Instigator / Con
6
1503
rating
26
debates
46.15%
won
Topic

Theyby

Status
Finished

All stages have been completed. The voting points distribution and the result are presented below.

Arguments points
0
6
Sources points
2
4
Spelling and grammar points
2
2
Conduct points
2
2

With 2 votes and 8 points ahead, the winner is ...

sigmaphil
Parameters
More details
Publication date
Last update date
Category
Health
Time for argument
Two days
Voting system
Open voting
Voting period
One week
Point system
Four points
Rating mode
Rated
Characters per argument
10,000
Contender / Pro
14
1557
rating
7
debates
71.43%
won
Description
~ 46 / 5,000

A debate about the theyby, the genderless baby

Round 1
Con
Theyby: Genderless/gender-neutral Baby.


That's what meaning I'm going for.

Ok, now reasons:

1. Real Identity

One of the main cons of theybies is that of a child questioning their identity, are they male or female?
2. Big Responsibility 
It's harder for them to create their own identity, it's like giving a newborn child the opportunity to name themselves. They'd have names like "Wahhh" or other gibberish names, which just aren't practical. When it comes to deciding if a baby is male or female it's up to mother nature.

3. The Main Benefit Probably Won't Work Out
Theybies will be mixed with gender-assigned children, so it'll be really hard. It'll also be hard for adults, to use gender-neutral pronouns, and change the way they speak.

Pro
I would like to thank my opponent for the opportunity to debate this Topic, "Theyby" also known as gender-neutral parenting.

I am taking the Pro side, which means I need to show that raising Theyby children is a viable way of raising children.  I do not feel I need to disprove gender-specific parenting, just that gender-neutral parenting is a viable alternative.

Rebuttal

Theyby: Genderless/gender-neutral Baby. 


That's what meaning I'm going for.
Understood, but - and maybe I'm stating the obvious - I would like to clarify for my arguments that a Theybe is not truly genderless biologically speaking.  They do have gender "parts".  To me, this is an argument about whether it is a viable option for Theybies to be raised without their guardian's overbearing stereotypical gender influence on them.  Additionally, since Theybies is a fairly new thing, voters will need to judge on common sense and reasoning and not on fully tested clinical studies.


Ok, now reasons:

1. Real Identity

One of the main cons of theybies is that of a child questioning their identity, are they male or female?
When they "discover" their sexual organs (puberty?), I think this may help answer their questions of whether they are male or female.  Plus their parent's at that point can explain the difference between male and female, but do it in a non-sexist way  So not a negative.

2. Big Responsibility 
It's harder for them to create their own identity, it's like giving a newborn child the opportunity to name themselves. They'd have names like "Wahhh" or other gibberish names, which just aren't practical. When it comes to deciding if a baby is male or female it's up to mother nature.
This argument does not follow for me.  How can it be harder for Theybies to create their own identity?  If anything Theybies would have an easier time since there is no external pressure on them to conform to gender stereotypes. 

3. The Main Benefit Probably Won't Work Out
Theybies will be mixed with gender-assigned children, so it'll be really hard. It'll also be hard for adults, to use gender-neutral pronouns, and change the way they speak.
How can it be harder for adults to use gender-neutral pronouns?  Again it seems easier to me to just call every child, "they" instead of putting the onerous on the adult to use gender-specific pronouns.  One word says it all.

I will use my opponent's sources to bolster my own arguments since my opponent's sources include a pro side

Argument

I just want to get this out in the open, if you'll excuse the expression, I am against Parents that raise Theybies in a way that allows them to choose a gender.  As a Christian, I believe children that have boy parts are boys and children that have girl parts are girls.  To me raising a child as a Theybe does not mean encouraging sexual reassignment surgery because Johnny wants to now be Juanita.  This is taking Theybe to the extreme.  My understanding and support for the Pro side of Theybies is all about Freedom.

Raising a child gender-neutral encourages them to exercise their Freedom...

  1. To be Themselves - By not raising the child in a gender-specific environment it allows the child the freedom to be themselves.  (e.g. painting a girls room pink and putting princess stickers on the wall.)
  2. To Choose - Maybe Johnny would rather have an Easy Bake Oven instead of a Nerf Dart Rifle.  Or maybe Mary would rather have a Transformer instead of a Barbie Doll.  Let them choose!
  3. To Dream - Children should be encouraged to be anything they want in life.  Let them dream.  There should be no gender barriers of entry set up for them to achieve their dream. 
Conclusion

Parents should raise their children as Theybies without gender stereotypes.  This will allow them to grow up without preconceived gender restrictions and allow them to be all that they can be.

I believe I have shown through common sense and reasoning that raising a Theybe is a viable alternative to traditional gender-specific parenting.  Please vote for Pro.

