Iraq?

Author: Dr.Franklin

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Us and Iran are fighting in Iraq, I think they will be ANOTHER proxy war there
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@Dr.Franklin
Iran's a joke to the US

Remember what America did to Japan? Japan only took down like 3 boats, and then they got the Sun dropped on them, twice!

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Did you also see the funny video about Trump in 2011 criticizing Obama for dealing with Iran poorly? It's so funny!

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@DynamicSquid
What was the last war that the yanks won?

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Lets pull out of the entire middle east.
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@Alec
Why?
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@Dr.Franklin
We kill more innocent civilians than ISIS does and it costs so much money.  It's neither pro life nor small government.
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@Alec
so what if we kill some civilians, we make peace
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@Dr.Franklin
so what if we kill some civilians

Bra!  Killing civilians is bad man.  We have been involved with the middle east for 18 years.  We're not making peace anytime soon.  We don't make peace if we're killing more civilians than ISIS.




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@Alec
We did have peace, but Obama fucked it up

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@disgusted
What was the last war that the yanks won?

2016 war on Socialism
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pollywanna can't find a war that the yanks won, oh dear.
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@Dr.Franklin
What planet was that?
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@Dr.Franklin
We didn't make peace. We destabilized a country. We were in Iraq for quite a long time, yet nothing was ever accomplished. America has no reason to govern Iraq, pulling out had to happen sooner or later. 

For all of Saddam Hussein's faults, he kept order and peace in Iraq better than any recent government. 

Iraq wants us gone from their country.

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@disgusted
The last war America won was the Second Gulf War. We lost the following peace, but we did win the war. If you want to count it as a war and if you think it's over, the war against ISIS would be the last war America won.
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@triangle.128k
not if we protect them over Iran
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@Dr.Franklin
Iraq literally voted to expel American troops.
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@Dr.Franklin
Iraq doesn’t want us there. Most Americans don’t want us there. The only people that DO want us there are neo cons/bought liberals and military contractor executives. Don’t you find it weird that supposed scandals occur whenever we try to leave? Like the pixelated video of “Iranians” planting a “bomb” on a ship?
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@bmdrocks21
Iraq doesn’t want us there. Most Americans don’t want us there. The only people that DO want us there are neo cons/bought liberals and military contractor executives. Don’t you find it weird that supposed scandals occur whenever we try to leave? Like the pixelated video of “Iranians” planting a “bomb” on a ship?
Why do some people always keep trying to state rational, logical common sense.

The only business we have in Iraq is war-for-oil.  Oil and war is big business.

War in Iraq was idiots-on-board. War in Iran is idiots-on-board.

Iran will get nuclear weapons, just as USA, Russsia, Pakistan, Israel, India, Fance, N. Korea have them.

The small brain{ dicks } idiots need to get over their infantile obsession with other sovereign countries they dont like. having a nuclear weapon.

Either all nations get rid of their nuclear weapons or all are allowed to add to growing number of nuclear weapons.

Mutually Assured Destruction { M.A.D } is on the rise again and humanity will perhaps suffer the consequences of the idiocy. Only time will humanities future on Earth.



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Iraq was fucked the moment we tried to have the country survive on its own with a Shia/Sunni/Kurdish mix rather then splinter the country into three along sectarian lines..... The only reason it stayed together for as long as it did without internal strife was because Saddam was a big enough of a dickbag to put fear into the hearts of anyone who opposed him, regardless of religious affiliation... Now though with Saddam gone, the three groups just try to vie for as much power as they can get, doing so by fucking over the other two at their earliest convenience. 

Since the US has no desire to force Iraq to remain together indefinitely, and Iran not having any capacity to do so either despite being fucking right next door, Iraq will find its own way to devolve into a shitfest comparable to Somalia..... Corruption, military coups, siphoning off of resources. All the ingredients are there for Iraq to tear itself into pieces and be a no-go zone on travel maps until 2040, its now just a matter of time. 

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@ebuc
War in Iraq was idiots-on-board.
I am 100% against the War in Iraq. However, I don't fault people too much for being in favor of it back in the day. From what I understand, there was a huge propaganda campaign saying Saddam helped plan 9/11, was build WMDs to use(possibly against us), and other related things. Looking back and knowing it was all false, it is easy for me to say it was a bad idea. Back then it probably seemed smart. There was bi-partisan support, I believe. 

That is why I am very skeptical about any info about supposed Iran activity and don't believe it would be a particularly bright idea.
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@bmdrocks21
That is why I am very skeptical about any info about supposed Iran activity and don't believe it would be a particularly bright idea.
Yeah, I see the light bulb going off above your head. Welcome to the rational, logical common sense club.  Very few of us on board Spaceship Earth.
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@bmdrocks21
a bit of a tangent on my part, but this and many other reasons is why I'm extremely skeptical of government and why it just boggles my mind so many want to give them even more control over our lives, healthcare and neutering the 2a are just some prime examples, then when you think back to the speech limitations they would also force on us we are going in a dangerous direction but too many still wear the blinders the government has put on them and they were so ready and willing to put on, and keep on, sad state of society :(
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
Absolutely. Back in 2016 I believe, there was a debate between Bernie Sanders and Ted Cruz. Cruz said something along the lines of "Bernie, we both agree that Washington is corrupt. I can't think why you'd advocate for giving them more power." 
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@ebuc
Yeah, I see the light bulb going off above your head. Welcome to the rational, logical common sense club.  Very few of us on board Spaceship Earth.

