Americans not only divided but baffled by their opponents

Author: Danielle

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The title of this thread is based off some polling I read about that I will link in the next post. 

In another thread I giggled about Pie lamenting "Elitists looking down on middle America. What’s new?" literally right after he said "[those same people's] cities are absolutely fucked." In other words it's snobby and unwarranted to snub your nose at another group's culture in this country, but only if you're liberal. For some reason conservatives get a pass for their snobby ass elitism because they make $40,000 a year. But the definition of elitism doesn't have anything to do with wealth; it's about a general superiority complex and conservatives are as guilty as anyone else. The same way liberals virtue signal with their wokeism (to an extent... I don't agree with all the whining about society's shift in being more inclusive or considerate)  conservatives obviously virtue signal with their hypocritical bible thumping and "save our children" bullshit.

Yesterday I heard one of the dumbest country songs ever called Country On by Luke Bryan. Essentially he rattles off a bunch of occupations and tells them to "country on" over and over again throughout the song, those occupations being farm boys, truck drivers, soldiers, cops, firefighters, barkeeps (lol) and cowboys. He shout outs musicians and "hometowns" too although admittedly I don't know what a hometown is.

Anyway he's clearly pandering to a certain group of people and those people seem to think that they are the "true America," that they are REAL Americans. But people born and bred in New York, Los Angeles, Washington DC et. al. are also REAL Americans, Jimbo. Doctors are true Americans. Lawyers are true Americans. Stock brokers are true Americans. These cities that rural folks hate account for where the vast majority of Americans live, where the majority of American wealth is generated and where the top 10 tourist destinations for international travelers are because they're exciting and interesting places. But middle America HATES these places and HATES the majority of their fellow Americans, constantly putting them down the same way they accuse liberal elites of snubbing their nose down on them.  

Pie said in another thread (sorry to call him out btw lol it's not about him) something along the lines of how city-folk have no business mocking the intelligence of farmers because urbanites don't know how to grow crops. Um, okay? And people visiting New York City from Oklahoma spend 13 hours trying to navigate the subway system and streets of NY which go in alphabetical and numerical order. People adapt to the demands of their environment. Obviously most New Yorkers don't know how to grow potatoes; their livelihood doesn't depend on it. An Idahoan doctor may not know how to grow potatoes either but that doesn't mean the doctor is less intelligent, less American, less patriotic or less valuable. And neither are country bumpkins... although I'm tempted to throw in that if those bumpkins are homophobic then they indeed are less valuable lol. 

The increased disdain and hatred between liberals and conservatives is really thought provoking. It's not just that they disagree - they think the other side is straight up EVIL  which is really interesting to me. And the fact that America's greatest cities are being portrayed by Fox News as third world hell holes despite being the most sought after places to live, work and visit is really wild. Can't we all just get along??? I hope everyone but Trump supporters has a nice weekend! 







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Here is a PDF of the below article from Penn State. 


Republicans can’t understand Democrats

Only one in four Republican voters felt that most or almost all Democratic voters sincerely believed they were voting in the best interests of the country.  Rather, many Republicans told us that Democratic voters were “brainwashed by the propaganda of the mainstream media,” or voting solely in their self-interest to preserve undeserved welfare and food stamp benefits.

We asked every Republican in the sample to do their best to imagine that they were a Democrat and sincerely believed that the Democratic Party was best for the country.  We asked them to explain their support for the Democratic Party as an actual Democratic voter might.  For example, a 64-year-old strong Republican man from Illinois surmised that “Democrats want to help the poor, save Social Security, and tax the rich.”   

But most had trouble looking at the world through Democratic eyes. Typical was a 59-year-old Floridian who wrote “I don’t want to work and I want cradle to grave assistance. In other words, Mommy!” Indeed, roughly one in six Republican voters answered in the persona of a Democratic voter who is motivated by “free college,” “free health care,” “free welfare,” and so on.  They see Democrats as voting in order to get “free stuff” “without having to work for it” was extremely common – roughly one in six Republican voters used the word “free” in their answers, whereas no real Democratic voters in our sample answered this way. 

Among the Republicans who seemed to try hardest to take the perspective of sincere and patriotic Democratic voters, the most common attributions were related to immigration. As in this Republican woman from Washington who said, “Democrats welcome all people into the country whether they are here legally or not.”


Democrats return the favor: Republicans uninformed or self-interested

 Democrats inferred that Republicans must be “VERY ill-informed,” or that “Fox news told me to vote for Republicans,”  or that Republicans are “uneducated and misguided people guided by what the media is feeding them.”