Round 2
Con
When they "discover" their sexual organs (puberty?), I think this may help answer their questions of whether they are male or female.  Plus their parent's at that point can explain the difference between male and female, but do it in a non-sexist way  So not a negative.
But what are they in their hearts? What if they think they are female but shocked to see that their male? What if they don't want to be gay, but they chose too? 
This argument does not follow for me.  How can it be harder for Theybies to create their own identity?  If anything Theybies would have an easier time since there is no external pressure on them to conform to gender stereotypes. 
I'm saying that it's too big of a responsibility for babies to decide. It gives them an un-needed thinking period.
How can it be harder for adults to use gender-neutral pronouns?  Again it seems easier to me to just call every child, "they" instead of putting the onerous on the adult to use gender-specific pronouns.  One word says it all.
It's harder for them because they are so used so used to saying he/she. For example in French, ALL NOUNS are based off of feminine or masculine things so France needs to recreate their entire language just because of these "theybies". 

  1. To be Themselves - By not raising the child in a gender-specific environment it allows the child the freedom to be themselves.  (e.g. painting a girls room pink and putting princess stickers on the wall.)
  1.  Other kids might mix into this, they would have friends wouldn't they?
To Choose - Maybe Johnny would rather have an Easy Bake Oven instead of a Nerf Dart Rifle.  Or maybe Mary would rather have a Transformer instead of a Barbie Doll.  Let them choose!
I feel as if parents already let their kids choose, Johnny might want an EBO, and he asks his parents. It's just his friends make fun of him right? Who has an ez back oven? Friends make fun of them.
To Dream - Children should be encouraged to be anything they want in life.  Let them dream.  There should be no gender barriers of entry set up for them to achieve their dream. 
What if they're male and they want to be a female. They will be biased in the workplace, so theybies actually can lose someone an advantage.

I will use my opponent's sources to bolster my own arguments since my opponent's sources include a pro side
Vote me for sources
-----
Thanks for the debate
Vote for con



Pro
I thank my opponent for their thoughtful and considered response.  My rebuttal and final argument are below.

Rebuttal


I will use my opponent's sources to bolster my own arguments since my opponent's sources include a pro side
Vote me for sources
I added some new sources for support to my rebuttal in my second argument.  So sources are not a clear cut win for Con.  The sources are linked within the rebuttal.


When they "discover" their sexual organs (puberty?), I think this may help answer their questions of whether they are male or female.  Plus their parent's at that point can explain the difference between male and female, but do it in a non-sexist way  So not a negative.
But what are they in their hearts? What if they think they are female but shocked to see that their male? What if they don't want to be gay, but they chose too? 
Why would they be shocked?  They are being raised gender-neutral, so they have no pre-conceived notion of gender.

If they don't want to be gay then that is their choice, which is the beauty of raising Theybies, freedom of choice


This argument does not follow for me.  How can it be harder for Theybies to create their own identity?  If anything Theybies would have an easier time since there is no external pressure on them to conform to gender stereotypes.  
I'm saying that it's too big of a responsibility for babies to decide. It gives them an un-needed thinking period.
Maybe I am misunderstanding my opponent's original argument.  It sounds to me like my opponent is making the argument that babies can decide their gender?
According to my source (linked here) children are unable to identify letters until the age of between 2 and 3 and cannot say heir ABC's until they are between 4 to 5 years of age.  My point being that babies are certainly unable to choose their gender because their brains are not developed enough.

How can it be harder for adults to use gender-neutral pronouns?  Again it seems easier to me to just call every child, "they" instead of putting the onerous on the adult to use gender-specific pronouns.  One word says it all.
It's harder for them because they are so used so used to saying he/she. For example in French, ALL NOUNS are based off of feminine or masculine things so France needs to recreate their entire language just because of these "theybies". 
I will concede it may be harder for French-speaking parents to use gender-neutral pronouns.

  1. To be Themselves - By not raising the child in a gender-specific environment it allows the child the freedom to be themselves.  (e.g. painting a girls room pink and putting princess stickers on the wall.)
  1.  Other kids might mix into this, they would have friends wouldn't they?
Don't know how to rebut this since I don't understand my opponent's point.  If my opponent is asking if Theybies have friends, my answer would be yes, most likely.  It would depend on how friendly they are themselves.  You know what the Good Book says, "A man who has friends must himself be friendly," Proverbs 18:24

To Choose - Maybe Johnny would rather have an Easy Bake Oven instead of a Nerf Dart Rifle.  Or maybe Mary would rather have a Transformer instead of a Barbie Doll.  Let them choose!
I feel as if parents already let their kids choose, Johnny might want an EBO, and he asks his parents. It's just his friends make fun of him right? Who has an ez back oven? Friends make fun of them. 
So is it better for children to be raised by friends who make fun of them (Bullies) or by their parents who love them?  I'm speaking rhetorically of course.   The obvious choice is loving parents.

To Dream - Children should be encouraged to be anything they want in life.  Let them dream.  There should be no gender barriers of entry set up for them to achieve their dream. 
What if they're male and they want to be a female. They will be biased in the workplace, so theybies actually can lose someone an advantage.
I assume once they are old enough to work they have chosen their gender.  It's up to others to accept or reject them.  This is not a burden that should be borne by Theybies.  In fact, in some countries, it would be considered a hate crime, which is against the law.

Final Argument

I have no further arguments needed because I feel like I made my points well.

Conclusion

I was tasked with proving that raising a child as gender-neutral, a Theybe, is a viable alternative to gender-specific parenting.  I believe I have achieved that task.  Please vote Pro!

I want to thank my opponent for an excellent debate!