Terraria Mafia #1 - DP1

Author: Mharman
Mafia Game
DP1
Terraria Mafia

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#421
Mikal
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1) he was on the wiki. He could see it was a category. The literal wiki as you posted, is CATEGORY short swords lmao. 

2) he said the mold him he was not a category. 341 and 354 

3) I asked Mharm was I category or did I have tiers. He said he could not confirm and linked me to the wiki. Contradicts (2) 
To anyone who wanes to defend him or consider this is wrong. Please answer to the above. 
#422
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@Casey_Risk
I could have sworn that Mharman said somewhere that this game would be role madness, but I can't find it. Technically, that wouldn't necessarily preclude a Vanilla depending on how exactly you define role madness (sometimes a game with one vanilla is still considered rolemad depending on who you ask), but it doesn't look good for Vader either way. 
Looked through the discord for this but couldn't find it.  If you can hunt it down that will probably be the final nail in the coffin.
#423
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@whiteflame
VTL Whiteflame

What are your reads on Luna, Casey, and I?
#424
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Don’t remember role madness.  This is in signups 

Starting sign-ups early cause this is a biiiiiiiig game. NOTE: Things will get very chaotic, should be balanced tho. I figured out you can have some swingy roles and the sheer size of the game will negate a good chunk of the swinginess.

Characters will be various things in Terraria, this is the first of a series, so expect early game stuff to be the characters

#425
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@Mikal
Yeah but for someone that doesn’t play. Short sword may seem like an item and not a category. Short sword isn’t an item at all btw. 

Your losing me a bit here but if we can agree supa is scum that’s fine I guess 
#426
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@Lunatic
We are just disagreeing on the slip. You are saying he could see it from his PM and I think he could goofed that up. If he went from his pm to the wiki to see if he was a category 


What I don’t think he can mess up is the mod telling him he’s not a category and the massive freaking text on the wiki that says category 

#427
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@Lunatic
All I said was that I think something about your claim is off and that I couldn’t place it. I’m not bandwagoning anything.
Some phrases/wording seems to be copied directly from the wiki. Now this could be either Mharman copying it himself for sake of people understanding it easier,  or you going out on the fly and quickly making up a claim, which in fairness is not something I remember you doing, but I could be wrong.

Please focus on behavior then. Mislynching because of a claim the mod gave me is super gay.
And as much as I want to do that, I do not remember anyone’s  behavior when they were scum vs town.
#428
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@Mikal
If Luna is town locked. Someone joining my wagon (albeit for different reasons ) is prob scum since 4 or 5 people were wanting to kill him.
Not an unreasonable assumption, though I will point out that neither I nor WF ever actually voted for Luna, I don't think. 
#429
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@JoeBob
And as much as I want to do that, I do not remember anyone’s behavior when they were scum vs town.
If you don't remember anyone's behavior well enough to compare their current behavior to their behavior in previous games, then fair enough, but you can still analyze other players behaviorally. Look at their words and actions from the point of view of 'would they more likely do this as scum or town?' Ask the questions you would ask if you thought someone might be lying to you in real life. That's how you scum hunt. 
#430
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Skimmed through the last couple pages, is it all really just about wether Vader put a space between words?
#431
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@JoeBob
No. He said the mod told him something that the mod told me he could not tell a player 
#432
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@JoeBob
No, he also claimed to have gotten confirmation from Mharnam, and Mikal said he asked the same question and Mharnam just directed him to the wiki. It's a LAL thing.
#433
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@ResurgetExFavilla
It's a LAL thing.
Feels like I'm perpetually learning new acronyms. What's this stand for?
#434
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Also anyone that wants to confirm this can ask the mod themselves. 