I am generally in the non-interventionist club.

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@bmdrocks21
Absolutely. Back in 2016 I believe, there was a debate between Bernie Sanders and Ted Cruz. Cruz said something along the lines of "Bernie, we both agree that Washington is corrupt. I can't think why you'd advocate for giving them more power." 
The alternative is that the power is in the hands of the rich and powerful people that the average person has absolutely no control over. We are much better off with power being in the hands of a politician we can vote out if he does shitty things than it being in the hands of a billionaire who doesn't give a shit what we think. 

We just need to work harder to get the money out of politics to remove the ability for politicians to abuse their power. This means no corporate money fueling campaigns. This means no politicians spending the majority of their time in office schmoozing the rich so they can win their next election. It will be difficult and the billionaires will fight it every step of the way. But it can be done. 
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@HistoryBuff
Well when you give power to corrupt politicians, you give the power of writing laws to the very people those billionaires bought. With a small government, rich people get some indirect power, but they cannot write crony laws and regulations on the books. They can’t force us to pay billions in tax dollars to subsidize their businesses and bail them out. 

I agree that we should get money out of politics regardless. It makes your position more sustainable. But then that brings up the separate issues caused by central planning. 
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@bmdrocks21
Well when you give power to corrupt politicians, you give the power of writing laws to the very people those billionaires bought.
That is why it is important to get their money out of politics. if billionaires have no way of giving money to politicians without going to jail, then it is alot harder to buy off politicians. 

With a small government, rich people get some indirect power, but they cannot write crony laws and regulations on the books. They can’t force us to pay billions in tax dollars to subsidize their businesses and bail them out. 
No, they can just crush unions, pay slave labor wages, treat employees as disposable commodities to be used up and discarded. That is how it used to work before employment laws were passed. If you take that power away from the government, we will just slide back into that world of rampant abuse by the rich and powerful. 

I will gladly pay taxes to get roads, health care, schools etc. At least I get a say in what services we get and what the rules will be. If you take away the power of the government, you are giving up your say in what the rules will be and handing that power exclusively to the rich. And they will promptly use it to make themselves richer and you poorer. 

I agree that we should get money out of politics regardless. It makes your position more sustainable. But then that brings up the separate issues caused by central planning. 
Do you mean economic central planning? No one has suggested doing that. But there is always going to need to be a balance. If there is no laws controlling companies, they will abuse their workers and the poor. That is just a fact. One only has to look at the 100,000% markup drug companies put on drugs people need to live. They are already making record profits, they don't need to do that. but they can, so they will. If they can get away with it and get more money, they will do it. Even if it kills people. 

On the other hand, if there are too many rules and too much control by the government you crush innovation and stifle growth. That is why we need a mixture. We need capitalism to fuel growth and innovation, and we need strong rules to keep that avarice in check so it doesn't hurt people and society in general. 
bmdrocks21
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No, they can just crush unions, pay slave labor wages, treat employees as disposable commodities to be used up and discarded. That is how it used to work before employment laws were passed. If you take that power away from the government, we will just slide back into that world of rampant abuse by the rich and powerful. 

<br>
I think it is a bit of a strawman to say that I am advocating for a total absence of labor laws. Do I think a $15 minimum wage is a terrible idea? Yes, I would certainly be against that. Do I think unions like United Auto Workers need to be scaled back and regulated more? Yes. I don't want an absence of unions, though. I don't think an absence of workplace regulations is a good idea, either.

I will gladly pay taxes to get roads, health care, schools etc. At least I get a say in what services we get and what the rules will be. If you take away the power of the government, you are giving up your say in what the rules will be and handing that power exclusively to the rich. And they will promptly use it to make themselves richer and you poorer. 

You would get more of a say in your school and healthcare if you were a consumer instead. Are you in favor of school vouchers so there is school choice, or do you think public schools should expect money and students without having an incentive to improve?


Do you mean economic central planning? No one has suggested doing that. But there is always going to need to be a balance. If there is no laws controlling companies, they will abuse their workers and the poor. That is just a fact. One only has to look at the 100,000% markup drug companies put on drugs people need to live. They are already making record profits, they don't need to do that. but they can, so they will. If they can get away with it and get more money, they will do it. Even if it kills people. 

Not entire economic central planning. Medicare for all is centrally-planned healthcare. The government is deciding quantities provided, prices, etc.

So companies should just have to wait 50 years to make their money back (by which time their drug is generic)? ~10 years and millions of dollars go into developing drugs.

On the other hand, if there are too many rules and too much control by the government you crush innovation and stifle growth. That is why we need a mixture. We need capitalism to fuel growth and innovation, and we need strong rules to keep that avarice in check so it doesn't hurt people and society in general. 

We agree there need to be rules. I just think there should be less than you. That is generally how this discussion works, as we aren't communists or anarcho-capitalists.
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@HistoryBuff
if billionaires have no way of giving money to politicians without going to jail, then it is alot harder to buy off politicians. 

That's never going to happen. Every schoolyard kid knows how to get access to cigarettes and vapes without getting any punishment. And the government has the judicial system stacked in their favor so nobody really goes to jail.

The only way to clean up the government is to take the power away so the rich have nothing to purchase.