Terraria Mafia #1 - DP1

Author: Mharman
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Terraria Mafia

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#841
Casey_Risk
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@Mikal
He says he does the non commital shit and town as scum but everytime he’s did it that I recall it’s as scum. It’s like half assing reads and sayinf maybe this and maybe that without ever really locking in on anything. It always bothers me and it’s possible he does it as town but the entire post he made about supa. I’d have to find. Just really read wrong to me 
Meh, I remember a recent-ish game where I sussed him for being non-committal with his reads and I'm pretty sure he ended up being town. I struggle to remember exactly which game that was, however.
#842
Lunatic
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@Mikal
His behavior is also bad. Go back and ISO him. 
Why don't you tell me why you think it is bad. 
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#843
Mharman
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Vote Count

Casey (3/8) - Ultra, Wylted
Vader (3/8) - Lunatic, Savant, Pie
Cerulean (1/8) - Resurget
VTNL (1/8) - Irontoaster
Joebob (1/8) - Cerulean
Mikal (1/8) - Banana
Whiteflame (1/8) - Mikal/Castin

Not Voting (3) Whiteflame, Joebob, Vader

12 hours remain.
#844
Mikal
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@Lunatic
Still don't get the connection, but you've clearly got something in mind.

There are worse choices for a mislynch since I'm likely to be scumread based on any Tracking/Watching that goes on if I pick the wrong target. I'd prefer we don't seek more claims at this point since I'd rather not give away more town roles - we've already restricted who could have the PRs substantially given the claims so far - and you know my and Pie's current sus is on Vader, which is apparently making you second-guess that pick. I've been townreading Pie behaviorally and I like his reasoning, so I think pushing him is a mistake. If you and others thirst for one of our blood, might as well be mine.



The above also bothers me. Hard to say exactly why but it just seems fake 
The underlined just seems fake. There was also something he said about supa that bothered me but I’d have to go back and find it and on my phone. Just his passive maybe maybe not and some of his posts just feel like it’s trying to be innocent and build town cred 
#845
Casey_Risk
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@Mikal
Actually, it was Game Shows Mafia. Though I guess I can understand why you wouldn't be thinking of that one, since you were scum.
#846
Mikal
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Offhand I think my pool is 

Whiteflame 
Pie 
+1 non active. 
#847
Mikal
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@Casey_Risk
I have a weird radar thing with him. There are times I’m sure he’s town and times I’m sure he’s scum. It’s hard to articulate why. He feels scum, I’m not like 100 but he’s the best target. 


The role is also just going to cause chaos and he said himslef. There are worse mislynches. I’m fine with this. Because if I am wrong it’s not awful but I also just have this radar thing again with him. 
#848
Lunatic
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@Mikal
The underlined just seems fake. There was also something he said about supa that bothered me but I’d have to go back and find it and on my phone. Just his passive maybe maybe not and some of his posts just feel like it’s trying to be innocent and build town cred 
I actually agree with what he said in the underlined part. I don't think this whiteflame lynch gains any traction and were just gonna stall out in a no lynch. Im not budging off of supa. 
#849
Mikal
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@Lunatic
I’m also fine with a vtnl or no lynch on even. But if I’m wrong on supa , you can yell at me later. I just think he’s actually dumb and didn’t pay attention. I can’t understand half of what he’s saying but with how little he normally reads games. Trying to wrap his head around what I’m asking is possible. It’s scummy as shit but supa does this all the time as town. I’ve mislynched him like 1000 times for being lazy. I agree it all appears scummy but the last post just really read me as genuine. And even his Initial soft claims about this claim match his justification. 
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#850
Mharman
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@irontoaster
@Ultracrepidarian
Activity ping
#851
Mikal
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@Lunatic
Also I also agree with it. It just doesn’t pin me as sincere. Think it’s town cred 
#852
Casey_Risk
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@Mikal
I’m also fine with a vtnl or no lynch on even.
I guess it's not the worst idea, but I'd far prefer a lynch today. PoE is the town's best friend after all, and with so many players, it's hard to use effectively. I want us to get info from flips.
#853
Casey_Risk
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Screw it.

VTL Whiteflame

He's a nullread for me and I prefer this wagon to Luna or Vader. Let's see where this goes.
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#854
Mharman
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Vote Count

Casey (3/8) - Ultra, Wylted
Vader (3/8) - Lunatic, Savant, Pie
Whiteflame (2/8) - Mikal/Castin, Casey
Cerulean (1/8) - Resurget
VTNL (1/8) - Irontoaster
Joebob (1/8) - Cerulean
Mikal (1/8) - Banana

Not Voting (3) Whiteflame, Joebob, Vader

The creator of Terraria loves yo-yos.

