Napoelon was the good guy in the napoleonic wars

Author: Dr.Franklin

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it is obvious that the coalition were the aggressors
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@Dr.Franklin
He is definitely a misunderstood individual.

He was in a precarious position between the Illuminati helping him (and his dream of ruling) versus the way he wanted Europe to become more democratic and less prone to Imperialism. Unfortunately for him, because he was too 'ends justify the means', he ended up using Imperialist tactics of invading and maintaining rule and when finally he began to turn good, Illuminati ensured he lost the Battle of Waterloo.

Trust me on this, he was going to win the Battle of Waterloo had a certain Illuminati family not gotten involved. Do the research and you'll know, I won't name names.
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@RationalMadman
he definitely became more imperialistic by the peninsular war and the invasion of Russia

what illumanati?
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I don't very much agree. He had the same intentions as Hitler, and yet you despise Hitler and call Napoleon, who inspired Hitler, a "good guy". Why is that?
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@VonKlempter
he did not have the same intentions at hilter at all, he was a miltary general, not a physcotic murderer
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@RationalMadman

I would suggest that both Napolean's and  Hitler's downfall was brought about their disrespect of Northern Climates.

So name names....Who are the illuminati?

Do you mean the inbred European Royalty?
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Will not name names.
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@Dr.Franklin
Hitler was once part of the army.
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I don't very much agree. He had the same intentions as Hitler
Who was Napoleon intending to genocide?
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@VonKlempter
yeah but who was napoleon intending to murder?
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@Dr.Franklin
Napoleon gassed rebellious blacks in France.
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@VonKlempter
He was racist and violent, this much is true. He did not intend on Fascism and actually is a significant reason that Western Europe is no longer Imperialist.

You cannot simply define Napoleon's role or persona by comparing it to Hitler. Napoleon was a villain but not the clear-cut simple kind of villain who is purely out for themselves. He genuinely had an agenda intended on making Europe more democratic, that much is for sure.
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@VonKlempter
Gassed them? When did this happen?
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evidence?
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@Dr.Franklin
The French Fuhrer: Genocidal Napoleon was as barbaric as Hitler, historian claims
By CHRISTOPHER HUDSON
UPDATED: 23:46, 24 July 2008

    
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Three days after the fall of France in 1940, Napoleon, lying in his marble tomb in Paris, received a visit from his greatest admirer.

Adolf Hitler, on his one and only visit to the French capital, made an unannounced trip to the tomb in Les Invalides.

In his white raincoat, surrounded by his generals, Hitler stood for a long time gazing down at his hero, his cap removed in deference.

Napoleon Bonaparte.
Dictator: Napoleon was responsible for thousands of executions

He was said later to have described this moment as 'one of the proudest of my life'.

The next day, during his official sightseeing tour of Paris, Hitler again visited Napoleon's tomb to salute him.

Conscious that his hero was known to the world simply as Napoleon, Hitler boasted that he would not need a rank or title on his gravestone. 'The German people would know who it was if the only word was Adolf.'

Throughout the war, Hitler had sandbags placed around Napoleon's tomb to guard against bomb damage.

Wooden floorboards were laid across the marble floor of Les Invalides so that they would not be scarred by German jackboots.

Until recently, the French would have been incensed by any comparison between Napoleon and Hitler.

But to their rage and shame, new research has shown that France's greatest hero presided over mass atrocities which bear comparison with some of Hitler's worst crimes against humanity.

These reassessments of Napoleon have caused anguish in France. Top politicians backed out of official ceremonies to mark what was possibly Napoleon's greatest victory, the battle of Austerlitz, when Napoleon's Grande Armee defeated the combined armies of Austria and Russia in just six hours, killing 19,000 of their adversaries.

A street in Paris named Rue Richepanse (after Antoine Richepanse, a general responsible for atrocities in the Caribbean) has recently had its name changed to Rue Solitude.

Hitler
Admiration: Hitler had a great respect for Napoleon - and perhaps his killing ways, it has now emerged

During his reign as Emperor, concentration camps were set up and gas was used to massacre large groups of people.

There were hit squads and mass deportations. And all this happened 140 years before Hitler and the Holocaust.

Claude Ribbe, a respected historian and philosopher and member of the French government's human rights commission, has been researching Napoleon's bloodcurdling record for some years.

He accuses him of being a racist and an anti-Semite who persecuted Jews and reintroduced widespread slavery just a few years after it had been abolished by the French government.

The most startling of these findings, the attempted massacre of an entire population over the age of 12 by methods which included gassing them in the holds of ships, relate to the French Caribbean colony of Haiti at the turn of the 19th century.

In Ribbe's words, Napoleon, then First Consul, was the man who, for the first time in history, 'asked himself rationally the question how to eliminate, in as short a time as possible, and with a minimum of cost and personnel, a maximum of people described as scientifically inferior'.

Haiti around 1800 was the world's richest colony, a slave-powered export factory which produced almost two-thirds of the world's coffee and almost half its sugar.

The black slaves were lashed and beaten to work and forced to wear tin muzzles to prevent them from eating the sugar cane.

If the slaves were fractious, they were roasted over slow fires, or filled with gunpowder and blown to pieces.

