How to actually debate so you stop making beginner's mistakes

Google search is your friend. Literally.

Before you make a claim, google it to check if its true. Its not difficult, and it saves you the embarrasment of being corrected.

Also, take least extreme opposite position. For example, if someone says that all abortions are okay, a stupid person would take position that all abortions are wrong, but smart person would take position that some abortions are wrong. Generally, less extreme positions are easiest to defend. If opponent says "they all are", you say "some are not". If your opponent says "its always good", you say "sometimes its not good".

Argument is usually made from 2 claims and conclusion, claims supporting those two claims, and hidden premises and hidden assumptions.

The two claims are: base claim, and claim which links base claim to conclusion.

In order for argument to be true, both base claim and link claim must be true.

Example:

1. Abortion kills a human being (base claim)

2. Killing a human being is wrong (link claim)

C. Abortion is wrong

If either 1 or 2 is incorrect or unproved, argument is defeated.

However, all these claims depend on hidden premises/hidden assumptions.

What are hidden premises?

Hidden premises are unmentioned opposite premises which must be false for argument to be true, or unmentioned claims which must be true if argument is to be proved true.

What is opposite of "abortion kills a human being"?

It is a premise that sometimes, abortion actually doesnt kill a human being, example in cases where fetus would die anyway, and where mother would die without abortion. In that case, lack of abortion would kill a human being, not abortion.

"Killing a human being is wrong" claim also has it's opposite. By many people, it is considered justified to kill a human being if it saves more lives than it kills. For example, if you ask AI on if it would sacrifice 1 human to save 5, AI would answer yes. If you ask people about collateral damage in war, people would say that it is justified. So abortion, likewise, by some people can be justified in cases where it saves more lives than it kills and increases life expectancy in general.

Further, this premise depends on countless hidden assumptions: that one true morality exists, that free will exists, that people have enough knowledge to make such conclusion, that reality we know of is true reality, that human being is morally justified to exist, that killing human beings doesnt send them to a world better than this one...ect. I dont hold these positions, these are just examples.

Hidden assumptions are basically either unprovable claims which must be proved for premise to be true, or undisprovable claims which must be disproved for premise to be true.

Hidden assumptions are in theory perfect counter-arguments, because they cannot be disproved and they always make argument unproved.

Another note is definitions. Definitions will usually determine a win in debate, and debating without definitions is like playing chess without knowing the rules. Failing to define at least key terms is usually auto loss against anyone who does define their key terms good enough.

Another note is to make claim traps. Stupid person will make a claim and offer proof for it immediatelly. Smart person makes claim, then waits for other person to deny it, then offers clear proof, making the other person look stupid. Generally, you want to save best for last.

Also, learn Socrates argument, where you avoid stating your position and just attack opponent's. This makes you less vunerable.

This rule backfires if the debate is on-balance.

If on-balance, you can go by negating opposites mostly. Same principle, basically. If all opposite premises are proved false, then your premise must be true.

Good tips. I realised this very early on in life but not all are blessed like me at self-arguing and realising how logic works.

Beware to confuse neutrality with truth.

The counterangle to rape always being wrong is saying sometimes it is not wrong, which is still very dangerous to believe.

Good advice!

I am sure the author is a tough debater.

Most people dont know how to debate, its actually only small percentage of population which is capable of debating. The rest are just yelling, rambling and interrupting and thinking they are winning arguments.

Many people believe that rape is sometimes okay, for example, when pedophile gets raped in prison. Forced marriages were also historically common, and that was also rape because woman had to be with person she didnt want to be with.

I quit debating long time ago, this is just writing notes. Generally, you are more likely to change someone's mind with presence than argument. I have been on this site for 2 years and I didnt see maybe 1 person change his mind from debating during whole 2 years. The main problem in debating is that even if stupid person loses an argument, they dont know it. They walk away thinking they won. This is why debating actually achieves nothing. Literally, nothing. People already made up their mind before debate starts. You can only change people's minds by bypassing their defense mechanisms, and debating cant really bypass it. Even very stupid people and very smart people rarely ever change their minds. Even when they are proved blatantly wrong. But they do change their minds through presence, authority and rewards.

Debating, it achieves the debate, no?

Well, yes, its like some unhealthy addiction. You enter it thinking you will change minds, but all you end up with is improving your mind but in an area which serves virtually no purpose. Machiavelli's first rule is not to argue, because even best debaters end up convincing no one. Trump is a comedian, not a debater. People voted for him because he is funny and generally has dominant behavior, nothing to do with debating or logic.

It is important to exercise the brain, I think.

And also the body.

Debating is decent for brain, but there are better options, like chess, math, research, studying behavior, memorization...ect. Debating constantly can even cause depression because you keep improving at something which makes no any difference in your life or other people's lives. At least in chess, people admit defeat.

Real

Hello Lucy, you are the only femme at DebateArt, no?

The debate, it is strategie, statistique and research. Also it implique memorisation and strategie psychologique.

I think the depression is not the real depression, the real depression is  serieuse maladie psychologique.

Mon Oncle he has the serieuse maladie psychologique. Depression it is not trivial.

I am something close to trans.

Yes, but generally, it is only research about specific topics, and only at surface.

Mon oncle d'Amerique, no?

Uncle Sam, oui?

Tout le temps perdu

Le temps est infini.

Les vies ne sont pas.

L'homme avec un parapluie.

Vivez longtemps et prosperez.

je citais une phrase de la chanson: ne me quitte pas- jacques brel

Ich denke, er ist Belgier. Ich werde zuhoren.

Gute nacht, wir sprechen morgen, mein freund.

Mauvais allemand, j'ai triche un peu.

Danke dass du auf meiner Sprache redest! Er ist eigentlich Belgier.

Bonne nuit!