Why do Conservatives Care so Much About Taxes?

Author: bmdrocks21 ,

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  • bmdrocks21
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    This is partially taken from another thread, as I wasn't given an answer at all.

    But honestly: why do conservatives only seem to care about low taxes, or at least make that their main priority?

    I can understand why GOP politicians do it, whether that be from being corrupt or appeasing self-interested voters.

    Having low taxes is good, but that isn't related to what "conservatism" is. It is about maintaining order, promoting traditional American values, preserving culture/the family, and rejecting egalitarianism, to simplify it for the thread.

    Was it the "Reagan Revolution" that hyperfocused us on taxation?

    As cultural marxism and moral relativism are penetrating the American consciousness, as the cornerstone of our communities- the Church- is being spit on and demonized by the media and religion is dying off, our history is being erased as monuments are defiled and destroyed, big tech is censoring conservative opinions, universities are indoctrinating students, among other things.

    All neocons can seem to advocate for is war and raising our debt by lowering taxes. Why have the majority of supposed "conservatives" ignored all of these much more pressing social issues?

    What have conservatives actually "conserved" over the past 50 years? I am starting to think the meme of "conservatives are the liberals from ten years ago" is reality and not just a joke.
  • SupaDudz
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    The Church is an essential part to our society. The left tries to destroy the church despite it actually being beneficial to society to maintain order. A world without religion and fear of an after life will humans to be immoral, with no care for life
  • bmdrocks21
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    --> @SupaDudz
    Exactly, and it maintains unity within communities. The values of the Church and the universal morality that come with it bring Americans together and offers consistency.

    Leftists attempt to destroy the Church and then destroy the family by having a government check replace the father.

    They destroy two of the most important units in our country and offer nothing to replace it, except for *surprise surprise* the big government and the power they love so much.

    The whole Democrat platform and their power is only sustainable if people are perpetually reliant on the government for its check.
  • HistoryBuff
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    I don't think "conservative" actually means anything any more. The term has become so watered down it means nothing.

    The republican party (the leadership of it anyway) is about serving rich people. (please note the dems are a whole lot better). So that is why they are so obsessed with taxes. Rich people don't particularly need the services of the government. They have the money to do whatever they want anyway, so why would they want to pay into that system? Also, they know they can make the government borrow money to bail them out anyway (see 2008 financial crisis as well as current crisis). So even if they don't pay any taxes, they know they can still get the things they want from the government anyway.

    The republican party have used "conservatives" for a long time. They might agree with them (or might not), but they don't actually fight for them. They will put up a token fight to fire up their base, but then they go back to what they actually care about. Making the rich richer. 


  • SupaDudz
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    The leftist assume that the Church itself is in support of the sometimes cruel methods and corruption inside the church. The Church's ultimate goal is to be an uniting force into driving good. The leadership of the church causes many leftist to believe the church is bad (eg: r-word priest, money loitering, evasion). Those small few have clogged the minds of the left and there goal now is to destroy the Church as a whole.

    If you blame the leader for being corrupt, they have all the power. The same will happen if they give the government more power. Oh the irony
  • HistoryBuff
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    --> @SupaDudz
    The leftist assume that the Church itself is in support of the sometimes cruel methods and corruption inside the church. The Church's ultimate goal is to be an uniting force into driving good. The leadership of the church causes many leftist to believe the church is bad (eg: r-word priest, money loitering, evasion). Those small few have clogged the minds of the left and there goal now is to destroy the Church as a whole.
    what church are you even talking about? there are probably dozens of branches of Christianity in america. Let alone all the other religions. 

  • SupaDudz
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    --> @HistoryBuff
    Every branch I've seen has been attacked for Catholic, Orthodox, Lutheran, etc. All Churches have the same ultimate goals in their beliefs, it's just about who manages it


  • bmdrocks21
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    --> @HistoryBuff
    I don't think "conservative" actually means anything any more. The term has become so watered down it means nothing.

    I am unfortunately thinking that is the case, myself.

