which conservatives were right in the LGBT civil rights supreme court case?

Author: n8nrgmi

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PressF4Respect
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
hate speech is a made up bs term, but content that wouldn't be permitted in Canada would be permitted in the U.S. because of the constitution so....

the U.S. citizens have a God given right to free speech/press, a right the government must recognize, does Canada?  or is Canada's freedom of the press given to them by the government?
Read the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, and then we'll talk.

the U.S. has overreaching interference from the state?  any examples to back up that claim?
You said:
Freedom of the press is not construed as an absence of interference or outside entities, such as a government or religious organization...
To which I replied:
Freedom of the press or freedom of the media is the principle that communication and expression through various media, including printed and electronic media, especially published materials, should be considered a right to be exercised freely. Such freedom implies the absence of interference from an overreaching state;
Stop strawmanning what I say.

the list of censorship examples doesn't help your case, they get overturned in court because of the constitution, unlike Canada's hate speech laws.
All of them got overturned?

Also, this:
Nevertheless, freedom of the press in the United States is subject to certain restrictions, such as defamation law, a lack of protection for whistleblowers, barriers to information access and constraints caused by public and government hostility to journalists.


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@Greyparrot
@TheDredPriateRoberts
@ILikePie5
Article 5 isn't something where countries can just go meh. It's binding to all member nations. This means that an attack on one NATO member nation is an attack on ALL. The US attacking Canada would be a declaration of war to every single NATO member.

Also, if the US were to invade Canada, it would instantly become a pariah state. Its trustworthiness on the global state would vanish, and almost every single country on this planet would immediately place embargoes on it. The US economy would completely collapse. And when I said 28 nations, I was just referring to those in NATO. Other countries would also join in (as they would see the US as a threat), and pretty soon it would be WWIII, with the US on one side and everyone else on the other

But lemme guess, you guys think the US would still win 🤣
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@PressF4Respect
America is already a pariah state. We might as well do the crime if we already did the time.
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@PressF4Respect
Article 5 isn't something where countries can just go meh. It's binding to all member nations. This means that an attack on one NATO member nation is an attack on ALL. The US attacking Canada would be a declaration of war to every single NATO member
Yup, Luxembourg is gonna send it’s troops to fight against the Americans. NATO countries can’t do anything without the US. If we withdrew from NATO every single country would have to deal with the Russians. Have fun with that.

Also, if the US were to invade Canada, it would instantly become a pariah state. Its trustworthiness on the global state would vanish, and almost every single country on this planet would immediately place embargoes on it. The US economy would completely collapse. And when I said 28 nations, I was just referring to those in NATO. Other countries would also join in (as they would see the US as a threat), and pretty soon it would be WWIII, with the US on one side and everyone else on the other.

But lemme guess, you guys think the US would still win 🤣
That wasn’t the premise. In a 1v1 the US would crush Canada. If you disagree with that then you’re ignorant or you need help lol.
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@Greyparrot
America is already a pariah state. We might as well do the crime if we already did the time.
Canadiens really be delusional🤣
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@Greyparrot
You think Russia, China, and the US combined could conquer the world without the use of WMDs?
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@PressF4Respect
Canada doesn't have anything like libel laws?  do you know what they are and what they do?  I'm quite frankly shocked.  Your link shows the U.S. has whistle blower protections.  Cases that are proven to violate the constitution are overturned there are thousands of cases you can read.

so your not going to deny my points on hate speech, I mean you could have just admitted it but that would be expecting too much I guess.
the fact that your government can restrict your speech like that is really all that needs to be said, you don't have a right to free speech because it's been restricted and could be further right?  why not?  hate speech is vague, abstract etc  since your government is defining it they can further define it, what's to stop them?

There are no inalienable rights in Canada.
A legal right is a claim to a benefit. The law sets legal rights, and the courts will enforce them if no one else will. 