Many also attributed votes to individual self-interest – whereas GOP voters feel Democrats want “free stuff,” many Democrats believe Republicans think that “I got mine and don’t want the libs to take it away,” or that “some day I will be rich and then I can get the benefits that rich people get now.”

Many used the question to express their anger and outrage at the other side.  Rather than really try to take the position of their opponents, they said things like, “I like a dictatorial system of government, I’m a racist, I hate non-whites.” 


Democrats think many Republicans sincere, and point to policy

Democrats, however, were somewhat more generous in their answers.  More than four in ten Democratic voters  (42%) felt that most Republican voters had the country’s best interests at heart (combining the top two bars in the figure below).  And many tried their best to answer from the other’s perspective. A 45-year-old male voter from Ohio imagined that as a Republican, he was motivated by Republicans’ “harsh stance on immigration; standing up for the 2nd Amendment; promised tax cuts.”  A 30-year-old woman from Colorado felt that Republican votes reflected the desires to “stop abortion… stop gay marriage from ruining our country… and give us our coal jobs back.”

Other Democrats felt that their opponents were mostly motivated by the GOP’s “opposition to Obamacare,” “lower taxes” and to support a party that “reduced unemployment.” 


Taking the perspective of others proved to be really hard

The divide in the United States is wide, and one indication of that is how difficult our question proved for many thoughtful citizens. A 77-year-old Republican woman from Pennsylvania was typical of the voters who struggled with this question, telling us, “This is really hard for me to even try to think like a devilcrat!, I am sorry but I in all honesty cannot answer this question. I cannot even wrap my mind around any reason they would be good for this country.”

Similarly, a 53-year-old Republican from Virginia said, “I honestly cannot even pretend to be a Democrat and try to come up with anything positive at all, but, I guess they would vote Democrat because they are illegal immigrants and they are promised many benefits to voting for that party. Also, just to follow what others are doing. And third would be just because they hate Trump so much.” The picture she paints of the typical Democratic voter being an immigrant, who goes along with their party or simply hates Trump will seem like a strange caricature to most Democratic voters. But her answer seems to lack the animus of many.  

Democrats struggled just as much as Republicans. A 33-year-old woman from California told said, “i really am going to have a hard time doing this” but then offered that Republicans “are morally right as in values, … going to protect us from terrorist and immigrants, … going to create jobs.”

Voters like these – baffled but not hostile – would seem to represent an opportunity. Their answers tell us that they might actually be interested in better understanding those at the opposite end of the political spectrum and that motivation could be the first step of a long journey toward reducing incivility and polarization.  Whether such voters can long endure in today’s media and social media environment is a critical question – if they can endure and even grow, then the prospects for bipartisan cooperation in areas of shared concern will be possible.  If not, polarization will continue to rise.

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To me the fact that Democrats seem to agree with each other on virtually every topic, and vice versa for Republicans, always seemed to be a big clue that everyone is a bit brainwashed or beholden to pretty overt psychological biases. Is it just a coincidence that your party is right about almost everything? I guess it makes more sense to think that people from the other party are just evil and stupid rather than examine our own cognition. 
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I should add that I know the whole GOP doesn't make $40,000 a year (they've been the party supported by most rich elites for obvious reasons) nor do I mean to disparage those making 40K in any way, shape or form. I'm saying that people in middle America making 40K a year only see THEMSELVES as "working class" while considering urbanites making 40K "lazy" or "freeloaders" or whatever. I was pointing out the mindset of a particular group of people (the group that Luke Bryan is pandering to in his dumb song) who think that just because they might be less educated or less wealthy that they can't be elitist also, because that is exactly what they are. They look down on atheists, they look down on LGBT people, they look down on higher education, they look down on people living in towns with populations greater than 200,000, etc. 
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@Danielle
What do you think of the philosophy that ying and yang need to be embraced and not derided in a functioning society?
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@Danielle