    The republican party (the leadership of it anyway) is about serving rich people. (please note the dems are a whole lot better). So that is why they are so obsessed with taxes. Rich people don't particularly need the services of the government. They have the money to do whatever they want anyway, so why would they want to pay into that system? Also, they know they can make the government borrow money to bail them out anyway (see 2008 financial crisis as well as current crisis). So even if they don't pay any taxes, they know they can still get the things they want from the government anyway.

    I'm not sure one party is much better than the other. They just have different masters. While Republicans have low taxes, for instance, Democrats get lobbied to give valuable deductions and credits.

    And this isn't about billionaires not wanting government services. According to politifact "Among the top 100 donors in the Open Secrets list, 33 were billionaires, and of those, 14 gave primarily to liberal groups while 19 gave to conservative groups." That isn't a clear split one way or the other.

    There are plenty of regulations that Dems put in place that only large companies can afford, so Democrats eliminate the small competition. The lockdowns, with Democrats being the harshest, have seen thousands of small businesses closing permanently, while Amazon, Google, and Facebook are reaching their all-time highs on the stock market.

    And I don't think you would argue only the Republicans would bail these companies out. Obama had his own stimulus package. 

    The republican party have used "conservatives" for a long time. They might agree with them (or might not), but they don't actually fight for them. They will put up a token fight to fire up their base, but then they go back to what they actually care about. Making the rich richer. 

    Yeah, the GOP is corrupt as f*ck (has been for decades), and I have no idea why GOP voters don't do anything about it. They care. Both parties are corrupt, though. That is why Bernie was popular among Dems. That is why an outsider, Trump, was popular among Republicans. They offered what people perceived as an escape from the "establishment".
  • n8nrgmi
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    it's stupid to push for lower taxes unless there's first lower spending. it just adds to the debt. i saw  poll that economists are unanimous that overall government revenue goes down if there's tax cuts in this environment. there's not some magic voodoo that will pay for the tax cuts. 
  • n8nrgmi
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    we pay less in taxes than most other countries anyway. i dont think it's too much to expect a tax system that is similar to the rest of the developed world. if you notice other countries are not overburdened by our debt load like we are. so of course not only should taxes not go down, they should go up. there's room for spending cuts, but our welfare system is far from run amok. it's mostly bare bones aid. 
  • HistoryBuff
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    I'm not sure one party is much better than the other. They just have different masters. While Republicans have low taxes, for instance, Democrats get lobbied to give valuable deductions and credits.
    agreed, the people running both parties are essentially just slightly different flavors of the same corruption. They both pander to the rich and powerful and don't give a shit about anyone else. 

    and this isn't about billionaires not wanting government services. According to politifact "Among the top 100 donors in the Open Secrets list, 33 were billionaires, and of those, 14 gave primarily to liberal groups while 19 gave to conservative groups." That isn't a clear split one way or the other.
    my argument was not that all rich people support the republicans, it is that the republicans only care about rich people. 

    And I don't think you would argue only the Republicans would bail these companies out. Obama had his own stimulus package. 
    nope. Obama was right wing on alot of issues, like alot of the establishment Dems. 

    Yeah, the GOP is corrupt as f*ck (has been for decades), and I have no idea why GOP voters don't do anything about it. They care. Both parties are corrupt, though. That is why Bernie was popular among Dems. That is why an outsider, Trump, was popular among Republicans. They offered what people perceived as an escape from the "establishment".
    agreed. And the establishment of both parties will do anything in their power to keep that from happening. They would much rather lose to the other party, than lose ground to anti-establishment people in their own party. for example, the dems have made huge sums of money telling every donor that trump is a fundamental threat to america. The republicans did the same thing by telling everyone Obama wanted "death panels" or Benghazi, or whatever stupid outrages they came up with. 

