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@ebuc
Home owner who knows nothing about wiring looks in service panel and sees disorganized mess ---especially in days prior to 80's--- and calls electrician.electrician find the order after 2, 5 10 or so minutes.
Great example.
Home owner who knows nothing about wiring looks in service panel and sees disorganized mess ---especially in days prior to 80's--- and calls electrician.electrician find the order after 2, 5 10 or so minutes.
You and I are essentially the same...Just slightly different programming, resulting in slightly different biased data sequences, that's all.
UNPREDICTABILITY =/= FREEWILLUNPREDICTABILITY =/= RANDOM
APPARENT UNPREDICTABILITY =/= RANDOMAPPARENT UNPREDICTABILITY = PSEUDO RANDOM
I haven't a clue, given what you've said, why you would think free will is nonexistent.
(2) your thoughts (and actions) are random (uncaused by any previous experiences).
(IFF) an action or event is uncaused (100% free of cause and effect) (THEN) it must necessarily be INDISTINGUISHABLE FROM RANDOM
Second, an event free of cause does not mean it is necessarily free of effect.
Third, "random" is not necessarily related to cause. You have shown no correlative relationship between the two.
Observe this experiment: Say we tell you to chose the red, or the blue pill, and you freely chose the blue pill, not knowing that there was no red pill. We used a hologram to fool you.
It takes at a minimum, two too tango ---interference-----. And then, as Jackie Gleason would say, ..' and away we go'....
If an action or event is uncaused (100% free of HISTORICAL cause and effect) (THEN) it must necessarily be INDISTINGUISHABLE FROM RANDOM
The Oxford English Dictionary defines "random" as "Having no definite aim or purpose; not sent or guided in a particular direction; made, done, occurring, etc., without method or conscious choice; haphazard." [POST#25]"without method or conscious choice"
By this definition, every action taken by an animal (lacking a pre-frontal cortex) is RANDOM.
By this definition, every event, geological and or meteorological, is RANDOM.
By this definition, the movements of every plant and every insect and every bacterium are RANDOM.
(IFF) this is truly your preferred definition of RANDOM (THEN) please explain to me what word you would use to describe something that is epistemologically and fundamentally UNPREDICTABLE.
The coercion "works" precisely because humans will PREDICTABLY choose to save their own skins.
Someone's "decision" to "choose the blue pill" is highly constrained.
Is the subject free to walk away and choose neither the red nor blue pills?
Has the subject been contaminated with any enticements or vague threats regarding their choice?
Does the subject have a natural attraction or repulsion to pills in general?
Has the subject acquired a natural preference for one of these colors over the other?
Is the subject seeking your personal approval and thus more sensitive to your overall tone and body-language?
They are not fundamentally intractable.
They are not epistemologically unknowable.
They are not ultimately unpredictable.
None of the things you used as examples are unpredictable.
Your initial position of denying free will has locked you into the untenable position of having to claim that human thought is predictable, when nothing in our long history has proven less predictable than human thought.
Would you describe yourself as a DETERMINIST?
Are you perhaps unfamiliar with the work of Edward Bernays?
Would you describe yourself as a DETERMINIST?No, you described the behaviour of plants and animals. None of the things you used as examples were unpredictable.
Are you perhaps unfamiliar with the work of Edward Bernays?No, but it is obvious I understand it better.
Have you ever tried to train a dog?
Even animals and plants and weather patterns are difficult (if not impossible) for an individual human mind to predict.
Are you perhaps unfamiliar with the work of Edward Bernays?
Please demonstrate.
We are able to train dogs because their behavior IS predictable.
Even animals and plants and weather patterns are difficult (if not impossible) for an individual human mind to predict.?? As opposed to the human hive mind?
Are you perhaps unfamiliar with the work of Edward Bernays?No, but it is obvious I understand it better.
27 days later
88 days later
free will is a fact
The problem with denial of free will from an orthodox perspective is that it is in effect blaming God for everything.
Even choosing NOT to be a slave to our desires, to not fulfill them.