Republicans are Worm Man and Democrats are Intelligent Man.
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@Danielle
Anyway he's clearly pandering to a certain group of people and those people seem to think that they are the "true America," that they are REAL Americans. But people born and bred in New York, Los Angeles, Washington DC et. al. are also REAL Americans, Jimbo. Doctors are true Americans. Lawyers are true Americans. Stock brokers are true Americans. These cities that rural folks hate account for where the vast majority of Americans live, where the majority of American wealth is generated and where the top 10 tourist destinations for international travelers are because they're exciting and interesting places. But middle America HATES these places and HATES the majority of their fellow Americans, constantly putting them down the same way they accuse liberal elites of snubbing their nose down on them
Most of the people I’ve known who are most like that aren’t rural people themselves but the type of people who drive an off road truck that never goes off road and live in the suburbs. I think there’s a lot of deeper emotional issues going on with the sorts of people who hate city dwellers or think that people are constantly looking down on them (instead of just not really thinking about them at all.) They want to imagine themselves as salt of the earth farmers or oil field roughnecks because maybe their grandparents or something were even though they work in finance for a Fortune 500 company.  I haven’t heard that particular song but I’ve heard similar cringey country songs like that and they all reek of projection and insecurity 
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@FLRW
So you disagree with the OP?
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@Danielle
Most of the Urban areas are extremely divided on Class lines with castes and alarmingly increasingly so. This is reflected in not only wealth inequality metrics but education gaps as well.

Of course within such a system, Being in the upper caste is highly sought after, but the migration statistics prove most people cannot make it.
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@Greyparrot

I'm just stating the big picture.


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@FLRW
So was the OP, but clearly you disagree with the parts of the OP that denounced it.

Your objectively cheeky and thoughtless post demonstrates the very reason why Danielle took the time to write the OP. 

It's a shame your opinion has spread through the country like a plague, shared by primalistic tribal sycophants with no thought to the future.

A mindset that heralds the eventual doom of America.
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Anyway he's clearly pandering to a certain group of people and those people seem to think that they are the "true America," that they are REAL Americans. But people born and bred in New York, Los Angeles, Washington DC et. al. are also REAL Americans, Jimbo.
I think its important to note here that 80% of Americans live in those metropolitan areas.  That's a rapidly shrinking 20% telling the overwhelming majority of Americans that they don't represent the American experience when the exact opposite is true.  The real question here is why, in a democracy, should that 80% give so much deference that 20%?   The American experience hasn't been a majority urban experience since the Great Depression and the "real" America Pie refers to has been declining unchecked since the Battle of Gettysburg.

Consider-

Biden won only 509 counties in the 2020 election compared to Trump's 2,547 counties but those 1 out of every 6 counties are home to 67 million more Americans than those 5 out of 6 and generate 71 cents of every dollar in American GDP.  American cities are the engine that drives the American economy, rural counties produce a power net drag on the economy.

While death rates have been declining across the US for the last 30 years (since Americans mostly stopped smoking) , but that decline is twice as fast in the cities vs the country to the point where now city-dwellers enjoy nearly 3 years longer avg. life expectancy than rural folks.  "Country" was about 20% more likely to die from the top ten leading causes of death, from heart attacks to suicide than "City."  Trump counties committed suicide at a 43% higher rate in 2019 than Biden voting counties, almost certainly because of the strong link between suicide rates and gun ownership.   Those stats are before COVID but Trump voting counties' death rates from COVID were 2.5-3 times the rates in Biden voting counties, despite much higher transmission rates in the city.

Look at quality of life indexes, education rates, public safety, health outcomes, civic engagement, unemployment, labor force participation- that 80% of America living in cities run by overwhelmingly democratic governments is living far far better than the 20% Pie calls the real American and improving all the time while life in Republican run rural counties are in long-term generally sustained decline.

city-folk have no business mocking the intelligence of farmers because urbanites don't know how to grow crops
In fact, most agricultural jobs have already been replaced by machines and the demand for future American farmers is less than zero.  Country life is far less efficient, safe, or healthy than life in the city and given that the infrastructure and tax dollars required to sustain,  country life is far, far more expensive to taxpayers than life in the city.   America needs stop overfunding this less sustainable lifestyle.  I'm not saying that we need to drag anybody in from the countryside, but certainly rural residents need to pay more of their proportional share of the greater expense it takes to deliver water, electricity, internet, etc to those homes.  Insurance rates for hurricanes, flooding, forest fires, etc need to reflect the wildly disproportionate expense to Americans rural inhabitants represents.  When  rural counties are required to pay their fair share for infrastructure, rural lifestyles will become a luxury most can't afford and American prosperity will be all the more improved by that change.

Certainly, there's a generous and egalitarian spirit to your appeal for Americans to get along on either side of that divide but let's not mistake that divide for the "other half of America," because that's quite false.  The 80% of America that Pie calls "not real" could lose his 20% of  "real" Americans tomorrow and be all the more prosperous, healthy, wealthy, and wise for the ejection. 

