Racism is a meaningless term

Author: Zarroette ,

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  • Zarroette
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    To accuse someone of racism or being a racist, is nothing but a slanderous invocation. Today,racism is demonised to the point of self-parody, but if we take a moment to analyse its usage, we can see that it means nothing.

    Let's say someone says that blacks need to be put back into slavery because they're not worthy of regular jobs. Most people are going to say that's racist.

    Let's say someone says that black people have lower I.Q. than white people. Again, you'll be met with the term racist.

    And here you see the issue. The first claim could be (rightly) seen as racial hatred. The second claim is factual and supported by a ridiculous amount of evidence (http://humanvarieties.org...),yet the conclusion is that they are both "racist".

    In order words, it's still possible to be correct *and* "racist", however the latter label will have you pigeon-holed with real racial hatred (as we saw in the former example), as if you're wrong for pointing out facts.

    That leads us to ask the question: what can we infer from the labelling of "racist?" Not a whole lot, other than the fact that both claims refer to race. So merely referring to race, as if that's as bad as being Hitler, gets you called a "racist", and we know what happens when you're confirmed as such. So, there's a gigantic disconnect between the real parameters of "racism" (that it merely refers to race), and the application of it (that you're "literally Hitler"). That's because it doesn't have a concrete definition -- it merely exist to shut down reference to race.

    Rather than use the slanderous and meaningless terms of "racism" or "racist", it would be better to use the term "racial hatred". That way, we could reject genuine racial hatred, and consider empirical data relating to racial differences in humans.

  • Greyparrot
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    --> @Zarroette
    Race is a meaningless term. Race based on a single phoneme (melanin) is exponentially more meaningless.
  • Zarroette
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    --> @Greyparrot
    Race is a meaningless term. Race based on a single phoneme (melanin) is exponentially more meaningless.
    Race isn't skin deep, bird brain.

  • triangle.128k
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    --> @Zarroette
    Let's say someone says that black people have lower I.Q. than white people. Again, you'll be met with the term racist.

    What is with your obsession over racial IQ gaps? 
  • drafterman
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    --> @Zarroette
    To accuse someone of racism or being a racist, is nothing but a slanderous invocation.
    Only if it it's a false statement of fact and causes some sort of damage to your reputation.

    Today,racism is demonised to the point of self-parody,
    LOL, as opposed to when it was a term of endearment?

    but if we take a moment to analyse its usage, we can see that it means nothing.

    Let's say someone says that blacks need to be put back into slavery because they're not worthy of regular jobs. Most people are going to say that's racist.

    Let's say someone says that black people have lower I.Q. than white people. Again, you'll be met with the term racist.
    Yes. Both of those terms are racist.

    And here you see the issue. The first claim could be (rightly) seen as racial hatred. The second claim is factual and supported by a ridiculous amount of evidence (http://humanvarieties.org...),yet the conclusion is that they are both "racist".

    In order words, it's still possible to be correct *and* "racist", however the latter label will have you pigeon-holed with real racial hatred (as we saw in the former example), as if you're wrong for pointing out facts.
    A website written by an antisemitc crank hardly constitutes "a ridiculous amount of evidence." Regardless of its factuality, both should be seen as racial hatred and deserve to have those that adhere to those ideas as pigeon-holed with "real racial hatred." Not for pointing out "facts" but for spouting racial hatred.

    That leads us to ask the question: what can we infer from the labelling of "racist?"
    That you hold some races to be inferior or less deserving of others.

    Not a whole lot, other than the fact that both claims refer to race. So merely referring to race, as if that's as bad as being Hitler, gets you called a "racist", and we know what happens when you're confirmed as such. So, there's a gigantic disconnect between the real parameters of "racism" (that it merely refers to race), and the application of it (that you're "literally Hitler"). That's because it doesn't have a concrete definition -- it merely exist to shut down reference to race.
    References to race have little to no utility. Except to combat historical and systemic racism.
  • Zarroette
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    --> @drafterman
    Yes. Both of those terms are racist.
    Lol. Being factual about provable racial differences is "racist".

    A website written by an antisemitc crank hardly constitutes "a ridiculous amount of evidence."
    So you're attempting to rebut my claim that racism is purely a slanderous term to discredit, and in doing so you're using a purely slanderous term to discredit.

    You are a hypocrite.

    That you hold some races to be inferior or less deserving of others.
    Blacks have, on average, lower I.Q. than whites. Deal with it.

