Recycled Roles Mafia DP1

Author: Lunatic

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drafterman
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@Discipulus_Didicit
I see it, but am inclined to disagree.

1. Forcing people to claim a game requires more research than forcing them to claim a player. Indeed, I see no reason to fake claim a player at all unless it is a player who only played in a few games. Grey claimed Danielle. Danielle was in a ton of games. There would simply be no reason to fake claim a player.

2. Yeah, they can hand pick a game that has a lot of roles, but this isn't a problem unique to this strategy. If you have a character like Danielle or me or Lunatic or someone else that was prolific, then you that necessarily comes with a ton of roles to choose from. Consider: In even the largest of Mafia games only had 20-30 people. However, players like me were in over a hundred mafia games over the years. Claiming me presents them with more role options than picking even a huge game.

3. Locking people into games first, then players increases the possibility of a CC since games are fewer than players and players are necessarily unique. The reverse makes it less likely since a given player will have more games than a game will have players and games aren't necessarily unique.
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@oromagi
I have found a few more examples of games my username was in, a couple within our subset and a couple without.

Please clarify on the meaning of the word subset in this context.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
you do know we are working with a limited set of games, right?

POST#2

"All roles can be found from games here: http://www.debate.org/forums/games/topic/28126/3/"
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@drafterman
I see it, but am inclined to disagree.

1. Forcing people to claim a game requires more research than forcing them to claim a player. Indeed, I see no reason to fake claim a player at all unless it is a player who only played in a few games. Grey claimed Danielle. Danielle was in a ton of games. There would simply be no reason to fake claim a player.

2. Yeah, they can hand pick a game that has a lot of roles, but this isn't a problem unique to this strategy. If you have a character like Danielle or me or Lunatic or someone else that was prolific, then you that necessarily comes with a ton of roles to choose from. Consider: In even the largest of Mafia games only had 20-30 people. However, players like me were in over a hundred mafia games over the years. Claiming me presents them with more role options than picking even a huge game.

3. Locking people into games first, then players increases the possibility of a CC since games are fewer than players and players are necessarily unique. The reverse makes it less likely since a given player will have more games than a game will have players and games aren't necessarily unique.
roughly what I was thinking last night.   but it was already  too late then or now to switch
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@drafterman
Point one is completely moot because as I told GP counterclaiming is not the point of the mass claim anyway and I am okay with scum giving their real characters since lunatic made it obvious that characters are alignment themed in a way that town might be able to figure out in later DPs.

Point 2 and 3 make sense though so you have me somewhat convinced. Bit too late now though I guess since most people fucked up the popcorn and claimed out of turn so now claiming game is the same as a full claim for most people.
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@oromagi
Limited set. lol, it's almost 300 games over the span of 7 years. It's basically all the games that ever happened on DDO.
Lunatic
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Same as I did with the previous replacement, removing votes on or by replaced players from before they were replaced.

Official Vote Count:

Oromagi- 3/6-Bullish, drafterman, DD
Greyparrot- 2/6-  iLikePie5, speed


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@drafterman
Well, its been a long time since I took a math class but I remember learning that a set could have 300 elements and still be considered limited to those 300 elements.

You would know better than I how comprehensive the list is but I don't see any of the Beginner's games- so that some 180 games right there and when I'm doing searching for names I'm finding many games that aren't in this record.

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@oromagi
This isn't a math problem, it is a linguistics problem. Necessarily there are a limited number of games no matter what the scope is because there aren't an infinite amount of games anywhere. The decision to qualify the statement with the word "limited" suggests a relatively small sample. Otherwise the statement is just a pointless observation.

You still need to claim.
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The decision to qualify the statement with the word "limited" suggests a relatively small sample.
Well, that's where your math+linguistics went wrong.  "limited" suggests a defined sample, not a small sample. In this case, our subset is defined by the DDO archives.

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@drafterman
This isn't a math problem, it is a linguistics problem. Necessarily there are a limited number of games no matter what the scope is because there aren't an infinite amount of games anywhere. The decision to qualify the statement with the word "limited" suggests a relatively small sample. Otherwise the statement is just a pointless observation.

