Why doesn't God just save us?

Author: RoderickSpode ,

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  • RoderickSpode
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    RoderickSpode
    Topic of course being from a biblical perspective.

    Ephesians 2:8-9 New International Version (NIV)
    For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.


    Why doesn't God just save everyone whether they ask for it or not? If it's a gift, just give it unconditionally, right?


    I think this question is looking at salvation the way we look at junk mail. I'm not choosing the term junk mail as a means to suggest devalueing salvation (although it might be). But, we receive, unconditionally, junk mail in addition to expected mail. But even if we eventually discard it, we initially received it. If there's something we like in the junk mail, we may take advantage of the offer. If not, we discard it. It goes in a stack, and/or the recycling bin.


    The difference between salvation and junkmail, other than the obvious absurdity of the comparison in terms of value, is that with salvation it's a rejection issue.


    Revelation 3:20 King James Version (KJV)

    20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.


    Basically, it would appear that Jesus is honoring a breaking and entering law. The requirment here is the opening of the door. This verse is directed 
    at the Church in Laodicia, but sometimes is used in reference to an invitation for salvation. So same principle applies. This is not something that can be shoved through a mail slot. We can't tell Jesus to leave it on the doorstep for us to attend to later.

    You can give someone a free gift in the form of a Mazurati.  And (although unlikely), they can refuse the free gift. If you leave it on their driveway with a bow tied around it, they can demand you get it off their property. (We can't do this with junk mail that I'm aware of.) It may be a free gift, but not one that is accepted, therefore whatever benefits of owning a Mazurati will not apply.




                       
                  


  • croweupc
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    --> @RoderickSpode
    As long as you belong to the right religion, the right denomination, hold the right set of beliefs, and act on those beliefs in just the right way, it’s free!
  • BrotherDThomas
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    --> @Mopac @RoderickSpode



    .
    RoderickSpode,

    YOUR QUOTE: "Why doesn't God just save everyone whether they ask for it or not? If it's a gift, just give it unconditionally, right?"

    I am assuming that you are talking about the TRUE Christian God named "Yahweh/Jesus/Spirit. Therefore, in the godly passages below, He is saving everyone without question, to wit:

    “My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.”(1 John 2: 1-2)

    “And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the world.” (1 John 4:14) 

    KEY BIBLICAL PHRASES:but also for the sins of the whole world" and "to be the Savior of the world."  Who is to say that Jesus won’t fulfill his mission in saving everyone with no questions asked, other than probably the totally inept FAKE Christian MOPAC? Anyone else?

    No belief in Christianity is needed in the aforementioned passages to be saved, where Jesus saves everyone  praise!


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  • RoderickSpode
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    --> @croweupc

    As long as you belong to the right religion, the right denomination, hold the right set of beliefs, and act on those beliefs in just the right way, it’s free!
    According to who?
  • RoderickSpode
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    --> @BrotherDThomas
    So in other words, everyone is on a Universal List?
  • Mopac
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    --> @BrotherDThomas

    I am assuming that you are talking about the TRUE Christian God named "Yahweh/Jesus/Spirit

    If "Yahweh" is simply The Father of The Trinity, how is it that...


    "Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM."

    This is an incorrect understanding of The Trinity you have.


  • Mopac
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    --> @RoderickSpode
    We Orthodox certainly understand salvation as a cooperation with God. Not that we are saved by works, but that as you said we can reject or squander God's grace. Not faith as in simply believing, but faithfulness, because faith without works is dead.

    The doctrine we have of theosis refers to this cooperation with God's divine energies. Or as John the baptist says, "I must become less so He becomes more.". Let Christ rule our life. Jesus being savior is easy for people, the Lord part is hard!


  • croweupc
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    --> @RoderickSpode
    I’m being facetious and a bit hyperbolic.

    Reading through these treads you will see people say things like “if you only had the truth as I do”. I was a member of an ultra conservative denomination that taught they had truth. It was exclusive and relied on Matt 7:13-14. Obviously we could just lean on Orthodoxy as it is most certainly the oldest form of Christianity, but we were taught that the church had the doctrine locked down because the general public didn’t have copies of the Bible so no one could go against the authority of the church leadership. Now that we have the Bible we can study to show ourselves approved unto God. (2 Tim 2:15) It was the terrible thing done in the OT by God’s permission that made me question it. When I discovered the many contradictions in the Bible and the conflicting manuscripts passed down, I had no choice if I were being honest with myself but to give up my faith. I have no problem with personal religion so long as others are respected. I will stand up against the tyranny of oppression brought about by the religious who seek to impose their beliefs on others.
  • BrotherDThomas
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    --> @Mopac



    .
    Mopac,

    Haven't you had enough bible slapping by me since my timely arrival?  What is the reason that you allow me to show you to be the continued FAKE Christian fool here at DebateArt?  Why don't you give yourself enough time to heal from my last Bible beatings towards you regarding your outright bible ignorance, before you start another one with me?

    YOUR TOTALLY INEPT QUOTE ONCE AGAIN: "If "Yahweh" is simply The Father of The Trinity, how is it that..."Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM."  This is an incorrect understanding of The Trinity you have."

    HELLO?!  The term I AM is in fact the three entities of the Triune Doctrine, FOOL!  

    Simply put, so you have a better chance of hopefully understanding, there are three divine entities: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. The Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God. Yet these three divine persons are distinct from one another: the Father is not the Son, the Father is not the Holy Spirit, and the Son is not the Holy Spirit.  However, there is exactly one God (1 Timothy 2:5), therefore Christ is His own Father and His own Son. The Holy Ghost is neither Father nor Son, but both. The Son was begotten by the Father, but existed before He was begotten. Christ is just as old as his Father, and the Father is just as young as his Son. The Holy Ghost proceeded from the Father and Son, but He is of the same age as the other two.  DO YOU UNDERSTAND? IF NOT, THEN YOU ARE MORE DENSE THAN I THOUGHT YOU WERE!

    Seriously, I am growing tired in easily showing you to be nothing but a minion of Satan here at DebateArt with your ungodly Devil Speak!

    You are excused, for now. 


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  • Mopac
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    --> @BrotherDThomas
    Clang clang
  • Deb-8-a-bull
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    Yeah i believed in God. 
    But that was as far as it went. You know ? 
    I thought, so thats what believing in god does.
    UNTILLLLLLLLL
    I Took my belief in a God to one of them odd roofed buildings we have in and around towns. 
    You know them ones. 
    Anyway. To cut it short . They gave me a MASSIVE book with all these phrases that like god said. He did. 
    I took that book home with me and linked my belife in a god type thing and BAMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM.  
    I starter rising the ranks of Scripture translating. 
    One month in , i was in the  top 10 scripture deciphering.
    With more the three scriptures they say that I'm the best at.

    So yeah , me and God are practically best friends now so ummmmmmmm .
    Ok cool
      


  • Deb-8-a-bull
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    Dont be happy with, ' well I'm in this group now ' 

  • BrotherDThomas
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    --> @Mopac



    .
    mopac,

    YOUR GIVING IN QUOTE ONCE AGAIN: "Clang clang"

    Thank you for admitting once again, where I have lost count, in yet another defeat of yours by the Brother D.  We can see that you are getting used to this fact of being the most bible ignorant FAKE Christian on DebateArt!  To save even further embarrassment for your unbelievable stupidity regarding our Christianity, do not engage me again, understood?

    Do you think that I like making you the continued fool on this forum? No I do not.


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