In a democracy, the majority rules, and that majority needs to work harder to make sure their substantially greater contribution to the US is preserved and protected from 19th century agrarian, patriarchal public policy. 50 Republican Senators represent just over a third of all Americans.  Without some Constitutional amendment before 2040, two thirds of Americans will likely be  represented by jut 30 Senators.  The fact is that if America were just a little more democratic in its institutions that 80% of America wouldn't have much reason to care what the more backwards 20% think at all.  Trumpists fully understand this dynamic which is why folks like Pie don't believe that America should be a democracy anymore.
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You can thank Plato and his "Philosopher Kings" for the evolution of this divide...he codified the whole "we appoint ourselves the 'wise ones' and give ourselves leave to exercise dominion over everyone we consider inferior to ourselves" mentality so prevalent in Western civilization, particularly in American academia, and thus provided an intellectually "respectable argument" for a thoroughly corrupt social order.


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@oromagi
Look at quality of life indexes, education rates, public safety, health outcomes, civic engagement, unemployment, labor force participation- that 80% of America living in cities run by overwhelmingly democratic governments is living far far better than the 20% Pie calls the real American and improving all the time while life in Republican run rural counties are in long-term generally sustained decline.
I mean yea rural areas aren’t doing that well generally but most of the best places by those QOL indexes are suburban areas that are either red or purple, not deep blue. I think the petty finger pointing of “your places are shitholes! No YOUR places are shitholes!” is counterproductive, there are good and bad places that are red and blue, rich and poor places that are red and blue etc. 
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@oromagi
Biden won only 509 counties in the 2020 election compared to Trump's 2,547 counties but those 1 out of every 6 counties are home to 67 million more Americans than those 5 out of 6 and generate 71 cents of every dollar in American GDP.  American cities are the engine that drives the American economy, rural counties produce a power net drag on the economy.…The fact is that if America were just a little more democratic in its institutions that 80% of America wouldn't have much reason to care what the more backwards 20% think at all.  
I don’t think this is a particularly honest framing. Biden beat Trump by only 4 points so it’s not accurate to say that 80% of the country was for Biden while 20% was for Trump. Trump got a lot of votes in those urban and suburban counties. The beating heart of the GOP isn’t really rural voters because there aren’t enough of them anymore, it’s white suburban and exurban voters, especially those with high incomes but without college degrees. Also pitching your “reforms” as “now we won’t have reason to care what you think at all!” Is saying the quiet part out loud I think lol

 Country life is far less efficient, safe, or healthy than life in the city and given that the infrastructure and tax dollars required to sustain,  country life is far, far more expensive to taxpayers than life in the city.   America needs stop overfunding this less sustainable lifestyle.  I'm not saying that we need to drag anybody in from the countryside, but certainly rural residents need to pay more of their proportional share of the greater expense it takes to deliver water, electricity, internet, etc to those homes.  Insurance rates for hurricanes, flooding, forest fires, etc need to reflect the wildly disproportionate expense to Americans rural inhabitants represents.  When  rural counties are required to pay their fair share for infrastructure, rural lifestyles will become a luxury most can't afford and American prosperity will be all the more improved by that change.
it’s true that the GDP generated by actual rural areas doesn’t come anywhere close to what it takes to bring modern day amenities to such a huge landmass. But I always viewed that as a positive thing about America, that the country is so wealthy that there are paved interstates and state highways, almost universal access to electricity and running water. The great progressive heroes like FDR and LBJ were so popular in the rural south for so long because they brought them electricity. If you go to rural areas of China or India or even Russia there are places only accessible by dirt roads or dangerous roads, no electricity or running water, etc.

Is that really what you want for America? Because outside of some tourist hot spots I don’t know if there are any rural areas where they don’t effectively get subsidized by urban areas. But rural areas are where food is grown, where natural resources are extracted, and where unpleasant places like slaughterhouses or these days some factories are. The city and the country need each other. The city can’t produce the natural/agricultural resources it needs to keep running and the country can’t produce the type of wealth that first world citizens demand
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@thett3
it’s not accurate to say that 80% of the country was for Biden while 20% was for Trump.
Never said that.  Read it again.

The 80/20 split is urban/rural not Biden/Trump.
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@thett3
 Also pitching your “reforms” as “now we won’t have reason to care what you think at all!” Is saying the quiet part out loud I think lol
The final solution, Hitler style.
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@oromagi
Never said that.  Read it again.

