Is god real?

Author: Alec ,

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  • Alec
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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOIbcOoaxuY is a very good video that made me Christian.  I flip on religion a lot, so if any atheists want to debunk the video, go ahead.  It's biased, but very convincing.

  • PressF4Respect
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    --> @Alec
    There are several videos which debunked that one.

    Here's just one of them:
  • Alec
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    --> @PressF4Respect
    Good points in the video.  I guess I'll have to change my profile.
  • Stephen
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    --> @Alec
     I flip on religion a lot,

    But still it appears, that you haven't caught on to what is causing you to "flip alot".
  • EtrnlVw
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    --> @Alec
    Good points in the video.  I guess I'll have to change my profile.

    Instead of having someone try and convince you God exists why don't you first focus on your own intuition, if it leads you to accept God exists then no video could really persuade you either way rather it would just be a good lecture or a poor one. A person can debunk someone's argument for God (because not all arguments are put together all that well) but in reality they can't really debunk the Creator. I build my own arguments for God according to all the information available but I don't flip flop on it because my experiences and observations already have me persuaded and therefore I do not necessarily need anyone to do that for me.
    The best thing a person can do is to look at the evidence that correlates with the nature of God, the nature of God transcends the human sense perception and our experience and observation of God transcends the material sense perception as well and in that you have to be willing to consider spirituality and spiritual encounters/sources. Beyond that any perspective about whether or not God exists is more of an opinion or an interpretation, like.... "it's obvious God exists when I observe life and the universe"..."it just makes sense"...."it fits better than any other proposition" ect ect.
  • drafterman
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    --> @EtrnlVw
    What makes you think the universe is consistent with our intuition? The two most accurate scientific theories in all human history are basically summed up as: "the universe is much weirder than we think."
  • EtrnlVw
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    --> @drafterman
    What makes you think the universe is consistent with our intuition?

    Not really the universe per say, more like your conscious experience which would be the soul and that soul is in relation to God. So intuition would be on par with how you understand something immediately about yourself, with how you instinctively feel. That's hard to do if your mind has been used to conditioned thinking but it's not impossible. 

    The two most accurate scientific theories in all human history are basically summed up as: "the universe is much weirder than we think."

    Haha the universe is much more simplistic when you understand its origins, at least it makes more sense. It may be weird to you because you think of it as some mystery, but on my end that wouldn't be the case. Actually it's quite genius how the Creator puts these worlds together for us to have an experience. 
  • EtrnlVw
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    --> @Alec
    Is there any particular reason you never respond to me? have I ever offended you in any way? just curious...
  • Tradesecret
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    --> @Alec
    Why does it matter to you? 


  • drafterman
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    --> @EtrnlVw
    I agree that the universe "makes more sense" when you limit yourself to only examining it as far as your intuition goes. But  actually isn't that simplistic. If it was, computers and GPS wouldn't work.
  • Mopac
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    --> @Alec
    Though I am sure you could find many good videos that convince of God's existence, it is actually even much simller than that.

    The Truth is God.

    You will find this understanding is consistently present in the writings of the church going back to the beginning.

    Do you really need to be convinced that Ultimate  Reality exists? By definition, it is more real than anything else you think is real.

    The existence of God is one of maybe a handful of things you can be certain of. The only thing that I am 100% certain of is that God exists. To profess that level of certainty tends to be met with scoffing by those who have superstitious conceptions of God.


    If you consider yourself a Christian now, I suggest you find an Orthodox Church. Evangelical/Protestant churches are too inconsistent, often times preaching recognized heresies from the pulpit. Besides that, The Orthodox Church has been around since the very beginning, and so it has HISTORY. It understands the faith it preaches. It knows the God it worships. 

    Coming from someone who spent an awful amount of time, effort, and study trying to find the right church. If I could save you the trouble, I would! But I understand that these are choices you habe to make, and that is between you and God.











  • PressF4Respect
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    --> @Mopac
    So, god is real because god is real?

    That line of reasoning suffers the same problems as Anselm's Ontological argument: it begs the question.
  • Mopac
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    --> @PressF4Respect
    I am not making a logical argument.


    The Truth is God.

    If you disagree, I don't  believe in whatever god you don't believe in either.
  • PressF4Respect
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    --> @Mopac
    You can believe whatever you want. I have no problems with that.

