27 days later

Alec
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Thank you for the compliment.

19 days later

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you're very welcome

325 days later

Alec
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He is a very powerful persuader who actually comes up with arguments of his own accord and assimilation of facts. 
I noticed the same thing in myself.

 This both makes him a good liar and a good spreader of truth, that part is up to him.
I don't lie, but I try and spread ideas that I think are good.
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@Alec
but I try and spread ideas that I think are good.
Like what? 
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@TheRealNihilist
Like how to eliminate the debt and how to punish murderers and rapists in a utilitarian way that saves more people than UHC.
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@Alec
Like how to eliminate the debt
Hasn't literally everyone on this site disagreed with you on your way of removing the debt?
punish murderers and rapists in a utilitarian way that saves more people than UHC.
Do you have an example?


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@TheRealNihilist
Hasn't literally everyone on this site disagreed with you on your way of removing the debt?
Not true.  Someone called it genius.

Do you have an example?
Make them give blood every 2 months to save about as many people as UHC would without modifying the economy.
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@Alec
Not true.  Someone called it genius.
Who?
Make them give blood every 2 months to save about as many people as UHC would without modifying the economy.
1) Proof?
2) How many politicians are support this? 
3) I'm guessing you have no source to provide this or your saying since giving blood save lives the other lives don't matter because of utilitarianism, not to mention you are reducing the value of a human life making dependent on how many are alike that person.   
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@TheRealNihilist
Who?
The Dynamic Squid.

How many politicians are support this? 
I think every politician who supports the death penalty right now, once they hear this idea, they would support this idea instead.

I'm guessing you have no source to provide this or your saying since giving blood save lives the other lives don't matter because of utilitarianism
The only life that we would be infringing upon are the lives of rapists and murderers, and it's not much either; they just give blood every 2 months in addition to life in jail.

 not to mention you are reducing the value of a human life making dependent on how many are alike that person
Can you rephrase this part since it doesn't make sense?
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@Alec
The Dynamic Squid.
He is banned so I can't ask him why. Did he in the thread give reasons?
I think every politician who supports the death penalty right now, once they hear this idea, they would support this idea instead.
So no one right now.
The only life that we would be infringing upon are the lives of rapists and murderers, and it's not much either; they just give blood every 2 months in addition to life in jail.
Wait this might be a good idea, didn't realize you were getting blood by people who would never be able to be free again but lacks support unless there are politicians who have said anything about this?

I guess the problem I have with this is that what if later on we found out they were innocent but I'm sure the blood donation is not going to kill the person. Another problem I found is that giving a certain date instead of whenever people need blood limits its effectiveness. If a surgery goes bad and you put a 2 month wait on it then it would be less effective than it could be. 
Can you rephrase this part since it doesn't make sense?
You've neglected to mention in your last response that this would be a sort of filling a gap in universal healthcare but it won't. Blood donation will help people with blood related issues. Your replacement to UHC will not help people with heart disease, cancer, asthma, stroke, Alzheimer, diabetes, pneumonia, influenza, kidney disease and suicide  which this site claims to be the leading causes of death in the US.

If it wasn't clear the top 10 leading causes of death in the US will not be helped by gathering blood from people serving life in prison. 

Scrap the value of the human life part I was talking about. I didn't know you were talking about people who were sentenced for life in prison. 

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@TheRealNihilist
I guess the problem I have with this is that what if later on we found out they were innocent but I'm sure the blood donation is not going to kill the person.
If they are innocent, they get freed and paid for the blood we took from them thinking they were guilty.  I'd say $100/day in jail and $2000/pint of blood is a fair reward for the falsely accused once they are proven innocent.

 but I'm sure the blood donation is not going to kill the person.
Blood donation doesn't kill you.

Another problem I found is that giving a certain date instead of whenever people need blood limits its effectiveness.
My plan is the prisons generate the blood and sell it to whichever hospital needs the blood.  If a hospital needs the blood, they contact a prison so the prison can sell them the blood.  Blood can be stored for quite some time, although I forgot how long.

You've neglected to mention in your last response that this would be a sort of filling a gap in universal healthcare but it won't.
It would save a comparable amount of lives to UHC, but they would be different people's lives.  Still, 60,000 lives saved per year by forcing bad felons to give blood every 2 months.  If you need blood to survive in the US, your basically saved under this model.

Scrap the value of the human life part I was talking about. I didn't know you were talking about people who were sentenced for life in prison. 
Ordinary people wouldn't have to give blood unless they want to.  It would only be murderers and rapists that would have to do it.



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@Alec
If they are innocent, they get freed and paid for the blood we took from them thinking they were guilty.  I'd say $100/day in jail and $2000/pint of blood is a fair reward for the falsely accused once they are proven innocent.
I did say you wouldn't want to kill them and the money would be cool but doubtful it would go through unless there is a lot of media presence and protests over someone who is guilty. 
Blood donation doesn't kill you.
I did say this but whatever.
My plan is the prisons generate the blood and sell it to whichever hospital needs the blood.  If a hospital needs the blood, they contact a prison so the prison can sell them the blood.  Blood can be stored for quite some time, although I forgot how long.
Sell? Would this be a private prison?
It would save a comparable amount of lives to UHC, but they would be different people's lives.  Still, 60,000 lives saved per year by forcing bad felons to give blood every 2 months.  If you need blood to survive in the US, your basically saved under this model.
If your 60k number is true it wouldn't even top the 7th highest cause of the death in the US which is diabetes at around 83k in 2017. Your plan would be cool but in no way provides any help to the leading causes of death like I mentioned above.