    References to race have little to no utility.
    Wrong. They can accurately predict crime and poverty. You're just an emotional zealot triggered out of your mind by the mention of race, and are evidently unable to comprehend the fact that races are different. Just a pathetic man, honestly.


  • Zarroette
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    --> @triangle.128k
    What is with your obsession over racial IQ gaps? 
    Not an obsession, just a very important talking point, given the implications (I.Q. is an extremely strong predictor of the ability to function in a society).

  • RationalMadman
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    --> @Zarroette
    How do you deal with anomalies to an ethnicity? Are you going to 'pigeon hole' them into what the majority of their ethnicity is?
  • Zarroette
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    --> @RationalMadman
    How do you deal with anomalies to an ethnicity? Are you going to 'pigeon hole' them into what the majority of their ethnicity is?
    Depends on the circumstance. Obviously, a Black man with 130 I.Q., as rare as it is, is still a very smart man.

  • RationalMadman
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    --> @Zarroette
    Then I totally agree with the OP.
  • drafterman
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    --> @Zarroette
    Lol. Being factual about provable racial differences is "racist".
    It can be, yes. Indeed, racism often depends on the differences between races.

    So you're attempting to rebut my claim that racism is purely a slanderous term to discredit, and in doing so you're using a purely slanderous term to discredit.
    I don't think you know what slander means.

    Blacks have, on average, lower I.Q. than whites. Deal with it.
    You're a racist. Deal with it.

    Wrong. They can accurately predict crime and poverty.
    I think you have your causal factors mixed up.

    You're just an emotional zealot triggered out of your mind by the mention of race, and are evidently unable to comprehend the fact that races are different. Just a pathetic man, honestly.
    I'm not the one who started the thread, hon. I never said races aren't different. The categorization, as vague and as it may be, is never the less rooted in differences among people, however superficial. But I didn't think this thread was about races and was about you trying to get a free pass to spout racist nonsense without being called out as a racist.

    My bad.
  • Mister_Man
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    Great post.

    I find that nowadays it's significantly more common to hear people just blindly call you a "racist/bigot/____phobe" instead of engage in productive conversation or debate. We wont make it very far if we allow society to continue to decline to this form of communication.

    I can't even wear my MAGA hat to an anti racism rally to show support and solidarity and to show that people with different political views can stand alongside these guys because I'll be instantly branded a racist and cast away from the event.

    I can't have a conversation with my coworker because when she brings up the high police shooting rate with blacks, I bring up the high crime rate with blacks and then she calls me racist and ends the conversation.

    We won't get anywhere if these terms are used to silence and demonize people. If anything, modern use of many of these "social justice" words are trivializing the actual terms which were originally used to describe people who have a deep blanketed hatred toward an entire ethnic demographic, regardless of individual merit.

    Meh, the world is slowly seeing what bullshit it all is and more and more people are taking the red pill, so we're gaining numbers.
  • Castin
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    It's definitely meaningless scientifically speaking. We just kinda use the word "racism" because we need a name for the particular sort of prejudice we see here:

    "...its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests upon the great truth, that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery—subordination to the superior race—is his natural and normal condition. This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth."

  • Zarroette
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    --> @drafterman
    It can be, yes. Indeed, racism often depends on the differences between races.
    So pointing out something that is factually accurate (racial differences) is akin to being "literally Hitler".

    The whole site is laughing at you.

    I don't think you know what slander means.
    I don't think you know much at all.

    You're a racist. Deal with it.
    If you bothered to read the OP properly (not a bad idea to do before commenting), then you'd know this term is meaningless.

    I think you have your causal factors mixed up.
    Please stop thinking. We're losing braincells reading your posts.

    I'm not the one who started the thread, hon. I never said races aren't different. The categorization, as vague and as it may be, is never the less rooted in differences among people, however superficial. But I didn't think this thread was about races and was about you trying to get a free pass to spout racist nonsense without being called out as a racist.

    My bad.
    You haven't posted a shred of evidence to support your claims (unlike me). Instead, you've just called people whom disagree with you names, as if that's going to convince anyone (hint: it's not). This is a debate site where we post evidence/studies/sources to support what we say. If you can't rebut my racial claims without calling me a meaningless term (racist), then you don't belong here.

    So, shove off, zealot.




  • Tejretics
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    --> @drafterman
    I think it's true that African-American people, for instance, have statistically lower IQ than white people -- I wouldn't say that saying that is necessarily racist. The problem, I think, is that IQ is a deeply flawed measure of intelligence constructed in a way that privileges people with other social and economic privilege. See, for instance, this: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com...