    However, if you're trying to use it convince someone (like Alec) to become Christian, then it would become a logical argument.

    In that case, it would be begging the question.
  • Alec
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    --> @EtrnlVw
    It wasn't you.  I had like 3 dozen notifications to sort out.  It's hard to respond to every single one.  I'll try to respond to you.

    The best thing a person can do is to look at the evidence that correlates with the nature of God
    Is there any evidence for God?  It's what I'm trying to figure out.
  • Mopac
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    --> @PressF4Respect
    I am simply asserting what is fact, that is not a logical argument.
  • Alec
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    --> @Tradesecret
    Why does it matter to you? 
    It's how I would go to heaven.  Heaven seems much more important than a life on Earth if heaven exists.  The thing is, does it exist?  I honestly am not sure, but am open to change my mind.
  • PressF4Respect
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    --> @Mopac
    I am simply asserting what is fact, that is not a logical argument.
    How is the existence of god a fact?

  • Tradesecret
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    --> @Alec
    It's how I would go to heaven.  Heaven seems much more important than a life on Earth if heaven exists.  The thing is, does it exist?  I honestly am not sure, but am open to change my mind.
    That is an intriguing perspective.  For me, and I am of the view that God is real, heaven is irrelevent to the question. Similarly with the notion of eternal or everlasting life.  Those things don't posit any real significance save as to incidentals. 

    For me, the question of God's reality has to do with substance. And reason. 

    But primarily it has to do with relationship and covenant. 

    The bible does not present the idea that heaven is more important than earth. In fact heaven and earth always seem to go hand in hand - God made the heavens and the earth. 

    I also don't see how whether God can be proved or not or believed in or not is relevant to the question of God's reality. 

    The fact is - either God is real or not. Whether we believe in him or not then becomes irrelevant. 


    The bible tells us that even the demons believe in God - so believing in that particular sense obviously does no good when it comes to the question of heaven or not.  





  • Alec
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    --> @Tradesecret
    The bible does not present the idea that heaven is more important than earth.
    <br>
    The bible says that heaven is eternal and life on Earth is only for a lifetime, now it's about 75 years.

    The bible tells us that even the demons believe in God - so believing in that particular sense obviously does no good when it comes to the question of heaven or not.  
    It does take more than belief to go to heaven.  Otherwise every Christian would go there, which sadly they don't.  If I believe God doesn't exist, but live how God wants me to live anyways, would I go to heaven?  I'm honestly not sure.
  • Mopac
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    --> @PressF4Respect
    I am speaking of God, not god. There is a distinction. 

    A lower case "g" god refers to a created being.

    Capital  "G" God very specifically refers to The Ultimate Reality.

    And if you know what that means, it should be apparent that while the essence of God is unknowable, it can be discerned that God by necessity exists. If God does not exist, then it would not be possible for us to have an experience of reality. If there is no Ultimate Reality, nothing is ultimately real. Yet clearly there is some form of existence, as all of our experience scientifically concludes. There is reality as we perceive it. If this exists, there must be a reality as it truly is. A reality that is not contingent on anything, but on which all realities derive their own existence.

    There is One True God, The Supreme and Ultimate Reality.

    Of course God exists. I have no doubt. I don't believe there is any other reasonable position. Certainly my God exists.



  • PressF4Respect
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    --> @Mopac
    So your definition of God is the experience of reality?
  • zedvictor4
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    --> @PressF4Respect
    There is obviously an ultimate reality.

    But whether the rituals of Mopac's church have anything to do with it, is another matter completely.

    Mopac undoubtedly has a conditioned bias. As do most ardent theists.

  • Mopac
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    --> @PressF4Respect
    No, I would say that our experience of reality is our relationship with God. The reality we experience is a type and shadow of reality as it truly is. 

    God is The Ultimate Reality. Our experience is a reality, but it is not ultimately real. All realities derive their existence from The Ultimate Reality, which is what gives existence to all things.

  • Mopac
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    --> @zedvictor4
    There is obviously an ultimate reality.

    But whether the rituals of Mopac's church have anything to do with it, is another matter completely.

    Mopac undoubtedly has a conditioned bias. As do most ardent theists


    You don't judge rightly, because you don't understand why  we do anything that we do. If you did, you'd realize many of these things you don't understand are part of what make the church truly catholic.