Cosmic Acceleration-Dark Energy

Author: ebuc

Posts

Total: 11
Topic's author
#1
ebuc
ebuc's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,295
3
2
4
ebuc's avatar
ebuc
3
2
4
What if Universe is not expanding, and rather, our perceptions { pooints-of-view } of Universe is changing. This approach I'm working on, is based on the idea the the closer we get to the something, the larger { more gigantic } is seems to us. Say your a mile from a large tree but as you get closer it seems to get bigger visually.

Below is a way that we can currently recieve data that the Universe is expanding and accelerating in that expansion, when in actuality, Universe is not expanding at all.  This has to do with every quantum particle of Universe being composed of tori, and each tori has three distinct aspects:

1} outer peak of positive curvature   (   ) i.e. the outer great circle of each quantum torus is ultra-micro Gravity ergo we do no quantize or quantify it,

2 and 3 is the higher and lower peaks of a sine-wave patterning /\/\/\/ we find with EMRadiation { photons/boson } and electrons { fermions }

4} inner peak of negative curvature )( i.e. the inner great circle of each quantum torus, is  ultra-micro, Dark Energy ergo we do not quantise nor quantify it.


So ideas is that currently the inside-the-tube  i.e. between outer positive shaped Gravitational space  and  the inner negative shaped Dark Energy space, is our two peaks that defined the sine-wave patterning, and that I believe, for whatever reason, we began to detect indirectly accelearting expansion of Universe as Dark Energy,

NOT because Universe is expanding rather because the inside sine-wave patterning is getting closer to the innner peak of curvature surface.  Below is graphic pattern Ive presented for years, but take note that the sine-wave pattern 0, 3, 6, 9, 12 is inside the tube and closer to the inner curvature of the quantum torus.


outer......1......................5.........7.......................11.............13............................17......
-
-
-
-
--
.....0....................................6.....................................12..............................................18 higher peak of sine-wave
..........................3..................................9...............................................15......................lower peak of sine-wave
-
inner.............2........4........................8........10................................14............16.............


So this a rough. gross oversimplification as to scales of size,  however, it shows the basic sine-wave of our observed time physical reality being closer to inner curvature of Dark Energy, at least at this time or cycles of eternal Universe existence.


There may be times we ---the sine-wave of reality--- approachs the outer postive curvature and then as we get closer to graviational outer surface peak we indirectly see a contracting Universe.

So the above is a way, in which Universe is not actually expanding or contracting rather or perceptions our closer to one other the other side of all cosmic quantum tori, some combination of two or more define every particle of Universe except for perhaps a gravitn-darkion.


#2
Sum1hugme
Sum1hugme's avatar
Debates: 37
Posts: 1,014
4
4
9
Sum1hugme's avatar
Sum1hugme
4
4
9
-->
@ebuc
  We know the Universe is expanding because we can measure the redshift of distant objects as they move away from us. The fact that their velocity is uniformly proportional to their distance from us indicates that the space between them is expanding.
#3
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 11,299
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@Sum1hugme
Sounds convincing.
Topic's author
#4
ebuc
ebuc's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,295
3
2
4
ebuc's avatar
ebuc
3
2
4
-->
@Sum1hugme
...indicates that the space between them is expanding....

more correctly stated as, the distance between them is increasing. Space in of itself is consider to be a non-occupied space and not a something --like a rubber band or basket ball-- that can expand or contract. So the "space" is not expanding. Our abdomen and lungs expand and contract, a truly non-occupied space does not exand-contract.

With that part above more refined for clarity sakes --closer to absolute truth-- we can now address the photonic red shift i.e. the waves length are getting longer.

..." Astronomers have discovered that, in general, the further away a galaxy is, the more red-shifted its light is. This means that the further away the galaxies are, the faster they are moving. "......

.." .. Doppler shifts arise from the relative motion of source and observer through space, whereas astronomical redshifts are 'expansion redshifts' due to the expansion of space itself. ".... 

Again in order for the so called 'space' to expand, it has to be an occupied space, a medium. Only and occupied space { a something } can expand or contract.

..." Something causes the wavelength of the radiation (emitted by faraway stars and galaxies) to 'stretch'. ".....

Ebuc.....So this last one above says that a something is causing the EMRadiation { photons } to be stretched into the red wavelength.

Staack exchange quote---  With the exception of - the expansion of space itself. Yes, photons are losing energy, that's why they're red-shifted.
....--Stack exchange reply--......." This is incorrect. The 'tired photons' hypothesis is in direct contrast to the Doppler hypothesis. In fact, only one of these can be true.
The prevalent view is in favor of Doppler effect for the shifting of the frequency. However, even though this is the dominant view, it does not apply to all red-shifted objects (for e.g. the Quasar redshift is still an iffy...)