When the slaves began to fight for their freedom, under the leadership of a charismatic African military genius called Toussaint L'Ouverture, Napoleon sent 10,000 crack troops under the command of his brother-inlaw, General Leclerc, to crush Toussaint and restore slavery.

In 1802, a vast programme of ethnic cleansing was put in place. Napoleon banned inter-racial marriages and ordered that all white women who'd had any sort of relationship with a black or mulatto (person of mixed race) be shipped to France.

He further commanded the killing of as many blacks in Haiti as possible, to be replaced by new, more docile slaves from Africa.

The French troops were under orders to kill all blacks over the age of 12. However, younger children were also killed - stabbed to death, put in sandbags and dropped into the sea.

The Haitians fought to the death for independence, which they finally declared in 1804.

Prisoners on both sides were regularly tortured and killed, and their heads were mounted on the walls of stockades or on spikes beside the roads.

Non-combatants, too, were raped and slaughtered. According to contemporary accounts, the French used dogs to rip black prisoners to pieces before a crowd at an amphitheatre.

Allegdly on Napoleon's orders, sulphur was extracted from Haitian volcanoes and burned to produce poisonous sulphur dioxide, which was then used to gas black Haitians in the holds of ships - more than 100,000 of them, according to records.

The use of these primitive gas chambers was confirmed by contemporaries. Antoine Metral, who in 1825 published his history of the French expedition to Haiti, writes of piles of dead bodies everywhere, stacked in charnel-houses.

Auschwitz
Auschwitz victims: Did Hitler learn genocide from Napoleon?

'We varied the methods of execution,' wrote Metral. 'At times, we pulled heads off; sometimes a ball and chain was put at the feet to allow drowning; sometimes they were gassed in the ships by sulphur.

'When the cover of night was used to hide these outrages, those walking along the river could hear the noisy monotone of dead bodies being dropped into the sea.'

A contemporary historian, who sailed with the punitive expedition, wrote that: 'We invented another type of ship where victims of both sexes were piled up, one against the other, suffocated by sulphur.'

These were prison ships with gas chambers called etouffiers, or 'chokers', which asphyxiated the blacks, causing them terrible suffering.

Even at the time, there were French naval officers who were appalled at this savagery, claiming they would rather have braved a court martial than have forgotten the laws of humanity.

But from the Emperor's point of view, gassing was a way of cutting costs. Ships continued to transport prisoners out to sea to drown them, but corpses kept being washed up on beaches or tangled in ships' hulls.
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@RationalMadman
every single side did this


1 in 5 germas died in the thirty years war for example from armies, civilian deaths were on a much larger scale

his gassing also seem to be of enemies, not random civilians
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@Dr.Franklin
No, they were merely Haitians who didn't want to be enslaved.
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@RationalMadman
what are you talking about?

do you know the war crimes committed by the french in the revolutionary wars by the coalition?
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@Dr.Franklin
What I am talking about is that you are denying that fact that it was Napoleon who gave the executive orders to do these gassings, it was him who talked the other Generals into it as well.
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@RationalMadman
ok...

and? the coalition started the wars unlike Hitler and civiloian losses were huge

most old century major wars were worse statistically than WW2 and ww1, the biggest factor being disease
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@Dr.Franklin
You asked for proof, now you're changing the topic. He was a sadistic guy who had a complex agenda that wasn't just to gain power. Just because he's complex doesn't make the killings and rapes that were done under his rule any less unforgivable and abhorrent. He was a ruthless guy to the places he invaded but he was also battling ruthless elite people back home, as you say. He had layers to him.
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@RationalMadman
you cant be mad at him for waging 19th century warfare
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@RationalMadman
I pretty much agree. Though I do admit that Napoleon was not a Fascist like Hitler or Mussolini, he was a villain, and a villain very much like Hitler, mind you.
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You guys asked for proof? RM has already presented you with it.
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@Dr.Franklin
Three days after the fall of France in 1940, Napoleon, lying in his marble tomb in Paris, received a visit from his greatest admirer.
Greatest admirer, you can't deny that.
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I call Napoleon more of a second Caesar than a proto-Hitler although there are inevitable parallels. I tend to sympathize  with Beethoven’s point of view who first saw Napoleons career as the greatest modernizing influence in European history and after he marched on Russia the greatest monster. Undeniably brilliant, romantic, quintessentially French in spite of not being a Frenchman. 

Wikipedia:

British historian Andrew Roberts states: "The ideas that underpin our modern world—meritocracy, equality before the law, property rights, religious toleration, modern secular education, sound finances, and so on—were championed, consolidated, codified and geographically extended by Napoleon. To them he added a rational and efficient local administration, an end to rural banditry, the encouragement of science and the arts, the abolition of feudalism and the greatest codification of laws since the fall of the Roman Empire".
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which was?
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@Dr.Franklin

For the gassing.


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@Dr.Franklin
1 in 5 germas died in the thirty years war for example from armies, civilian deaths were on a much larger scale
Civilian deaths caused by the enemy is not intentional, however, Napoleon's genocide of his own countrymen was.

his gassing also seem to be of enemies, not random civilians
What he wants you to believe is that he gassed enemies, because of the Haitian Revolution conducted by the black French. However, they were still French, and Jews in Germany were still German, and so in that context, Napoleon is no different from Hitler.
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evidence?