“Am I a category or have a tier”
#435
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@Casey_Risk
Lynch All Liars. I generally abide by it with some exceptions. This isn't shaking out to be one of them.
#436
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Mharm now adjusted what he told me 

The answer I gave you it not necessarily what I gave others. From now on I will link you to the wiki. Whether or not I did that before is in question 
#437
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Paraphrased 


I told him sorry for busting his balls and he gave me that back. I have no idea what to think anymore. Because that feels like it mod confirms supa and he is trying to cover up for the fact he gave supa wrong info 
#438
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@Mikal
I told him sorry for busting his balls and he gave me that back. I have no idea what to think anymore. Because that feels like it mod confirms supa and he is trying to cover up for the fact he gave supa wrong info 
Yeah, this is why I hate relying on mod info in mafia. I feel like we should maybe do more to limit it tbh. In any case, I can see this being the truth. I'll still wait for Vader to get back online and defend himself, but something about him feels like he was genuinely confused as opposed to just being scum caught in a lie. 
#439
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So the overall Supa issue is that he claimed an item, was unsure whether shortsword was a category of sword or whether Mikal was asking him about the different types of swords (iron sword, gold sword, whatever) apparently mentioned in his PM - supposedly it was written 'short sword' in the PM but should have been 'shortsword', an error on the mod's part.

Without the mod response difference confirmation, the case becomes a lot weaker tbh. As I said earlier, Supa feels honest to me.
#440
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Catching up.

So REF says he's a specific type of item in a category (e.g. Iron Axe), meaning either Mikal's theory is wrong or REF is scum. Most ppl here aren't scum reading REF based on his behavior -- got nothing to base a read on myself without experience -- so we're going forward assuming that the theory was wrong, I guess, which mostly clears Luna.

Not convinced either way on Supa, could understand how he would get confused and Mhar could have reached out to him for clarification.
#441
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@Mikal
More Luna analysis. Tbh I asked you about him still being scum if Supa flips scum to gauge his response. If he would have blown a gasket I would have read him town because then his earlier jeremiads would seem genuine - if you were town and your scum read was vindicated like that but people still scum read you it should make you more pissed off. But he just became hostile and more measured and calculating in response. How would you parse that behavior?
#442
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This is a tricky game, a lot of the time it seems like you guys aren't basing your behavioral reads on very much at all.
#443
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A thought I had recently when I was looking at Savant is that at first I town read him for being the first person to claim an NPC instead of an item. But then I realized that it's a null read at best, because when it comes to theme analysis (if Luna is right about there being three scum), then they have access to six genuine claims (three real and three fake). They know waaaay more about the theme than any of us right off the bat and are unlikely to make silly role errors - in fact they'd be less likely to do it than town.
#444
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@Castin
This is a tricky game, a lot of the time it seems like you guys aren't basing your behavioral reads on very much at all.

It's DP1, odds are we will mislynch. The important thing is to generate as much behavior as possible in order to be able to look back on that activity in light of the flip. To get that started requires a lot of bullshitting. This is also why I like to policy lynch inactives DP1. Scum is more likely to be subtly directing a DP1 wagon.
#445
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@Castin
This is a tricky game, a lot of the time it seems like you guys aren't basing your behavioral reads on very much at all.
Reads tend to be pretty inaccurate during DP1, simply because we just don't have much information to go off of. Reading into little things in the early game is simply par for the course. Come DP2, things will start to change.
#446
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@Castin
@Vader
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@Mikal
Won’t make me lol any better but vanilla. The copper variation of your item is the starter item you get and because how common it is in vanilla
Nope, I'm vanilla.

VTL Vader

Only hesitation is why wouldn't Vader use a fake claim if scum have them? And maybe there could be multiple vanillas in a 15-player game. But I don't think we're getting a better lynch today.
#447
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Ah so we're meant to be flying off the rails by the seats of our pants half-cocked loose cannon at this phase. This makes sense.
#448
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@Savant
Do you realize there can be multiple vanillas in a game? I don’t think you ever played in a game as such but this isn’t a CC

I want a full character claim please 
#449
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@Vader
I want a full character claim please
Sure, I'm a vulture. I can easily be dealt with by knocking me back into the air, so I'm vanilla.
#450
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@Mikal
Good to know

I was about to ask him the same question because that honestly shocked me and since you’re essentially town confirmed fmpov then I have no reason to believe you’d be lying

Wouldn’t say I’m town locked from anyone’s POV but it’s good to know I’m not just going crazy