With regard to the US Statute 18 USC §2383, are there any Democrat members of this site with sufficient lack of bias to explain, while there were charges of insurrection against a few of the hundreds of people charged with a variety of crimes for Jan 6 involvement, why there is not one single conviction for insurrection, yet your political-finger-pointing talkers continue to call the incident an "insurrection?" Some of you do, too. Since there are no convictions, it didn't happen, did it? Something did, but that is not what it was, was it? Can you call it what it was please? Don't ask me; I not the one giving answers. Don't wait for your talking pointers; they're sold down the river. Keep a decent head on your shoulders, huh?
What is your definition of insurrection, and does it agree with the statute, 18 USC §2383?
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"a violent uprising against an authority or government"
I wouldnt call Jan 6 an insurrection.
Few thousand people walking around and yelling aint ever going to overthrow US government.
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@fauxlaw
Was there even a charge of insurrection?
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@TheGreatSunGod
That is exactly what it was. An opportunity for Democrat, and even a few Republican talking points. I do not believe our government ought to be operated by talking points. It has a constitutional framework to follow, and, sorry for the misguided pols, but political parties area not therein mentioned, while even God is.
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@Greyparrot
Yes. As I said; several. There was once a list of all the charges made against every person arrested.
This citation from Newsweek in 2023 is not the list I had. That list was complete, listing names, charges, and results of trial with dates. Attempting to retrieve it was fruitless, it's been coincidentally pulled. This list does not include charges in all cases, but does list convictions. Not one, as I d=said, for insurrection.
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@fauxlaw
Yes. As I said; several. There was once a list of all the charges made against every person arrested.This citation from Newsweek in 2023 is not the list I had. That list was complete, listing names, charges, and results of trial with dates. Attempting to retrieve it was fruitless, it's been coincidentally pulled. This list does not include charges in all cases, but does list convictions. Not one, as I d=said, for insurrection.
Being loyal to an ex-president cannot be an act of insurrection. Going against the establishment like Jesus did is an insurrection.
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@TheGreatSunGod
It was violent
Jan 6 was domestic terrorism. Noif. No but.
It was violent
Not an uprising. Most people were just walking around. Few that got violent dont count. Otherwise, BLM riots would be uprising too then.
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@Shila
Going against the establishment like Jesus did is an insurrection.
Nope. Not when Christ's response to Pilate after the latter's question to him, "Whence art thou?" was replied to by the answer, "My kingdom is not of this world." What threat, therefore, to Pilate, and Rome? Pilate's response was to wash his hands, symbolic representation of his own dismissal of responsibility for Christ's life. And the. only reason why he had to remain involved is because the Sahedrin and Pharisees claimed they had no authority [due to Rome] to exact death by punishment for anybody. No, they did not get it, either. None of them believed Christ would resurrect, and scattered like Democrats today, wondering why they lost the 24 election. None of them get that, either, regardless of Trump. The Dems lost their own election by their own doing, or not doing, as the case may actually be. They had no message, apparently, that voting Democrats wanted. or they would not have lost. Bad-mouthing Trump is an obvious vote killer because everyone is tired of the complaining without a better message of what Democrats would do instead. As for Christ, he offered a lot of answers that a lot of people wanted, absent of Sanhedrin/Pharisees, and Roman's, the latter of which ultimately embraced the message themselves, didn't they, corrupted though it become.
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@fauxlaw
With regard to the US Statute 18 USC §2383, are there any Democrat members of this site with sufficient lack of bias to explain, while there were charges of insurrection against a few of the hundreds of people charged with a variety of crimes for Jan 6 involvement, why there is not one single conviction for insurrection, yet your political-finger-pointing talkers continue to call the incident an "insurrection?"
I'll start by pointing out that I've never used the term insurrection to describe J6 because all that does is give Trump cultists the excuse they need to deflect. It's a complicated issue because there were thousands of people involved all with different levels of involvement and motivations, so any one word to describe it other than the most vaguest of terms will be easily hand waived away by those uninterested in confronting the reality of what happened.