Unless he knows something we don't know about how lunatic chose the games. Something he figured out that we weren't able to because we lacked certain information.
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@drafterman
I feel comfortable ending the DP with an oro lynch now assuming we have at least a few posts from everyone since the mass claim started and which I will check now to see whether this is the case. What do you think of just lynching oro right now?
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I feel comfortable ending the DP with an oro lynch now
Let's note that "now" is a lie.  DD was VTL'ing me before I even joined the game, before I advised him that my claiming was anti-town. 

assuming we have at least a few posts from everyone since the mass claim started and which I will check now to see whether this is the case. What do you think of just lynching oro right now?
again- only scum would benefit.

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@oromagi
Well, that's where your math+linguistics went wrong.  "limited" suggests a defined sample, not a small sample. In this case, our subset is defined by the DDO archives.
Yeah, we know. So why did you decide it was necessary to point it out?


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@oromagi
P.S. You still need to claim.
drafterman
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I'm fine with lynching someone that refuses to cooperate with town.

If he has decided in his limited wisdom that dying is more beneficial to town than claiming then who am I to question it.

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There is no reason to VTL someone unless you want to lynch them immediately, therefore if DD VTL'd me earlier then he must have wanted my immediate lynch earlier.

-oromagi 2020
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@drafterman
--> @oromagi
Well, that's where your math+linguistics went wrong.  "limited" suggests a defined sample, not a small sample. In this case, our subset is defined by the DDO archives.
Yeah, we know. So why did you decide it was necessary to point it out?
who's we?


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@oromagi
Everyone in this game.
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@drafterman
@oromagi
Very well. Lunatic specifically said that copy pasting role PMs is allowed so...

You are Geographia’s role from Subutai’s Hindu mafia. Your role: Geographia - You are Ganesh. Known as the "remover of obstacles", you are able to eliminate anything that stands in the way of your desires. Therefore, you are the 1x Executioner. During the day, if any player has more than half the number of votes necessary to lynch them, you may choose to have them die, ending the Day Phase as if they were actually lynched.
http://www.debate.org/forums/games/topic/104680/

I am sending lunatic the lynch order now. You be dead oro, might as well come clean.
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Womp womp.
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@oromagi
If you are town we need your full claim before lunatic officially closes the DP.
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@drafterman



--> @oromagi
Well, that's where your math+linguistics went wrong.  "limited" suggests a defined sample, not a small sample. In this case, our subset is defined by the DDO archives.
Yeah, we know. So why did you decide it was necessary to point it out?

DD asked:

oromagi
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@Discipulus_Didicit

--> @drafterman @oromagi
Very well. Lunatic specifically said that copy pasting role PMs is allowed so...

You are Geographia’s role from Subutai’s Hindu mafia. Your role: Geographia - You are Ganesh. Known as the "remover of obstacles", you are able to eliminate anything that stands in the way of your desires. Therefore, you are the 1x Executioner. During the day, if any player has more than half the number of votes necessary to lynch them, you may choose to have them die, ending the Day Phase as if they were actually lynched.

I am sending lunatic the lynch order now. You be dead oro, might as well come clean.
I am Marauder
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@Discipulus_Didicit
Whatever the reason for Oro not claiming, I am still absolutely 100% convinced Lunatic would have given Oro a safe name and a safe role claim if Oro was actually scum.

It's not a scum tell with Luna as the mod.
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@oromagi
Idk what marauder means. If you are town paste your PM like I did so that town has as much info as possible going into the NP. Hurry before the mod closes the DP.
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@oromagi
Why did you wait so long?
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@Discipulus_Didicit
Marauder was a user on DDO
oromagi
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@Discipulus_Didicit
If you are town we need your full claim before lunatic officially closes the DP.

I full claimed in first post:

Hickory dickory DOC!
Bullish climbed up my cock.
he licked my log
cried, "tastes like FROG!"
then splooged his shorts, hard as a rock.


I am Marauder/doctor/FROG from  Animal KIngdom, the very first game Archived (which is why I felt it was too obvious to reveal)


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@drafterman
@oromagi
Marauder was a user on DDO

That isn't a full claim then. Oro you are already dead we might as well see your full role before it becomes official.