To the Moderators

Author: Buddamoose ,

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  • Buddamoose
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    Buddamoose
    It has come to my attention that recently a moderator made sexual comments towards a minor. In this kerfuffle these comments were equated to "PC Culture." 

    Simple Question needs to be asked then:


    Do you think sexual advances from an adult to a teenger, a minor, are appropriate and should be allowed?

    This is a simple Yes or No question. Full stop. There is no nuance. Either you think its acceptable or its not. Nuance applied is in this case merely a tool to divert and obfuscate from the core innapropriateness/appropriateness of it. 


    Justify actions however you wish, in the end the actions stand alone and it begs the singular question:

    Do you think sexual advances from an adult to a teenger, a minor, are appropriate and should be allowed?

    If no, good. 

    If yes... you sick, perverted, and harmful individuals. A 16 year old is still an ignorant individual who does not understand the gravity of their interactions, ye who forgets what they themselves were at that age.


    Like wtf. Some of y'all are twisting PC culture into that which is against some perverted ish that is not the realm of Political Correctness, but that which is revolting to those with a remote semblence of human understanding, and that's some olympic level mental gymnastics.

    I'm as anti PC and SJW as they come, and this kind of behavior ain't the realm of that, full stop.  
  • Buddamoose
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    Buddamoose
    I don't even frequent this site anymore, and the ish i read and how people were excusing it and appealing to nuance where nuance is blowing smoke up ones a** is astounding. I suggest those who behaved in such a manner check themselves. 

    Cause y'all begging for a helicopter ride.

  • ethang5
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    It's no secret I was never a fan of bsh1, but he doesn't hold all the blame.

    Since this board began, bsh1 has been sexually out of control. The man had naked boys on his profile page, called himself lascivious, and spoke openly about having dildos for his ho-ha.

    He disdained anyone who didn't kowtow to his homoerotic agenda as a bigot, and brought in gay parades and gay months to Dart. He even surrounded himself with young gay men on his mod team.

    We all saw this. Many of us, trying to show how PC and tolerant we were, went along with it, giggling heartily at the inappropriate gay jokes.

    All of a sudden, we're angry? How is what bsh1 did different from the character he showed all along? Because the kid was 16? Did any of you think bsh1 was not attracted to 16 year olds? The fact that he was 16 is what attracted him in the first place.

    But now, we are up in arms. Why? Bsh1 rightly thought his behavior would be tolerated because we tolerated and enabled all his other inappropriate behavior in the name of open mindedness and tolerance.

    I will be called a homophone, but a guy with the exact same lascivious behavior towards females would be just as immoral and creepy.

    There are people on the mod team now who know even better how wanton bsh1 was, but kept their mouths shut, and are still doing so now.

    Yeah, what he did was wrong, but he grew in our garden. We watered him. All this righteous indignation now smells a little rotten.
  • oromagi
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    --> @Buddamoose
    Your notion of Halloween fun is also rather perverse.
  • RationalMadman
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    --> @Buddamoose
    I was one of those who asked for nuance to be applied. I also remember what I was like at 16. I know that PressF4Respect is not fully emotionally mature yet. That doesn't mean much. In many social democracies, 16 year olds can fuck, even drink wine and beer etc. The main reason why it was wrong is what I agree with Coal on; on top of Bsh1 being a proper adult vs a teenager who was almost turning 17, Bsh1 was the chief moderator and PressF4 would be scared to say anything back or report it to anyone had he felt violated by it.

    An almost 17-year-old may be immature with how they handle their anger, lust etc. but they are old enough to be fully cogent of their feelings of being violated, hurt etc. PressF4 explicitly said many times that he didn't give a shit about the comment. He is not too young to know what he feels or 'consent' to a comment online. 16-17 isn't the same as 13-14, if you don't see the difference then how the fuck can you see a difference between 16-17 to 18-19? There is actually more difference psychologically between a 8-9 age gap than there is between a 31-34 age gap, don't you agree? Maybe they're equal but I'd actually say more. The point I'm making is that it is indeed nuanced, especially with comments made online and the offence taken. PressF4Respect is absolutely old enough to know what he felt at the receiving end. It's true that Bsh1 was in such a powerful position that had PressF4 felt violated, he would have been afraid and felt he had no one to turn to and for that reason as well as past mishaps, I did support Bsh1 apologising and stepping down. The degree of wrongness is where I argue nuance.
  • coal
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    --> @Buddamoose
    Correct on all counts.  Castin is an idiot.
  • ethang5
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    Castin is not an idiot. And I doubt if that is what buddamoose meant to convey.

