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@Double_R
Why do you bother?
Because I find your partisan fan-fiction incredibly entertaining.
Cancergate
Posts
Total:
91
Yes
Make America Gag Again, MAGA.
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@Shila
You are deeply entrenched in MAGA.
I believe it was George Carlin who once said "never argue with stupid people. They'll bring you down to their level and then beat you with their experience".
I disagree. Why allow them to have that advantage?
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@Double_R
So what?If intellectual honesty doesn't matter, then nothing.
I mean, it's user generated forum content. My expectations are pretty low.
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@Greyparrot
Why do you bother?Because I find your partisan fan-fiction incredibly entertaining.
So your best explanation is that you act like an ignorant child because you enjoy trolling. Cool.
You are right about one thing though, I am a partisan. Was always clearly left but never considered myself partisan before until Trump came along. Once the republican party coalesced against things like civility, maturity, professionalism, democracy, and the very idea of knowing what you're doing (aka expertise), yeah... Since that became the divide in our politics my side is predetermined.
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@Double_R
Cool, enjoy the purity test crusade bro.
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@Greyparrot
It has nothing to do with purity, these are bottom of the barrel expectations of leadership in any civilized society.
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@Double_R
You are deeply entrenched in MAGA.I believe it was George Carlin who once said "never argue with stupid people. They'll bring you down to their level and then beat you with their experience".I disagree. Why allow them to have that advantage?
What did he have to say about MAGA people like you?
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@Shila
There may be a confusion of terms here. What are you calling MAGA?
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@Double_R
There may be a confusion of terms here. What are you calling MAGA?
Make America Gag Again.
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@Double_R
Right... So you have a problem with mainstream media lying about a politician's physical state, but when Trump's own white house physician tells us Trump is in perfect health and weighs 215 (same as Tom Brady who is the same height), you have no issue no matter how cartoonishly ridiculous that is.
What are you trying to say? Fat men can be very sharp. Obesity has nothing to do with cancer or mental acuity. What about Churchill? He was overweight. And, all the fat monarchs over the centuries?
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@Double_R
Once the republican party coalesced against things like civility, maturity, professionalism, democracy, and the very idea of knowing what you're doing (aka expertise), yeah... Since that became the divide in our politics my side is predetermined.
No one is a real professional. Are you living in a fantasy land?
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@yachilviveyachali
What are you trying to say?
That most of the people ranting about Biden's health cover up are massive hypocrites
Obesity has nothing to do with cancer or mental acuity. What about Churchill? He was overweight.
You should pay closer attention before responding.
My point had nothing to do with a tie between obesity and leadership, I am talking about the extent to which the political right has in real life gone far beyond that which they are acusing the left of. I use the weight example not because it is critical, but because it's objective and cartoonishly ridiculous. The point there is to highlight the fact that they lie openly and without abandon when it comes to the dear leader's state.
We can debate his cognitive capabilities all day and I for one would love to have that discussion, but if you are a Trump supporter the point is that you don't get to pretend that your preferred team is any more honest than what you are acusing Biden's team of.
Once the republican party coalesced against things like civility, maturity, professionalism, democracy, and the very idea of knowing what you're doing (aka expertise), yeah... Since that became the divide in our politics my side is predetermined.No one is a real professional. Are you living in a fantasy land?
What on earth are you talking about? What is a "real" professional?
I'm talking about the base level qualities we used to be able expect from every politician. Now we have an entire political party that suddenly decided these are not only qualities not worth aspiring for, they're not even preferable. Now people who have no idea what they're talking about get rebranded as trustworthy and people who do know what they're talking about because they've been doing it their entire lives are rebranded as if their knowledge gained through decades of experience makes them more likely to be wrong. That is the epitome of absurd, which is the Hallmark of MAGA.
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@Double_R
That most of the people ranting about Biden's health cover up are massive hypocrites
Everyone is a hypocrite in matters of politics.
My point had nothing to do with a tie between obesity and leadership, I am talking about the extent to which the political right has in real life gone far beyond that which they are acusing the left of. I use the weight example not because it is critical, but because it's objective and cartoonishly ridiculous. The point there is to highlight the fact that they lie openly and without abandon when it comes to the dear leader's state.