    They have designed the political system to recycle the same people into power over and over and over. This ensures that no one who isn't bought and paid for gains any real power. 
  • Greyparrot
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    Most leftists believe the "cure" for capitalism is taxation. Most people on the Right are capitalists. Most on the left are Marxist socialists.
  • Greyparrot
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    --> @n8nrgmi
    It's true, our poor pay far lower taxes than any developed nation in the world. We have one of the most progressive tiered tax systems of any country. In fact, over 1/3 of the people pay no Federal taxes, which is unfathomable to many western nations that have the poor willingly pay national taxes for national programs.
  • Dr.Franklin
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    interesting post
  • bmdrocks21
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    From me, bro?
  • Dr.Franklin
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    yuh.
  • bmdrocks21
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    --> @Dr.Franklin
    Interesting in a good or bad way?

    What was interesting about it? :P
  • bmdrocks21
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    --> @HistoryBuff
    my argument was not that all rich people support the republicans, it is that the republicans only care about rich people. 

    I know your point wasn't that rich people only support Republicans. I was showing that, since a decent amount of rich people support Democrats, obviously the Democrats have something to offer them as well.

    The Republicans since Reagan have, in terms of economics, shafted a lot of their supporters. And this thread is mainly how they are also failing on the cultural front. They lure them in with the patriotism, yet conserve nothing and don't really help them get out of poverty.

    I'm happy about the party becoming more nationalistic in trade policy and labor economics, but they have a long way to go. Hopefully Tucker Carlson 2024 :P

    nope. Obama was right wing on alot of issues, like alot of the establishment Dems. 
    Righties hate him, so I would find that surprising. Especially since the moderate Democrat voters treat him like a god.

    agreed. And the establishment of both parties will do anything in their power to keep that from happening. They would much rather lose to the other party, than lose ground to anti-establishment people in their own party. for example, the dems have made huge sums of money telling every donor that trump is a fundamental threat to america. The republicans did the same thing by telling everyone Obama wanted "death panels" or Benghazi, or whatever stupid outrages they came up with. 

    They have designed the political system to recycle the same people into power over and over and over. This ensures that no one who isn't bought and paid for gains any real power. 
    Exactly. Mitch McConnell is sending millions of dollars to smear Chris Kobach in Kansas in favor of an establishment type. From what I understand, the Democrats do that too against Left-wing candidates. Very frustrating. Although I would probably disagree more with those types of candidates on economic policy, it is refreshing to see people who aren't paid off getting power. 
  • HistoryBuff
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    I know your point wasn't that rich people only support Republicans. I was showing that, since a decent amount of rich people support Democrats, obviously the Democrats have something to offer them as well.
    yeah, the democrats are also corporatist and right wing economically. The only real difference between the 2 parties are culture war nonsense. 

    I'm happy about the party becoming more nationalistic in trade policy and labor economics, but they have a long way to go. Hopefully Tucker Carlson 2024 :P
    oh yeah that would go well. Trump is looking at a historic defeat because he is an idiotic, loudmouth, racist, reality tv show personality. So we should replace him with an idiotic, loudmouth, racist, entertainment tv show personality. That is definitely what america wants....

    Righties hate him, so I would find that surprising. Especially since the moderate Democrat voters treat him like a god.
    righties hated him before he was even elected. Fox news treated him as the anti-christ for proposing what was essentially a republican healthcare plan. It didn't matter what he said or did, the right was going to vilify him. As for democrats, they liked him because he talked a good game. He was eloquent. He made people feel like things would get better. But he fundamentally failed to actually fix those things. 

    Exactly. Mitch McConnell is sending millions of dollars to smear Chris Kobach in Kansas in favor of an establishment type. From what I understand, the Democrats do that too against Left-wing candidates. Very frustrating. Although I would probably disagree more with those types of candidates on economic policy, it is refreshing to see people who aren't paid off getting power. 
    agreed. But until we get money out of politics it is extremely difficult to do that. As long as billionaires can funnel huge amounts of money into super pacs to fund campaigns for their lackeys, it is extremely hard for people to get elected who aren't bought and paid for. 
  • bmdrocks21
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    --> @HistoryBuff
    oh yeah that would go well. Trump is looking at a historic defeat because he is an idiotic, loudmouth, racist, reality tv show personality. So we should replace him with an idiotic, loudmouth, racist, entertainment tv show personality. That is definitely what america wants....