What good is a right if the government can scrap it? That’s where a constitution comes into play. It’s a superlaw that tells the government what laws it can and cannot write. And it’s very difficult for the government to change the constitution. The Canadian Charter is the part of our constitution that orders the government to respect certain human rights.

The Charter promises us this safety, but it doesn’t really deliver. There are several loopholes in the Charter that let the federal parliament, provincial legislatures, or the courts take away rights.

If the government can justify this law as reasonable “in a free and democratic society,” it can get away with it

it speaks for itself, I guess you wanted me to read up on the charter because you didn't understand it?  you don't have rights, you have privileges granted to you by the government subject to change by the government.  Maybe you don't understand the difference between that and the U.S. constitution?
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@ILikePie5
Yup, Luxembourg is gonna send it’s troops to fight against the Americans.
Yup, so is everyone else.

NATO countries can’t do anything without the US. If we withdrew from NATO every single country would have to deal with the Russians. Have fun with that.
You guys would too. Have fun with that.

That wasn’t the premise. In a 1v1 the US would crush Canada. If you disagree with that then you’re ignorant or you need help lol.
A 1v1 US-Canada War would very quickly turn into another Vietnam, or Iraq, or Afghanistan – except a lot closer to home.

Also, why are you basing outward superiority solely on military might? Ever heard of soft power?
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@ILikePie5
Israel is stronger than Russia.

Also, it's best to let Canada dissolve naturally if it continues to elect soy leaders. Then the USA can walk in without any resistance.
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@Swagnarok
who is saying anything of the kind?  I haven't read anything  about discrimination being ok, maybe I missed those posts.  It's really a non issue which I thought I made clear.  An employer could easily find another reason or in many cases not have to give a reason to fire someone.  Nothing was really solved, read up on your state's labor laws.
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@PressF4Respect
Yup, so is everyone else.
привет русский агент

You guys would too. Have fun with that.
Really? Hmm let’s see would the Russians come after us first or Europe? We have nukes. Russia has nukes. You on the other hand 😬

A 1v1 US-Canada War would very quickly turn into another Vietnam, or Iraq, or Afghanistan – except a lot closer to home.

Also, why are you basing outward superiority solely on military might? Ever heard of soft power?
Irrelevant. We’d defeat your military easily. We’d take Ottawa within a month. You couldn’t do the same in a 1v1 with minimal external influence. Just admit it, American military is far superior in technology and numbers compared to Canada. 
ILikePie5
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@Greyparrot
Also, it's best to let Canada dissolve naturally if it continues to elect soy leaders. Then the USA can walk in without any resistance.
Ya we’ll let em defund their military. Soyboys don’t know how to fight.
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@PressF4Respect
???
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@ILikePie5
How long did Saddam last with a military 10 times the size of Canada's? All it takes is a leader willing to use extreme force.

Operation Desert Storm (17 January 1991 – 28 February 1991)
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
Sure, but laws set moral examples, because people will base their morals off of the crowd and they believe what the establishment or majority thinks is right (I mean, how many people eventually changed their minds about LGBT stuff because the media spent 30 years shilling for it). Some employers might not care about them but others take the moral examples set by laws seriously, especially if such is billed as an anti-discrimination law. Others may be worried that one day it'll catch up to them and they'll be successfully sued for said form of illegal discrimination. Overall it accomplishes good.
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@Greyparrot
How long did Saddam last with a military 10 times the size of Canada's? All it takes is a leader willing to use extreme force.

Operation Desert Storm (17 January 1991 – 28 February 1991)
Literally a month. US military could probably do it in a week.
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@Swagnarok
They think transgenderism is a mental disorder, and that it should be "cured" (whatever that would entail). In the context of OP's thread, that also means that they believe transgendered people should not have equal protection against employment discrimination.
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@ILikePie5
привет русский агент
что?

Really? Hmm let’s see would the Russians come after us first or Europe? We have nukes. Russia has nukes. You on the other hand 😬
Yup, cuz we all know nukes are the only determinant of strength. It's not like Russia would invade the US through subtler means.

