Instigator / Con
7
1482
rating
24
debates
41.67%
won
Topic
#4610
Transgender individuals should have the right to self-identify their gender without requiring medical or legal interventions.
Status
Finished
The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.
Winner & statistics
Better arguments
0
9
Better sources
4
6
Better legibility
2
3
Better conduct
1
3
After 3 votes and with 14 points ahead, the winner is...
Bella3sp
Judges
whiteflame
27 debates /
196 votes
Voted
Lemming
6 debates /
38 votes
Voted
Sir.Lancelot
182 debates /
79 votes
No vote
Mps1213
11 debates /
7 votes
Voted
Parameters
- Publication date
- Last updated date
- Type
- Standard
- Number of rounds
- 4
- Time for argument
- Two days
- Max argument characters
- 20,000
- Voting period
- One week
- Point system
- Multiple criterions
- Voting system
- Judges
Contender / Pro
21
1524
rating
53
debates
75.47%
won
Description
No information
Round 1
Con
#1
Argument
I'm arguing that transgender individuals should not have the right to self-identify their gender without requiring medical or legal interventions. Medical and legal fields are very serious and should apply to non trans people. It's been applying to men and women and should continue to do so. If interventions accept transgender individuals, it would cause issues. For example when it comes to medical, a transgender person would be affected differently than it would a biological man or woman.
Definitions
Medical intervention - In medicine, a treatment, procedure, or other action taken to prevent or treat disease, or improve health in other ways. (1)
Legal intervention - A legal term that refers to the act of a third party entering into an ongoing lawsuit with the permission of a judge. (2)
Types of medical interventions: (3)
- Vaccines
- Nutritional interventions
- Maternal and neonatal interventions
- Education and behavior change
- Environmental alterations
- Vector and intermediate host control
- Drugs for the prevention of disease
- Injury prevention
Sources:
Pro
#2
Oh shoot.. I gotta speedrun this. I'll add on later.
Thanks Devon as well as judges,
Point:
Case:
My case is, for the most part, straight forward.
I will be providing the following:
- Transgender people do not need approval to express their gender or change gender
- Expressing and changing your gender (self-identitying) should not be consulted by anyone else by requirment but rather a right
- Transgender people do not need to be "cured" or changed to meet stanards
- Transgender people do not need permission by court
- But overall, mostly, transgender people don't need requirments to self-identity
Burden:
Burden is shared with both users.
As the tournament states: "All topics are on-balance."
Besides that, pro needs to prove that transgender individuals should have the right to self-identify their gender without requiring medical or legal interventions.
While as con needs to prove transgender individuals should not have the right to self-identify their gender without requiring medical or legal interventions.
Defintions:
Provided from Con:
Medical intervention - In medicine, a treatment, procedure, or other action taken to prevent or treat disease, or improve health in other ways. (1)Legal intervention - A legal term that refers to the act of a third party entering into an ongoing lawsuit with the permission of a judge. (2)
Both accepted.
Gender:
Gender refers to the socially constructed roles, behaviours, expressions and identities of girls, women, boys, men, and gender diverse people. It influences how people perceive themselves and each other, how they act and interact, and the distribution of power and resources in society. Gender identity is not confined to a binary (girl/woman, boy/man) nor is it static; it exists along a continuum and can change over time. There is considerable diversity in how individuals and groups understand, experience and express gender through the roles they take on, the expectations placed on them, relations with others and the complex ways that gender is institutionalized in society
Require:
to claim or ask for by right and authority
Implications
Based on the resolution, we are to assume that in order for transgender individuals to self-identify their gender, they would require medical or legal intervention.
Therefore, as part of my burden I must adresss the following:
- Why transgender don't need such interventions to be required
But overall, transgender don't need any requirments to self-identify.
We can also assume two things about the resolution of medial intervention:
- Medical intervention to cure transgender
- Medical intervention to make you more so, like your transgender, gender.
^^ The following above are both uneeded.
Contentions
Interventions are unnecessary to self-identify
Interventions to change someobodys body
Nobody should have to fit under the standards of changing their body through surgrey unless wanted. If someone wants to express their gender, without changing their body it should be allowed.