What about his state? Being fat does not make a man incapable. They aren't sending him to lead men in battle. He is serving America from the Oval Office and has to catch planes sometimes. He also plays golf. A man who is close to expiring would probably not be playing golf.
I don't see the problem. You may dislike Trump, but to say the Republicans are “hypocrites” when Trump appears to be in moderately good shape for a man of his age, is rather absurd.
What on earth are you talking about? What is a "real" professional?
None of them are. They are all humans who make mistakes, and they are known to deliberately do bad things. Didn't you know a professional can have a nefarious agenda?
I'm talking about the base level qualities we used to be able expect from every politician. Now we have an entire political party that suddenly decided these are not only qualities not worth aspiring for, they're not even preferable. Now people who have no idea what they're talking about get rebranded as trustworthy and people who do know what they're talking about because they've been doing it their entire lives are rebranded as if their knowledge gained through decades of experience makes them more likely to be wrong. That is the epitome of absurd, which is the Hallmark of MAGA.
I don't think we care about professionalism anymore. We have come to understand that professionals have problems too, and that they sometimes do horrible things. Do you not remember covid?
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@yachilviveyachali
Everyone is a hypocrite in matters of politics.
This is a lazy attempt to hand waive away a legitimate criticism. A guy who stole a candy bar and a guy who robs banks are both thieves, that doesn't make them the same.
What about his state? Being fat does not make a man incapable. They aren't sending him to lead men in battle.
Second post in a row that you've done this, I just finished explaining to you that obesity had absolutely nothing to do with my previous point. Please scroll up, reread my post and try again.
I don't think we care about professionalism anymore. We have come to understand that professionals have problems too, and that they sometimes do horrible things. Do you not remember covid?
Again - what are you talking about?
A professional is a person who gets paid to do whatever it is they are credited the term for. Professionalism is a set of behavioral traits that mirror what we expect from someone in that position - integrity, knowledge, maturity, etc. If you are claiming you do not care about professionalism then you are saying you don't care about any of those traits.
Is that what you are saying, and if so, please explain why you don't think any of that stuff matters.
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@Double_R
What is his doctor to say if he is not in bad shape? The MAGAS are going to say Trump is fit if he appears to be fit. Perhaps, if he were showing signs of not being fit, they would question the doctor's assessment of Trump being in “excellent health.”
They can use their eyes to see what state he is in. We did the same with Biden.
A professional is a person who gets paid to do whatever it is they are credited the term for. Professionalism is a set of behavioral traits that mirror what we expect from someone in that position - integrity, knowledge, maturity, etc. If you are claiming you do not care about professionalism then you are saying you don't care about any of those traits.Is that what you are saying, and if so, please explain why you don't think any of that stuff matters.
I have seen and heard about too many professionals who disappoint. Some are atrocious. The traits matter, but being a so-called professional doesn't mean you have them. The humanity tends to be knocked out of these people. Open a newspaper and read about the professionals who get themselves into trouble. It is not uncommon. Sin follows us all, and what really makes one become a professional is ambition. You don't need integrity and a good heart to hold these positions.
Maybe a few trips around the block is needed for you.
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@yachilviveyachali
What is his doctor to say if he is not in bad shape? The MAGAS are going to say Trump is fit if he appears to be fit. Perhaps, if he were showing signs of not being fit, they would question the doctor's assessment of Trump being in “excellent health.”They can use their eyes to see what state he is in. We did the same with Biden.
This again, has nothing to do with my point.
I used Trump's listed weight as an example of how brazen liars he and his inner circle are. That's it. That's all.
The scandal getting all the attention right now is that Biden's people lied about his abilities. Trump's people are provably worse. Conclusion: if you cannot admit that Trump and his people are worse you have no ground to stand on.
I have seen and heard about too many professionals who disappoint. Some are atrocious. The traits matter, but being a so-called professional doesn't mean you have them. The humanity tends to be knocked out of these people. Open a newspaper and read about the professionals who get themselves into trouble. It is not uncommon. Sin follows us all, and what really makes one become a professional is ambition. You don't need integrity and a good heart to hold these positions.