Irrelevant. We’d defeat your military easily. We’d take Ottawa within a month. You couldn’t do the same in a 1v1 with minimal external influence. Just admit it, American military is far superior in technology and numbers compared to Canada. 
Does that make the US superior to Canada overall?
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@Swagnarok
morality?  I'm sorry to tell you but those days have been long gone.  It's moral to loot, kill, beat up, riot etc  Families and religion are major pillars of morality and you can see the state of those.  It's a sad reality there is very little morality left.  There's really nothing that isn't acceptable, hell even the pedophiles were trying to claim it's a disorder or some garbage, they may actually get legitimacy some day.  Given all the orientations etc is it that far fetched?  Whatever morality standards are left are rock bottom, not much it taboo or off limits anymore.  Sorry but this ruling is close to pandering or appeasing.  The laws I've read leads me to believe what I have said, much to do about nothing.  Most work places is not the time or place to discuss anything about sex and I certainly would have a policy about that.   How about Muslim business?  It's against their religion do they have to hire gays/trans whatever?  Can they not fire them if they find out?
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
Canada doesn't have anything like libel laws?  do you know what they are and what they do?  I'm quite frankly shocked. 
America doesn't have anything like libel laws?  do you know what they are and what they do?  I'm quite frankly shocked. 

Your link shows the U.S. has whistle blower protections.

Cases that are proven to violate the constitution are overturned there are thousands of cases you can read.
Schenk v. United States (1919)
Freedom of speech can be limited during wartime. The government can restrict expressions that “would create a clear and present danger that they will bring about the substantive evils that Congress has a right to prevent.”

Debs v. United States (1919)
The First Amendment did not protect an anti-war speech designed to obstruct recruiting

Morse v. Frederick (2007)
The First Amendment did not protect a public school student’s right to display a banner reading “Bong Hits 4 Jesus”. While students have the right to engage in political speech, the right was outweighed by the school’s mission to discourage drug use.

(just to name a few)

so your not going to deny my points on hate speech, I mean you could have just admitted it but that would be expecting too much I guess.
Again, what do you consider hate speech? Because there are obviously things that shouldn't be said in a public forum.

the fact that your government can restrict your speech like that is really all that needs to be said, you don't have a right to free speech because it's been restricted and could be further right?  why not?  hate speech is vague, abstract etc  since your government is defining it they can further define it, what's to stop them? 
it speaks for itself, I guess you wanted me to read up on the charter because you didn't understand it?  you don't have rights, you have privileges granted to you by the government subject to change by the government.  Maybe you don't understand the difference between that and the U.S. constitution?
From Wikipedia:
When the [Canadian] government has limited an individual's right, there is an onus upon the Crown to show, on the balance of probabilities, firstly, that the limitation was prescribed by law namely, that the law is attuned to the values of accessibility and intelligibility; and secondly, that it is justified in a free and democratic society, which means that it must have a justifiable purpose and must be proportional.
The Canadian Government can't just take away rights willy-nilly. More specifically
the incorporation of section 1 in the Charter proves that freedom of expression, which is a basic right, may be limited when its exercise causes harm to the public interest or the rights of others.

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@PressF4Respect
что
🤦‍♂️ 

Yup, cuz we all know nukes are the only determinant of strength. It's not like Russia would invade the US through subtler means.
They’re welcome to try.

Does that make the US superior to Canada overall?
If we can destroy your government and destroy your industry without breaking a sweat? Definitely. The nation that can cripple another nation is inherently advanced and therefore superior.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
Canada hasn’t incorporated their rights to my understanding. I bet he doesn’t even know what incorporation is.
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@ILikePie5
They’re welcome to try.
Я думаю, что у них уже есть, товарищ

If we can destroy your government and destroy your industry without breaking a sweat? Definitely. The nation that can cripple another nation is inherently advanced and therefore superior.
Yup, cuz military strength automatically means superiority. I guess North Korea would be superior to South Korea as well.
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@PressF4Respect
Я думаю, что у них уже есть, товарищ
Laughable.