The 80/20 split is urban/rural not Biden/Trump.
I know. But the implication of what you’re saying is very very obvious. The democrats give and the republicans take, the democrats produce and the republicans leach—which isn’t really accurate at all. Lots of people who live in urban areas vote red, especially suburbs and exurbs. And it’s true that cities subsidize the rural areas having things like paved roads and electricity but I think most people would agree that a small portion of the relatively light tax burden Americans pay is worth it to ensure that like 95% of the landmass of their country isn’t in 3rd world conditions 


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@thett3
It's likely intellectuals view support to rural areas as foreign aid with strings attached.
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@Greyparrot
It's likely intellectuals view support to rural areas as foreign aid with strings attached.
That would probably be a healthier outlook on it lol. Oragami says “I'm not saying that we need to drag anybody in from the countryside, but certainly rural residents need to pay more of their proportional share of the greater expense it takes to deliver water, electricity, internet, etc to those homes.” 

But I don’t think they really CAN! It costs a LOT to build roads across a continent sized country or bring electricity and running water (things everyone has had for multiple generations now) to far out places. But those same roads are the roads through which the truckers haul the food and goods! Even counties of no economic importance, little agriculture and no natural resources, absurdly small populations…they can’t afford paved roads by themselves. But you gotta drive through them sometimes. Interstate 80 becoming an unpaved road when it goes through those counties in rural Nevada that have 12,000 people and are the size of New Jersey wouldn’t be a good thing for urban areas either. No electricity in those places means no truck stops or gas stations etc. Luckily the people running the country are smart enough to realize that. It’s not so simple to say “this area isnt paying its fair share in taxes, cut it off”
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All that said I would agree that a lot of rural people don’t realize how subsidized their existence really is (necessarily!) and have attitudes just as foolishly negative towards urban people. Danielles post isn’t wrong 
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@thett3
It's not wrong. Instead of embracing the social yin and yang, people lazily pursue the final solution through Democratic mob rule and the elimination of anything that is "not them"

That approach has disastrous, unintended consequences.
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@Danielle
It's a culture war for sure. And yeah, I am tired of the constant bullshit from "country" America. They still think we have freedom, or that this country is the greatest in the world when it is in fact, a shithole. Boomers can construct the worst economic situation in the world and these people would go "just work harder" or some other cope. Plus, a lot of them will get divorced and then die on opioids. It's a shame really. But don't think that urban American gets off any easier because they also have a smug attitude about the rural folk.

Plus, the cities have always been more liberal. Hell, cities are the BIRTHPLACE of liberalism via coffee shops that spread enlightenment ideas. The socialist commune was established in PARIS after all, not Mittelbergheim.

In the end, I'll take Spengler's view-when cities stop being commercial units and instead start being sprawling conglomerates then that is when things get bad. I will probably still prefer country living when I am older though, kinda tired and bored of suburbia. I am lucky to live in New England where the rural areas get nice in the fall and they are still quint, romantic new england colonial towns.
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@thett3
Is that really what you want for America? Because outside of some tourist hot spots I don’t know if there are any rural areas where they don’t effectively get subsidized by urban areas. But rural areas are where food is grown, where natural resources are extracted, and where unpleasant places like slaughterhouses or these days some factories are. The city and the country need each other. The city can’t produce the natural/agricultural resources it needs to keep running and the country can’t produce the type of wealth that first world citizens demand
Its exactly that interdependency that makes rural residency unsustainable.   We need better public management of critical resources like arable land and fresh water.  I'm not trying to be extreme:  we will always need people to work and manage rural resources.  We will always want to be be able to visit places of natural beauty or escape to oases of solitude but we can manage all that with far fewer people than are living rural now.  Have you ever read Omnivore's Dilemma and Pollan's description of the State of Iowa as one vast factory floor devoted to corn production, overusing the land so aggressively that it becomes increasingly less regenerable to its natural prairie state with each passing year?  How there used to vast stretches without any deer or squirrels because so much land was just an endless carpet of corn (I think Iowa has done much to improve this state in recent years).  That's the kind of unsustainable living I'm thinking of.  As you say, some factories like slaughterhouses are unpleasant places to live near but that's usually because they are incredibly toxic- we need to protect vital resources from the inevitable pollution and accidents that comes with such places- that means large scale re-zoning and planning and little of that is possible at the current level or rural residency.  Certainly, we need to re-think the amount of land devoted to hyper-inefficient calorie production like cows and pigs.   I like the idea of low-impact portable  micro-housing as a more sustainable way to maintain rural populations. I don't like the idea of building some house out in the woods that has to be protected from wildfires every few years at greater public expense than than the value of the house.  I don't like throwing public money at rebuilding beachfronts and swamp towns after every hurricane comes through.  With greater population density, we can protect smaller areas more effectively from disaster and let the natural, even necessary processes of fires and hurricanes do their thing without ruining so many lives.