Last vote count of the night btw. Once again, DP ends 1pm EST (New York) noon CST (Chicago).
#855
Lunatic
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Rip. Sucks we can’t get on the same page. 

#856
iamanabanana
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I tried catching up, and got dis-interested, so just ended up reading the last few pages. I am okay with lynching whiteflame, his role doesn't seem like it is helpful to town. I trust mikal and casey on this one and I agree that vader seems kind of townie.

Whiteflame is the lynch today.

VTL whiteflame.
#857
Lunatic
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@iamanabanana
I tried catching up, and got dis-interested, so just ended up reading the last few pages. I am okay with lynching whiteflame, his role doesn't seem like it is helpful to town. I trust mikal and casey on this one and I agree that vader seems kind of townie.

Whiteflame is the lynch today.

VTL whiteflame.

This is an extremely scummy vote. And you are not caught up, and just willing to vote for whiteflame based on his role? Weren't you just claiming you were mad that no one was taking your seriously in the last game based on  your "aggressiveness" but your willing to just vote for whiteflame because of his claim without any behavioral analysis or effort otherwise? This is super shady of you banana. 
#858
Lunatic
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@Mikal
@Casey_Risk
If bananas vote didn't just raise your alarm bells, we are truly hopeless. 
#859
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@Vader
At first I thought you believed short sword was a subset of "sword" or something, so you responded there were no tiers to your item, then looked it up on the wiki and said oops, shortsword is its own category not a subset of sword. But if Mhar straight up told you your item had tiers, that kills that scenario.
#860
iamanabanana
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@Lunatic
This is an extremely scummy vote. And you are not caught up, and just willing to vote for whiteflame based on his role? Weren't you just claiming you were mad that no one was taking your seriously in the last game based on  your "aggressiveness" but your willing to just vote for whiteflame because of his claim without any behavioral analysis or effort otherwise? This is super shady of you banana. 
This is pretty different from that situation. First of all, I am not voting whiteflame out some sort of principal or anything deep. I am voting whiteflame because the day phase is almost expired and he doesn't have a role that helps town. Chances are already high that he is fake claiming, but in the chance he isn't, we aren't losing a pivotal town role. Plus he himself said he was only holding off on claiming his role because he thought he could bait a night kill. Well now that he's claimed that option is off the table, and he can only be a liability to the town if he's showing up on reports and using his role as an excuse every time.
#861
Lunatic
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@iamanabanana
This is pretty different from that situation. First of all, I am not voting whiteflame out some sort of principal or anything deep. I am voting whiteflame because the day phase is almost expired and he doesn't have a role that helps town. Chances are already high that he is fake claiming, but in the chance he isn't, we aren't losing a pivotal town role. Plus he himself said he was only holding off on claiming his role because he thought he could bait a night kill. Well now that he's claimed that option is off the table, and he can only be a liability to the town if he's showing up on reports and using his role as an excuse every time.

We have plenty of time still, and the argument about whiteflames role is kind of dumb. Mods put anti town roles in games all the time. Town don't HAVE to lynch them. In fact I would argue that they are put in to test players ability to hunt behavior over just pushing for role claims. Thats why I put a hidden miller in my last game for example. Negative Utility roles don't have to be mislynched for the sake of lynching them. Out of all the wagons currently happening this is by far the worst wagon you could jump on. There is actually heaps of behaviors tells on vader who has admitted to messing up on his claim but trying to hide it from town because it would "look bad", as well as inconsistencies with his claim. Also your argument that whiteflames role is useless and doesn't help town can be cross applied to Vader as well. The fact that you conveniently hop on and vote for whiteflame after all this is so freaking suspicious. 
#862
Lunatic
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I changed my mind. The only lynch other than vader I would be willing to consider this day phase is banana. If people want that lynch I'd be down. 
#863
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WHEW. I am 'caught up' as much as one can trying to power read 850 odd posts. Going to make an effort to at least keep updated on a day to day basis. Reading mafia posts for an hour and a half is not exactly the most productive thing I could be doing.

First thing I want to say, is FVCK this whole "mod confirmed" bullsh!t. I don't buy it at all and have used similar tactics as scum myself. I don't like anyone taking this for granted.