If the 'tired photons' view was true, there would be a 'smearing' effect - from the inelastic collisions of photons with interstellar medium. As of now, no such effect is observed. "......


Ebuc....not to rock the boat ---of traditional scientific evidence--- too much, we have to consider, how Universe is observed to be expanding everywhere at same time.   This is where the loaf of 3D rasin bread expanding rasins { as galaxies quasars etc }  away from each other analogy ,  was long ago w adopted over the 2D surface of the balloon stretching { expanding }.

So Universe expansion and the Dark Energy accelerating expansion, is the rasins in loaf of expanding { in all directions } dough bread { a medium of 'space'.  Ok?

So now with some clarity ---or confusion--- we are  back to the red shifted photon { EMR } from galaxies farther away.

Stack exchange again----" Photons don't loose energy but collide with one another making gaps in the waveform over space, By Fourier Analysis these gaps would give a red shift. The further the light travels the more photon collisions there would be so the more red shift. This is not the same as tired light. The microwave back ground could be caused by photons of reduced energy which have been knocked out of the original light stream. I am not disputing that the Doppler shift can occur only that there is also the mechanism of photon collisions as well. There could be both Doppler Effect and photon collisions causing the red shift. ".....

I'm not convinced that we have a rasin-bread-like 3D expanding Universe, and we know some galaxies are moving toward each other, not always from each other.

And Dark Energy acceleration is  more of what I was considering but whether UNiverse and the space { as a medium } is expanding is also not convincing to me, because I dont see the mechanism of how it expands, as say compared to rubber molecules or steel or wood etc.

#5
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 12,747
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@ebuc
Are you some type of a scientist. I love all of this stuff about space
#6
Sum1hugme
Sum1hugme's avatar
Debates: 37
Posts: 1,014
4
4
9
Sum1hugme's avatar
Sum1hugme
4
4
9
-->
@ILikePie5
The OP is a word salad.
#7
Sum1hugme
Sum1hugme's avatar
Debates: 37
Posts: 1,014
4
4
9
Sum1hugme's avatar
Sum1hugme
4
4
9
-->
@ebuc
We haven't observationally confirmed the existence of dark matter, but the fact that the expansion is uniform and proportional to the distance from the observer, indicates that the space itself is expanding. 

Simply saying that the distance between them is increasing is actually less correct, because it doesn't explain the fact that the distance is increasing uniformly and is directly proportional to the velocity of the red shifting bodies. Any two objects in space can move away from each other, But the uniformity indicates space itself is expanding and not just objects moving away from each other in space.
Topic's author
#8
ebuc
ebuc's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,295
3
2
4
ebuc's avatar
ebuc
3
2
4
-->
@Sum1hugme
We haven't observationally confirmed the existence of dark matter,...

I think you meant Dark Energy.


....But the uniformity indicates space itself is expanding...

Ive already addressed this and you have not.  The "space" you address is presumed to be a truly non-occupied space ergoyour "space" is not an occupied space not a medium that do expand-contract. 

Why you do not address this is because you have not clarifying answer, as I clearly laid out for other mediums, rubber, steel, wood etc are occupied space and expand-contract.

A non-occupied space does not expand-contract, and your hoping that it does is wishful thinking your part Sum-H.

There exists two primary kinds of spae, occupied and non-occupied. This is rational, logical common sense you have yet to grasp and have yet to identify what the specific characteristics of "space" that is presumed to be expanding and if it is a medium that can expand, then it can also contract, just as any other occupied space medium.






Topic's author
#9
ebuc
ebuc's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,295
3
2
4
ebuc's avatar
ebuc
3
2
4
-->
@Sum1hugme
What is Space Sum1?   I gave you the answer in #8. 

....' A non-occupied space does not expand-contract, and your hoping that it does, is wishful thinking your part Sum-1..

..' There exists two primary kinds of Space, occupied and non-occupied. '.  You dont get it do you Sum-1? Or is just your ego doesnt want to acknowledge truth when exposed to y ebuc?

..' This abov is rational, logical common sense you have yet to grasp and have yet to identify what the specific characteristics of "space" that is presumed to be 'non-occupied{?} yet expanding,  and, if it is a medium that can expand, then it can also contract, just as any other occupied space medium does.

So Sum-1, is your "space" that you reference occupied? With what exactly?  C'mon, drop your ego and address the specifics of truth Ive laid before you. You can do it.