Again, has nothing to do with the subject. I'm talking about professionalism, not professionals. Do you understand the difference and how that difference relates to this conversation?
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@yachilviveyachali
A professional is a person who gets paid...
Lol, he could have just stopped right there and that's the end of the debate.
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@Double_R
What have they lied about? What is Trump's weight? They say it is 224 pounds. What's the problem?
The scandal getting all the attention right now is that Biden's people lied about his abilities. Trump's people are provably worse. Conclusion: if you cannot admit that Trump and his people are worse you have no ground to stand on.
Goodness. How are they “provably worse?” What have they lied about? Personality characteristics have subjective appeal, and every person working with a politician, unless they are seeking to stab him in the back, is going to say they are great.
With regard to health matters, what have they lied about?
I'm talking about professionalism, not professionals.
The principals of professionalism are what apply to professionals, who practice their professions, in a sometimes unprofessional manner. Your “I'm talking about professionalism, not professionals” is akin to saying you are talking about gardening, but not the gardeners who do the gardening. Or crime, but not the criminals who do the crime. Sometimes criminals are poor at crime too, or just not up to it. Things are what we make them. Professionalism is an empty word when the professionals disappoint.
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@yachilviveyachali
Professionalism is an empty word when the professionals disappoint.
Corporate media is full of "Professionals" who definitely disappoint.
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@yachilviveyachali
What have they lied about? What is Trump's weight? They say it is 224 pounds. What's the problem?
The problem with that is that this is an obvious and blatant lie on an official report about something objective and easily measurable. Do I really need to explain to you why that matters?
Personality characteristics have subjective appeal, and every person working with a politician, unless they are seeking to stab him in the back, is going to say they are great.
Then there is no scandal with Joe Biden. Guess we can end the thread now.
The principals of professionalism are what apply to professionals, who practice their professions, in a sometimes unprofessional manner. Your “I'm talking about professionalism, not professionals” is akin to saying you are talking about gardening, but not the gardeners who do the gardening.
Just. Wow.
A professional is anyone who does something for a living. So if you are criticizing "professionals" you are talking about literally every human being that has ever had a job, at that point everything you are criticizing becomes utterly meaningles in any practical sense.
The topic of professionalism has absolutely nothing to do with any subset of individuals you want to cherry pick just so you can attack them as a way of ignoring the actual topic.
If professionalism could be boiled down to one word I would say the best word which embodies it is seriousness. What does professionalism look like in a corporate meeting? It looks like a bunch of adults taking the problems identified and potential solutions offered seriously. What does it not look like? A bunch of overgrown children talking about how many drinks they had at the bar last night.
So when you criticize professionalism what you're really doing is arguing that taking ones work seriously is not something we should value when it comes to the people doing the most important work in the country. That's absurd.
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@Double_R
The problem with that is that this is an obvious and blatant lie on an official report about something objective and easily measurable. Do I really need to explain to you why that matters?
Yes, please explain?
Then there is no scandal with Joe Biden. Guess we can end the thread now.
I cannot speak to whether they had prior knowledge of his cancer. Perhaps they did not? With regard to his presentation, he seemed confused and did not appear to be very sharp. He was pressured to exit the presidential race, and did so reluctantly. Neither of these things would have occurred if he had been capable of a second term. Does this not speak for itself? Donald Trump is in better shape. It does not mean he is wonderful, but that he is fitter than Biden.
A professional is anyone who does something for a living. So if you are criticizing "professionals" you are talking about literally every human being that has ever had a job, at that point everything you are criticizing becomes utterly meaningles in any practical sense.
We were talking about politicians. I also mentioned covid, hinting at how wicked the “science” professionals were. You said a professional should mirror the qualities of knowledge, integrity, and maturity. I said they often don't. According to you, professionalism is supposed to be serious. I guess it is, but that does not mean every professional is good or serious. Some are a joke.
What does professionalism look like in a corporate meeting?
Very boring. I would prefer not to look.
A bunch of overgrown children talking about how many drinks they had at the bar last night.
Donald Trump doesn't drink.
Was Victoria Nuland being professional when she was talking about who should they should put in government in Ukraine?