I made notes as I went, so here are my reads. A lot of this is gut.

Vader - Scummy. Initially posted stuff that seemed like fluff/fake scum hunting. The whole business with his claim strikes me as scummy.

Cerulean - Gut says town. Analysis seems reasonable. Activity a bit lacking.

Mikal/Castin - Scummy. I don't like his fixation on the category thing. Seems like he thought he'd found a thread and flipped when better opportunities arised. I found #302 and #602 in particular SUS AF. My notes on Castin were 5 iterations of "sus".

Whiteflame - Gut says town. I'd be fine with lynching later because of useless role, but given scum have been given fake claims, why claim this?

Savant - Gut says very pro-town. First to claim and NPC. Vulture is a dangerous claim, but that doesn't strike me as scummy in this case. Analysis falls in line with my own thinking a lot of the time.

JoeBob - Scummy. Seems to want to find a bandwagon to jump on. Post #725 I marked as super sus.

Ultracepid - No read.

Casey_Risk - Gut says town. Analysis seems good. His meta analysis struck me as pro-town.

ILikePie5 - Scummy. Attempts at scum-hunting seem shallow. Marked as sus multiple times.

Lunatic - Gut says town. Did not like your 'fvck town' menty-b. Done that myself as town though, so hard to judge it too harshly.

Resurgent - Gut says town, but it's a weak and mixed feeling. Marked both "pro town" and "sus" more than once in notes.

iamanabanana - Low activity, possible town-lean.

Wylted - Strongest town read. Could you please verify what you meant in post #725.

If I missed anyone, they're a non-read based on lack of activity.

So, with all that said, the lynch I'd be most happy with today is...

VOTE Vader
If he flips town, not much is lost in my opinion.
Doctor should be on Wylted tonight and every night. 

#864
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By the way, I was totally bluffing about wanting the mafia to visit me. Or was I? The wine that comes with this role is absolutely delicious. Thanks to MHarman for igniting a passion for mafia I haven't felt in a long time.

#865
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I want to give a final comprehensive read list but I will be at work when the DP ends so no guarantees. My top scum reads atm are Luna and Pie. Pie seems way to eager to find mislynch targets and Luna’s behavior has fluctuated way too much depending on the pressure
#866
Lunatic
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@Vader
I want to give a final comprehensive read list but I will be at work when the DP ends so no guarantees. My top scum reads atm are Luna and Pie. Pie seems way to eager to find mislynch targets and Luna’s behavior has fluctuated way too much depending on the pressure
This feels like a nail in the coffin for me. Throughout all the posts that have occurred this day phase, your only reads come down to two of the people voting you, and ironically even that doesn't make sense because pie thinks I am scum and bussing you or something, so the pairing doesn't even make sense. After coming clean about hoping your mistake would fly under the radar, your ending reads come down to a bit of omgus. Very interesting. 
#867
whiteflame
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@Vader
@Mharman
At this point, I’ll at least lock in with my choice:

VTL Vader

Did notice Vader just said he’d be posting his reads, but I doubt they’ll meaningfully move the needle. There’s just too much inconsistency and while I could buy some of it, much of that would be true of a fake claim as well as a real one. I do believe the character was miswritten to be two words, but the points about the justification just don’t sit well with me.

Also pinging Mharman since he asked.
#868
whiteflame
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@Mikal
@annabanana20
@Casey_Risk
As for the reasoning on me, you each have something different, so I’ll address them.

Mikal - if you need to prove to yourself that this is my NAI behavior, then I guess there’s nothing I can do about it. Not putting a vote down until near the end of the DP characterizes a lot of my games, but you haven’t seen that many. 

Casey - Not a lot to say here since this just seems to be a decision based in PoE. I’ve at least seen enough analysis from you that I believe you’re just at odds with other potential lynches on the table and this is just your more palatable choice, though  the lack of a clear set of reads makes it difficult to fully place this vote in context.

Banana - like Luna, I’m put off by the decision to suddenly jump back in the DP and VTL me entirely because of my role. Considering you had  scum reads in Luna and Savant and a pretty big pile of null reads, this either comes off as opportunistic or just acceding to someone else’s argument to get a lynch and either way it’s the weakest reasoning on my wagon.
#869
WyIted
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@Mharman
It looks like Vader or no lynch so

Unvote VTL vader
#870
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I think that brings him to L1 and. Bananas vote on whiteflame does feel scummy