One other thing before I directly address your question is that the framing of this I find disingenuous. The idea here is that if a violation of a particular criminal statue isn't charged then this shows that the alleged activity didn't happen. That's not how reason works. Prosecutors will only bring charges if they believe they have enough evidence to attain a criminal conviction in a court of law. Those are extremely high standards and have no place being applied in the court of public opinion, especially when the prime defendant in said court is also a the front runner to be the next President of the United States.
Now with all that said, I find it odd that you ask this question when multiple individuals were charged with seditious conspiracy. That charge contains every element of insurrection plus it requires conspiring to effectuate said insurrection, so it's the exact same charge but worse.
Even though that directly conflicts with your narrative, I'm still willing to set that to the side and get to what I think is really the meat of the issue. The problem with calling it an insurrection is that it all depends on what point of view you're looking at it from. If we're talking about the motivations of the individual rioters than like I said, that varies quite a bit and there's too many "outs" for an insurrection aligned individual to use. The real charge here that applies is incitement of insurrection, which directly falls on Donald Trump. As long as what happened was his intention, and it was an attempt to rebel against the United States government, then the charge holds. Neither are reasonably disputable.
You cannot dispute that sending a mob to attack the US Capitol in an attempt to stop Congress from certifying the lawful winner of the election is a rebellion against the United States government and/or is laws.
And as far as Trump's motivations... I've argued them many times here so I'll just cut to the end. There is, or at least would have been, a plausible argument that Trump didn't want what happened to occur... Up until the 187 minutes after he spoke at the ellipse. For him to sit there in the WH dining room watching the entire thing play out on TV without making a single phone call to anyone in the chain of command, not one order for the national guard to deploy as they sat there for hours ready and waiting for that order... There is no rational case to be made that this is a man who didn't want this, and that's before we consider that he pardoned every single one of them.
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@Double_R
Jan 6 will go down as one of the most Pyrrhic victories in history for the Democrat party. Right up there with wiping out the Alamo and ambushing Pearl Harbor.
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@Double_R
I’ll respond to your points in their sequence.
“…if a violation of a particular criminal statue isn't charged then this shows that the alleged activity didn't happen. That's not how reason works. Prosecutors will only bring charges if they believe they have enough evidence to attain a criminal conviction in a court of law.”
There were charges for insurrection by the prosecution, but there are no convictions. Zero. So, prosecutors failed to achieve conviction even though they thought insurrectihon occurred. That argument was dead before you made it.
“…especially when the prime defendant in said court is also a the front runner to be the next President of the United States.”
Nope, that one Is dead, too. The court[s] wherein these J6 trials are being held are not the court[s] and not the cases the prosecution[s] tried to convict Trump. They have one, but that trial was so fraught with bogusness, the appeals may take years to get through. It is likely a vacated conviction.
“…multiple individuals were charged with seditious conspiracy.”
Sure. A lot of people were charged with disturbing the peace, too, but neither that, nor sed. conspiracy [18 USC §2384] are constant talking points in the media, nor among the screaming Democrats. I asked a pointed question about insurrection only because that’s the one-leaf word salad the media and the Democrats repeat ad nauseas. Thus, my limited question.
“You cannot dispute that sending a mob to attack the US Capitol.”
Oh, but I can. That is the other ad nauseas comment made by the media and Democratsa. But Trumo did note say that in his beech. ERead the transcript. He said “…go peacefully to the Capitol.” What’s so confusing about that. Other than the it is not confusing at all, unless one already has an agenda.
“…an attempt to stop Congress from certifying the lawful winner of the election is a rebellion against the United States government and/or is laws.”
Show me statute forbidding questioning election results.
“…not one order for the national guard to deploy…”
Since when is the President responsible for the Capitol Building security? That’s the Speaker’s responsibility. That building does not belong to the Exec branch. Trump offered Pelosi Nat’l Guard assistance days before Jan 6. She refused. See her former job description, not Trump's.
So, I repeat my original question...
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@Greyparrot
Pyrrhic victory
Amen. Don't forget the immortal words of JoeBiden: ""Stem the migration at the southern border..."
That exec command in Mar. 2021 didn't fit any word salad Kamalala knew, so it was ignored. So much for "Got it done."