Yup, cuz military strength automatically means superiority. I guess North Korea would be superior to South Korea as well.
Ya about that 😬

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@PressF4Respect
You can think whatever you want about me, I am telling you that I understand war (even flamewar) on a level that most humans can't begin to. You can tell me that what you're doing is like engaging a scam-caller but why do you engage scam-callers in the first place? Even if you waste their time and wind them up, so what?

You are in every single level of strategy, losing this flamewar. They are controlling where you go with the conversation, how you go about dealing with it and you are solely reacting, obeying and copying them. Until you understand that you should sometimes quit a flamewar when the enemy/enemies control the terrain, you won't understand why I let Ramshutu get the last word even if he'd 'won' the situation and others jeered him on. You're not proving them wrong, you're actually being very hostile and I personally contacted the mods about the situation but they haven't shut the threads down where you and these guys are engaging, yet.

You are just going to get angrier and angrier and say more things like 'drink bleach' and sarcastic things about the Nazis that not just fuel them with quotes to troll you but make you look like the evil maniac. I am telling you that you are not going to win this flamewar, just drop it. Everyone with any braincells can see that they are trolling and no one who is right-wing, centrist or left-wing is going to read their taunts and jestful retorts to you and go 'oh yeah I am convinced'. They neither are out-debating you nor are you out-debating them, the difference is that they are not trying to. They are solely trying to wind you up and make you say nasty things to make the left-wing look evil and also to get a sadistic giggle out of it. I have blocked greyparrot a few days ago and both bmdrocks and ilikepie5 know that I completely disagree with them, the main difference between you and I is that I don't engage them when they are trying to troll me, I just leave the thread or solely interact with others around them. You will 'win' and get a lot more out of your interactions in the forums if you reduce the interactions with people you dislike, streamline those unpleasant interactions to make the other understand why you are irritated by them (if you interact at all with them) and increase your interactions with those you agree with and enjoy.
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@PressF4Respect
Again, what do you consider hate speech? Because there are obviously things that shouldn't be said in a public forum.

it's not what I consider hate speech it's what the Canadian government has classified hate speech, which could NOT happen in the U.S. because of the constitution, but did happen in Canada.  You keep trying to skirt the point by playing dumb, but it's not working.

The Canadian government can change rights far more easily than the U.S. can change the constitution which is proved by the hate speech laws.

 that the law is attuned to the values of accessibility and intelligibility; and secondly, that it is justified in a free and democratic society, which means that it must have a justifiable purpose and must be proportional.
 Charter proves that freedom of expression, which is a basic right, may be limited when its exercise causes harm to the public interest or the rights of others.

and who makes those determinations????  THE CANADIAN GOVERNMENT   LOL

which is extremely different than "shall not be infringed"

so you have "rights" (more like permission) until such a time the Canadian government chooses to change, modify or alter it so long as they can justify it, which means they aren't actual rights because they are given, that which is given can also be taken as evidenced by hate speech.

the Canadian government has a lot more authority to infringe on rights than the U.S. government.  The U.S. constitution limits government, Canadian government limits itself, but I'm not sure you can see that.
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@ILikePie5
Laughable.
Kinda like the 45th president of the US, lol.

Did I touch a nerve? Sorry.

Ya about that 😬
Ok? My main point still stands.

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@PressF4Respect
Kinda like the 45th president of the US, lol.

Did I touch a nerve? Sorry.
Lmaoooo 

Ok? My main point still stands.
Looks like you can’t read like me
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@RationalMadman
I know they spout nonsense. I know they've been doing so in this thread since Pie changed the topic from transgenderism to "US is better than Canada". I just engage them because I'm interested in what flavor of nonsense they're going to spew next (cuz I'm bored lol).
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@ILikePie5
Looks like you can’t read like me
I don't think I want to read like you, or anyone else who misses half my points and strawmans the other half.