Self-identification provides a welcoming environment to thoses who are transgender. One does not need medical intervention to express themselves, you do not need to identify as a girl and be changed to meet the standards of one. Gender should be free to all, regardless.
Ireland (and other countries) has self-identification for transgender
Ireland, one of the many countries, has had self-identification for transgender people and has seeminly no problem ever since it has been introduced along with the other countries.
Medical requirements/intervention problems
Medical intervention can cause transgender people to be forced to undergo into unwanted surgrey or intrusive gatekeeping. Making medical intervention a requirement to become transgender is completely harmful when it is unwanted, and a violation of their body for expressioning their gender identify.
Rebuttals:
I'm arguing that transgender individuals should not have the right to self-identify their gender without requiring medical or legal interventions. Medical and legal fields are very serious and should apply to non trans people. It's been applying to men and women and should continue to do so. If interventions accept transgender individuals, it would cause issues. For example when it comes to medical, a transgender person would be affected differently than it would a biological man or woman.
Aren't I supposed to be saying that intervention should not be required?-
I'll get into the rebuttals a bit more in depth next round.
Round 2
Pro
#4
While I wait for con, let me reinstate my contentions a bit more clearly this time. And I will do the same next round.
Contentions
Interventions are unnecessary to self-identify
Why should someone have to change their biological selves in order to self-identify? Anyone who is transgender should have the right, without changing their body at all, to self-identify. Societies standards of what a woman or male is, or how to correctly identify as one should never apply.
Transgender people should have the right to self-identify as whatever they personally choose, without needing to fit silly terms to make society more comfortable. Some transgender people feel comfortable with their bodies as it is, some want to change their bodies. That's a choice. It shouldn't be a requirement to change themselves without their entire approval just to identify how they feel comfortable.
Transgender people do not need others to confirm their status for them, everyone is capable of doing that themselves.
Examples of required medical interventions specifically for trans:
- Diagnosed with gender dysphoria
- Prove they have lived as their acquired gender for two years to legally change gender.
- Require trans people to undergo medical treatment or surgery.
^^^ All three of the following above should not be required under any circumstances. For one, not every person that is transgender has gender dysphoria. For two, what determines how a person has lived as their acquired gender? Is their a requirement to live a certain gender? No, there's not. Specifically with the last one, someone as I have already stated, should not have to change their bodies to identify as a certain gender.
Medical requirements/intervention problems
I have already stated above this contention why it is unnecessary and I believe it clearly shows itself how this can cause problems.
This is unwanted and can cause discomfort for many transgender people.
Running out of time..
Source:
Round 3
Criterion
Con
Tie
Pro
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:
Unfortunately, not much to say here. I thought Con might be able to present an interesting argument about when personal perception affects the way societies interact with individuals, and there were certainly the makings of such an argument in Con's first round, but they're missing key warrants. Forfeiting the next 3 rounds guaranteed a loss, and particularly with Pro's extensive response, the lack of continued argument from Con is glaring. Hence, arguments and conduct to Pro.
Criterion
Con
Tie
Pro
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:
Devon missed too much of the debate,
And didn't really get beyond the stating of position,
Bella3sp was around for all the debate, by making 'any arguments, made better arguments than none,
Perhaps Bella3sp's arguments would have developed more if Devon had been around, but life calls, and one get's sidetracked.
Sources, both sides used roughly same amount,
Both sides understandable,
Devon apologized in comments, for missing debate, "Sorry I got really sidetracked. Not making any excuses." - #5
All good, it happens.
Sorry I got really sidetracked. Not making any excuses. Thanks for the opportunity and great job Bella. I'll do better in the next topic.
Should be a quick vote being that most of Devon's rounds were forfeited.
I'll have my vote finished by today.
Start thinking about your guys' next topic and post about it on the Tournament Entry thread.
Sorry about that judges, and Devon. I rushed on the last fifteen minutes.
I'll try to clear up my contentions and rebuttals a lot better next round.
I invited you to be a judge in The Tournament.
This is the first debate so far.
Others will be coming up shortly.