I could go on for hours and the whole notion is isuper complex but the short answer is yes, I that's what I want for America- it's really the only path I can see for preserving a natural, rural America for generations of Americans to come.
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@oromagi
We need better public management of critical resources like arable land and fresh water.  I'm not trying to be extreme:  we will always need people to work and manage rural resources.  We will always want to be be able to visit places of natural beauty or escape to oases of solitude but we can manage all that with far fewer people than are living rural now.  Have you ever read Omnivore's Dilemma and Pollan's description of the State of Iowa as one vast factory floor devoted to corn production, overusing the land so aggressively that it becomes increasingly less regenerable to its natural prairie state with each passing year?  How there used to vast stretches without any deer or squirrels because so much land was just an endless carpet of corn (I think Iowa has done much to improve this state in recent years).  That's the kind of unsustainable living I'm thinking of.  
I 1000% agree that crop monoculture is bad. But that’s a land use issue, it has nothing to do with your compliant which was that urban areas have to subsidize rural areas getting roads, electricity, and running water. 

As you say, some factories like slaughterhouses are unpleasant places to live near but that's usually because they are incredibly toxic- we need to protect vital resources from the inevitable pollution and accidents that comes with such places- that means large scale re-zoning and planning and little of that is possible at the current level or rural residency.  Certainly, we need to re-think the amount of land devoted to hyper-inefficient calorie production like cows and pigs.
I fail to see how supporting preventing accidents has anything to do with complaining about subsidizing roads, electricity, and running water to rural areas. Obviously it’s best if there’s as little contamination or leakage as possible but accidents are inevitable so it’s better to build nasty things out away from people if you can

I don't like the idea of building some house out in the woods that has to be protected from wildfires every few years at greater public expense than than the value of the house.  I don't like throwing public money at rebuilding beachfronts and swamp towns after every hurricane comes through.  With greater population density, we can protect smaller areas more effectively from disaster and let the natural, even necessary processes of fires and hurricanes do their thing without ruining so many lives.
Rural areas are more likely to be hit with natural disasters simply because they constitute the overwhelming majority of the countries landmass. If you think funding to help communities recover from natural disasters is a waste of public funds you can make that argument but really FEMA is a drop in the bucket when it comes to the federal budget. There are probably some places that are so consistently disaster prone that human habitation doesn’t make sense, but people wouldn’t be there in the first place without some economic purpose or some overwhelming natural beauty, so clearing communities out in either case requires some trade offs. 


Greyparrot
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@thett3
I 1000% agree that crop monoculture is bad. But that’s a land use issue, it has nothing to do with your compliant which was that urban areas have to subsidize rural areas getting roads, electricity, and running water. 
I find it absolutely weird that central-planning fans act concerned about monocropping when the same central planners made that possible through endless corn subsidies and ethanol propaganda.
oromagi
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@thett3
d. But that’s a land use issue, it has nothing to do with your compliant which was that urban areas have to subsidize rural areas getting roads, electricity, and running water.   I fail to see how supporting preventing accidents has anything to do with complaining about subsidizing roads, electricity, and running water to rural areas. 
The complaint was not about about subsidizing roads, electricity, and running water to rural areas. The complaint was that 20% of rural Americans calling themselves the REAL Americans when  "the 80% of America that Pie calls "not real" could lose his 20% of  "real" Americans tomorrow and be all the more prosperous, healthy, wealthy, and wise for the ejection."  

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@Danielle
people need to figure out that trump, biden, bush, regan, clinton, and even barak obama are all in the RIGHT TOP QUAD

people on the "left" don't even know what the "left" is

people on the "right" don't even know what the "right" is
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@Greyparrot
I find it absolutely weird that central-planning fans act concerned about monocropping when the same central planners made that possible through endless corn subsidies and ethanol propaganda.
they decided they want to put the rest of the "independent" farmers out of business so they can buy up all the farmland
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@Danielle
for example,