  • triangle.128k
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    Not an obsession,
    lol

    just a very important talking point, given the implications (I.Q. is an extremely strong predictor of the ability to function in a society).
    Proof?
  • Smithereens
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    --> @Zarroette
    I think you're effectively arguing that racial hatred is what racism should be, instead of the more mundane things you think it's being applied to. I agree with the sentiment. That being said, I have a white supremacist friend who says noongas are dysfunctional in Australia . imo he's correct, but I think he's racist because aside from that, he also hates black people. As far as I've seen, as often as abos are dysfunctional so too are people who claim that abos are dysfunctional are themselves racist. But not strictly for thinking that abos are dysfunctional, it's just a correlation.  



  • Smithereens
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    --> @Tejretics
    That is a limitation of IQ testing, not a fundamental flaw. Also the source you cite specifically questions the Raven's test because it was unfairly asserted that the Raven's could unbiasedly test both Africans and non-africans for intelligence.

    We don't actually need IQ tests however to establish that there is a black-white intelligence difference. This neuropsychological test for instance found that even when blacks were matched with whites for education history, they still underperformed: 
    • Manly, J. J., Jacobs, D. M., Touradji, P., Small, S. A., & Stern, Y. (2002). Reading level attenuates differences in neuropsychological test performance between African American and White elders. Journal of the International Neuropsychological Society8(3), 341-348.
  • drafterman
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    --> @Zarroette
    So pointing out something that is factually accurate (racial differences) is akin to being "literally Hitler".
    I'm not aware of where or when I made that comparison.

    If you bothered to read the OP properly (not a bad idea to do before commenting), then you'd know this term is meaningless.
    Except I provided an easy-to-use link you can click to find out what its meaning is.

    You haven't posted a shred of evidence to support your claims (unlike me). Instead, you've just called people whom disagree with you names, as if that's going to convince anyone (hint: it's not). This is a debate site where we post evidence/studies/sources to support what we say. If you can't rebut my racial claims without calling me a meaningless term (racist), then you don't belong here.

    Well, I did. I provided a link to the meaning of "racist" which shows it has meaning. And it probably wasn't written by a right-wing crank, either. ;)

  • drafterman
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    --> @Tejretics
    I think it's true that African-American people, for instance, have statistically lower IQ than white people -- I wouldn't say that saying that is necessarily racist. The problem, I think, is that IQ is a deeply flawed measure of intelligence constructed in a way that privileges people with other social and economic privilege.
    Forgive me of I choose not to miss the forest for the trees, here. I agree with your second sentence, so let's evaluate the first in light of that agreement:

    Acknowledging it as a flawed measure of anything other than the ability to take an IQ test, why would anyone bring this up as a point! The OP isn't a poorly programmed robot mindlessly spouting bad science trivial. There is a purpose, a reason, why certain groups of people roll out the "Blacks don't IQ" misinformation: they think blacks are mentally inferior to whites and want to believe that science backs them on this.

    Just read the OP. Now it isn't just IQ, it's ability to "function in society", it's linked to crime and poverty. So, now not only do blacks have low IQ, but the're criminals, poor, and unable to function in civilization. And should we take bets on what OP believes the genesis of their poverty is? Do we think OP believes it's a result of centuries of oppression, social stigma, systemic racism, and willingness of the government to too readily look away from the problem? Or because it's the black's fault because they're spending all their time doing crimes and not being educated and functioning in society?

    So yes. Yes it is racist. Fuck yeah it's racist. You can't unironically trot out that point and not be racist. It only serves one agenda.
  • Analgesic.Spectre
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    --> @drafterman
    Not that I think Zarroette's post are much more than emotional hysterics embroiled with the odd semblance of truth, but your answers have been far from convincing -- again. You've engaged in all kinds of dog-whistle name-calling (racist, right wing crank, antisemitic etc.), *attempted* witty one-liners and managed to link only a dictionary definition. Even Smithereens, who is prone to prolonged bouts of mental dysfunction, managed to salvage the morsels of truth in Zarroette's posts.

    Unquestionably, you're a shadow of a man with an ego made of glass.
  • drafterman
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    --> @Analgesic.Spectre
    I'd be interested in hearing what your objective evaluation of the OP's linked source is.
  • Analgesic.Spectre
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    --> @drafterman
    I'd be interested in hearing about your indefinite absence from this site.
  • drafterman
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    --> @Analgesic.Spectre
    You're a pleasant person.
  • Analgesic.Spectre
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    --> @drafterman
    Thank goodness one of us is pleasant.