Or maybe you cant.  Maybe your ego is too much for you to control.  The ego drives and your just a passenger so you have no responsibility to address the truths laid out before you.

Kind of like Arnold the Terminator telling the officer to ..'talk to the hand'.... cause the rational, logical common sense mind is in the passenger seat just along for the ride and no responsiblity  to find and acknowledge truth out in front of them.

I'm waiting, tick, tock, tick tock, tick tock,......


#10
Sum1hugme
Sum1hugme's avatar
Debates: 37
Posts: 1,014
4
4
9
Sum1hugme's avatar
Sum1hugme
4
4
9
-->
@ebuc
Yes, I did mean dark energy. 

There is no such thing as non-occupied space in reality. Even if you take all the matter and radiation out of a piece of space, It will still weigh something. That's because "empty space" is actually a churning mess of random energy spikes because of the inherent vibration of quantum fields.
Topic's author
#11
ebuc
ebuc's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,295
3
2
4
ebuc's avatar
ebuc
3
2
4
-->
@Sum1hugme
There is no such thing as non-occupied space in reality.

1} I agree, and glad to see clarify.  Truly non-occupied space is was surrounds/embraces our finite, eternally existenct finite, occupied space Universe, and, for the most part irrelevant to the topic of Dark Energy accelerating the seeming expansion of Universe and this occcupied space between some galaxies, some quazars and Earth, and other.

.....1a} or perhaps the truly non-occupied space outside of Universe is relevant, the energy of physical reality tends to rush in  ---or in this case, rush out { expand } to fill that the vacuum of such a truly non-occupied space bordering the surface perimeter of finite Universe...  Place that scenario the side, for now........

Even if you take all the matter and radiation out of a piece of space,
2} Ok so the finite set of space, within Universe were considering, if all matter { fermions ex plasma/free electrons, an neurinos, quarks etc }, and,

....2a} EMRadiation { photonic bosons }, two quark mesons {  weird bosoninc strong nuclear force }, weak force { W+ W- and Zo },  and gluons { strong sub-nuclear force },

It [ space ] will still weigh something.
Meaning that weight is equal to mass? So maybe it has the Higg field quantum God particle{ mass-energy ergo a boson{s} } and resultant of 01} { kinetic energy, 02} potential energy, 03} mass that this trinity equals mass-energy  LINK ? i.e.Higgs bosons out there in this not truly non-occupied space, under our consideration, and were trying to relate to Dark Energy.

That's because "empty space" is actually a churning mess [ mass/Higg field of bosons ] of random energy spikes because of the inherent vibration of quantum fields.

So this bosonic, Higgs-field of mass ---or create mass in the "space" under our consideration, and you refer to this Higgs field as "vibration of quantum fields".  yes no?  If no, not Higgs quantum fields, then please specify what quantum fields  your refering to out there in this "space" under our consideration?


As of now, scientists are suggesting there is a quantum field of repulsive Dark Energy, and this repulsive Dark Energy is the occupied space medium that is expanding, and carrys along any Higgs field   --- or some other not mention above---, with it, and this means the galaxies { themselves presumed not to be expanding from Dark Energy{?} } moving way from each other because Dark Energy and Higgs field is expanding.

Ok, so is that as scenario, that more closely relates to what scientist mean, specifically when they say "spac" is expanding, with accelleration?

PLease elaborate or correct were i'm in error with my understanding of your understanding etc.

Ok, except wait, since you took out EMRadiation { photons } to describe other basics of "space", but between these galaxies, quasars and Eart etc, there do exists photons,, of specific wave lenghts of red frequency.  

3} and scientist believe what causes this red freqencey is that these photons are emmitted from stars in galaxies that accelerating from us, and this red frequency has nothing to do with Higgs field ---or some other quantum fields you have not specified---  causing the red frequencies.

4} I'm just looking for all the specifics to best of you knowledge laid out as clearly as possible for lay person and those who familiar with some of players.

Again, my sugggestion is that sine-wave existence is getting closer to the mechanisms of ultra-micro, negative shaped Dark Energy )( and that may be we why we have a perception of Universe expanding.  Ultra-micro Dark Energy travels outward at some angle to our sine-wave existence perception, and we see this divergence becuase our sine-wave existence { reality observed quantised and quanitfied }, has a perception of red frequenceies.

I'm not expert, just looking to consider if there is truly a radial { 180 degree } distance of expansion, or misleading negative { saddle-shape } of toris that is at less than 180 degrees that affects what our sine-wave existence is percieving.