    Castin is one of the most objective posters I know. She has always been able to see the other side of a story, and is always open to other points of view.

    She thought bsh1 made a mistake, and as such, absolved him on intent. What she questioned was whether it was PC culture behind the hysterics.

    I lobbied hard for Castin being on the mod team because knowing bsh1, I knew someone like Castin would be a stabilizing force.

    Long ago, castin noted that her stay as mod would be over soon, and did not really want to be mod anyway.

    This board doesn't deserve Castin, and that you can publicly insult someone with her fairness and objectivity, highlights all that is wrong with the internet.
  • David
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    --> @Buddamoose
    Do you think sexual advances from an adult to a teenger, a minor, are appropriate and should be allowed?
    The answer to this question is a resounding no -- especially coming from the chief moderator. A similar case happened on another site which resulted in the de-staffing of the member in question.

  • David
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    --> @ethang5
    All of a sudden, we're angry? How is what bsh1 did different from the character he showed all along? Because the kid was 16? Did any of you think bsh1 was not attracted to 16 year olds? The fact that he was 16 is what attracted him in the first place.

    This is a very strong accusation and one that is not based in fact. I don't think bsh realized he was a minor. I think it was a joke in very poor taste. I don't believe bsh is an evil child predator.
  • Harikrish
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    --> @David



    Bsh1 accuser: All of a sudden, we're angry? How is what bsh1 did different from the character he showed all along? Because the kid was 16? Did any of you think bsh1 was not attracted to 16 year olds? The fact that he was 16 is what attracted him in the first place.

    This is a very strong accusation and one that is not based in fact. I don't think bsh realized he was a minor. I think it was a joke in very poor taste. I don't believe bsh is an evil child predator.
    Members are either venting out or masking their veiled attraction for bsh1 now that he has left DART. But the man is not here to defend himself. I say move on.
  • David
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    --> @Harikrish
    Members are either venting out or masking their veiled attraction for bsh1 now that he has left DART. But the man is not here to defend himself. I say move on.

    +1
  • thett3
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    --> @ethang5
    Since this board began, bsh1 has been sexually out of control. 
    I think this is a really good way to put it. From the incessant flirty comments to the bizarre poetry (https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/924/raps-by-darters) he's flaunted his sexuality in a way that is questionable at best, and comes off REALLY badly when read in the wrong light. He even made a sexual comment about me, saying he would nominate my ass for the hall of fame. I've self doxxed on DDO multiple times so I know that he knows what I look like, meaning it wasn't just a normal comment. I didn't say anything because I don't care, but somebody else could've absolutely been offended or hurt by a comment like that. 

    I truly don't think he meant anything sinister in his comment to the minor. But it doesn't matter. It was a totally unacceptable way for a moderator to behave, and it was at that moment that I would imagine a lot of people suddenly started viewing his sexual behavior in the past in a *very* different light which caused the tremendous backlash. 
  • thett3
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    Also since I know there’s a very good chance he’s reading this I also want to say that redemption is always possible and he doesn’t have to exile himself from this community forever if he chooses not to (although he should never be a moderator again.) But he does need to change his ways 
  • SupaDudz
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    --> @Buddamoose
    Boi be more active and do mafia
  • SupaDudz
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    --> @Buddamoose
    Boi be more active and do mafia
  • Wylted
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    I don't even fuck 18 year olds because of how easy they are to manipulate. I think it almost means they lack as much free will as an older woman
  • coal
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    I think the argument that "the community" watered the garden by tolerating bsh1 surrounding himself with underage gay boys, and us tolerating that is... Well I don't know what to think about it.  First of all, I don't know if it is true because the only other moderator I know of is speedrace and I have no idea what his supposed sexuality is (and I don't care).  Secondly, if what ethang is suggesting is true (and I don't know if it is because I do not participate in this "community" or whatever), then that's deeply concerning.