So when you criticize professionalism what you're really doing is arguing that taking ones work seriously is not something we should value when it comes to the people doing the most important work in the country.
They take money and power seriously.
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@Greyparrot
Corporate media is full of "Professionals" who definitely disappoint.
Like Don Lemon?
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@yachilviveyachali
I was thinking more like Jake Tapper and his tell-all book.
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@Greyparrot
@yachilviveyachali
Like Don Lemon?
Yes, like Don Lemon
I was thinking more like Jake Tapper and his tell-all book.
Yup. Also, in no particular order and not an exhaustive list:
Dana Bash
Chuck Todd
Norah O’Donnell
Margaret Brennan
Wolf Blitzer
Jim Acosta
Anderson Cooper
Yamiche Alcindor
and the dude who said “mostly peaceful.”
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@cristo71
Ah yes, how could we forget the "mostly peaceful" dude....
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@Greyparrot
I have a neighbor who is a former Army Ranger. When I first met him, he was wearing a t shirt that said “MOSTLY PEACEFUL.”
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@yachilviveyachali
The problem with that is that this is an obvious and blatant lie on an official report about something objective and easily measurable. Do I really need to explain to you why that matters?Yes, please explain?
That was a rhetorical question. Sorry, if you really need this explained you are beyond help.
With regard to his presentation, he seemed confused and did not appear to be very sharp. He was pressured to exit the presidential race, and did so reluctantly. Neither of these things would have occurred if he had been capable of a second term. Does this not speak for itself? Donald Trump is in better shape. It does not mean he is wonderful, but that he is fitter than Biden.
It doesn't show that Trump is fitter than Biden, it shows the egregious and indefensible double standard being applied to these two men.
I agree Biden's cognitive state is an issue, it would matter in any other election. But the guy he was running against is orders of magnitude worse, however he gets a pass because somehow he's been branded as some kind of genius playing 4D chess when in reality he's just an imbecile who fools people with his unwavering confidence, confidence he's only able to display because he's insanely dishonest so he isn't ashamed to get caught in a lie.
A perfect example of how this plays out is in what you just pointed out, Biden seems confused. Yeah, that's what happens when one realizes there's something off about what they just said or when realizing there's something they don't understand. Trump doesn't ever show that because he isn't capable of it. If Trump says something and it makes no sense, he just doubles down on it and now we're all stuck with it. He said other countries pay tariffs. They don't, but now that he said it, it's true and anyone who questions him about it is a fake news deep state plant.
So no, it's not that Biden was worse, it's that Biden isn't a con man who made his way by taking advantage of gullible and uneducated people. Biden played by the rules of decency imposed on every other politician, Trump just threw those rules out the window. Shame on all of us for being dumb enough to not know the difference.
According to you, professionalism is supposed to be serious. I guess it is, but that does not mean every professional is good or serious.
You're having a whole conversation with yourself.
I haven't argued anything close to this. I argued that the traits associated with professionalism are good. That's it, that's all. You have completely sidestepped that point by focusing on cherry picked individuals who you then tried to falsely tie to professionalism by saying they're professionals, all to conclude that because some professionals are bad professionalism doesn't matter. That is wrong on so many levels.
So when you criticize professionalism what you're really doing is arguing that taking ones work seriously is not something we should value when it comes to the people doing the most important work in the country.They take money and power seriously.
Let me know when you'd care to have a real conversation instead of these silly and irrelevant one liners.
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@Double_R
Trump may tell lies and have the wrong policies to you, but this has nothing to do with his fitness. Trump seemingly does not have cancer, and Trump was able to engage in the campaign and become president. He was able to beat Harris. I watched the votes come in on election night in November last year; it was apparent very early on that he had won.
All politicians lie. Why are Biden's lies any better than Trump's lies? A lie is a lie. How are Kamala's awkwardness, superficial demeanor, and terrible cackling a desirable thing? Americans were tired of it. Trump has something the other politicians don't.
I think it is unfair to call Trump voters “uneducated.” No one wants to be disparaged, ridiculed, and talked down to by elitist figures and those who seem to revere the elitist figures. It is old; try something new.
On the matter of political cover-ups, who buys that Elon Musk was given a black eye by his five-year-old son?