    That said I generally do not approve of bsh1's conduct and I attribute it to as much a lack of emotional and psychological (as well as sexual) maturity, and generally a complete lack of regard for what appropriate conduct in his position would have been due to, as I have indicated, a complete lack of maturity on every relevant dimension.  

    The main issue here is not whether bsh1 is some kind of "sexual predator" (which, to be clear, I do not think that he is), but whether because of a lack of being properly socialized and having an array of friends his own age or near his own age, he sees himself as more of a teenager than someone in his mid-20s.  He is also more comfortable around kids because they look up to him and are far, far less likely to call out his bullshit -- of which there is no shortage -- than someone who has a mind of their own, and thoughts in their head.  

    Like, a 16 year old might think it's perfectly normal to threaten to kill yourself whenever someone gets into a heated argument with you and refuses to "agree to disagree" because to a 16 year old, with nothing even vaguely approximating life experience or emotional/psychological maturity, even something as absolutely trivial as an argument with someone might be the biggest conflict they've ever dealt with.  But to a normal adult, if someone says after an argument or disagreement something to the effect of what bsh1 has after such conflicts, that is a serious problem and a plain and clear indicator that this person has massive issues that they need to sort out with a therapist or other appropriate professional (psychologist, namely). 

    This isn't a uniquely gay problem, either.  But it is something that needs to be addressed and it is conduct that is seriously not appropriate for a moderator on this or any other site. 

    Stepping down was the right decision, but he still should have taken responsibility and acknowledged that he was out of control.  When he does that I'm sure he will rejoin the community. 

  • coal
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    And to be clear, even though bsh1 (for reasons again I attribute to a lack of emotional/psychological/etc. maturity and stability) holds a grudge against me for plenty of reasons that I don't care about, I want to note for everyone here that I have no lasting beef with him.  I just don't care.  I have more important things to worry about, but seeing this is something that I felt was important to speak up on and so I have. 

    I generally as well agree with mostly all of what Annie has said on this topic, and would note for everyone that despite the fact that bsh1 has similarly misread her motives as he has consistently misread mine, the main issue here is not to go after him or whatever other revenge fantasy he or any of the stupid kids (speedrace) have convinced themselves of.  I just don't want to see conduct like what I have been seeing, and I don't think anyone else does either. 

    It's not personal, and it never was.   
  • Harikrish
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    --> @thett3
    I think this is a really good way to put it. From the incessant flirty comments to the bizarre poetry (https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/924/raps-by-darters) he's flaunted his sexuality in a way that is questionable at best, and comes off REALLY badly when read in the wrong light. He even made a sexual comment about me, saying he would nominate my ass for the hall of fame. I've self doxxed on DDO multiple times so I know that he knows what I look like, meaning it wasn't just a normal comment. I didn't say anything because I don't care, but somebody else could've absolutely been offended or hurt by a comment like that.

    I truly don't think he meant anything sinister in his comment to the minor. But it doesn't matter. It was a totally unacceptable way for a moderator to behave, and it was at that moment that I would imagine a lot of people suddenly started viewing his sexual behavior in the past in a *very* different light which caused the tremendous backlash.

    I briefed through your link. It reads like mature advice from someone who wants to avoid clumsy situations. It would be useful to some young teenager. But not as much to an adult who might even agree with his recommendations. 
  • Dr.Franklin
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    Everybody comes running back when a mod changes LOL
  • Imabench
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     A 16 year old is still an ignorant individual who does not understand the gravity of their interactions, ye who forgets what they themselves were at that age.
    Out of curiosity, what Midwestern Evangelical Church do you have to go to school at to be convinced that a 16 year old that engages in crude humor on the internet every once in a while, clearly in jest, is something to be taken uber-seriously? 
  • ethang5
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    I don't believe bsh is an evil child predator. 
    Neither do I. What I did say was that his sexuality was slipping out of his control. I'm not the first or the only one to have noticed this. Being attracted to a 16 year old is not illegal, but soliciting one is.

    I know bsh1 did not believe what he was doing was wrong, and if he had thought it was wrong, would not have done it. This was Castin's point, which I agree with.

    The problem is that he did not (and apparently still does not) think it was wrong.

    And press4's personal opinion on the matter is irrelevant as far as the morality and the legality of it are concerned.