    Trump will probably lose because he sh*t the bed and tried to appeal to conservative Democrats and black voters instead of his actual base. We want reduced immigration, an end to tech censorship, fixing the opioid crisis, a wall, but he gave us criminal justice reform and more funding to "historically black colleges".

    And Tucker is the highest rated cable news program out there, so obviously his ideas are popular. I'm sure you'd agree with at least a quarter of what he says. He has mass populist appeal.

    righties hated him before he was even elected. Fox news treated him as the anti-christ for proposing what was essentially a republican healthcare plan. It didn't matter what he said or did, the right was going to vilify him. As for democrats, they liked him because he talked a good game. He was eloquent. He made people feel like things would get better. But he fundamentally failed to actually fix those things. 

    And lefties decided to hate Trump even before he was elected. You see a pattern? The country is so divided, they only care if there is an R or a D next to their name.

    agreed. But until we get money out of politics it is extremely difficult to do that. As long as billionaires can funnel huge amounts of money into super pacs to fund campaigns for their lackeys, it is extremely hard for people to get elected who aren't bought and paid for. 

    Yeah, and the very people with the power to get money out of politics are the ones with everything to lose from doing so. Interesting how that works.....
  • HistoryBuff
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    Trump will probably lose because he sh*t the bed and tried to appeal to conservative Democrats and black voters instead of his actual base. We want reduced immigration, an end to tech censorship, fixing the opioid crisis, a wall, but he gave us criminal justice reform and more funding to "historically black colleges".
    The problem is that his base is not big enough to win with. He won in 2016 because alot of the democratic base didn't turn up and he convinced some independents that "an outsider" was better than clinton. But now they have seen 4 years of what that looks like and it isn't good. He needs to try to bring in new people, but he is totally screwed. 

    And Tucker is the highest rated cable news program out there, so obviously his ideas are popular. I'm sure you'd agree with at least a quarter of what he says. He has mass populist appeal.
    he occasionally says things that aren't terrible. That doesn't mean he should be president. And being a high rated TV personality doesn't usually mean you can become president. And after the crashing and burning trump is about to do, it isn't likely to be in the near future either. 

    And lefties decided to hate Trump even before he was elected. You see a pattern? The country is so divided, they only care if there is an R or a D next to their name.
    fair point. But trump was well known to be crooked and racist before he decided to run. So people had a very good reason to dislike him before he ran. Most people had no idea who obama was before his run for the presidency. 

    Yeah, and the very people with the power to get money out of politics are the ones with everything to lose from doing so. Interesting how that works.....
    I didn't say it would be an easy fight. It will be brutally difficult. The only way to get it though is by forcing it on them. I'd say the biggest threat is primary challenges. we need to make it clear we want money out of politics, and if they won't do that, primary them and beat them with it during the campaign. 
  • bmdrocks21
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    --> @n8nrgmi
    it's stupid to push for lower taxes unless there's first lower spending. it just adds to the debt. i saw  poll that economists are unanimous that overall government revenue goes down if there's tax cuts in this environment. there's not some magic voodoo that will pay for the tax cuts. 

    In most cases, raising taxes will raise tax revenue. The only time it doesn't is when people become discouraged to work and take more based on how much more they will earn. The laffer curve explains this, it is just likely further along the line than they are saying.

    we pay less in taxes than most other countries anyway. i dont think it's too much to expect a tax system that is similar to the rest of the developed world. if you notice other countries are not overburdened by our debt load like we are. so of course not only should taxes not go down, they should go up. there's room for spending cuts, but our welfare system is far from run amok. it's mostly bare bones aid. 

    In most countries, the poor actually pay taxes. The middle class and rich are taking on the whole burden.
  • bmdrocks21
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    --> @Greyparrot
    Most leftists believe the "cure" for capitalism is taxation. Most people on the Right are capitalists. Most on the left are Marxist socialists.

    The issue is that welfare programs aren't actually designed to lift people from poverty. They just string them along to their next check. Decent scam going on.
  • Greyparrot
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    Learned helplessness eliminates the competition for the rich elites.
  • Dr.Franklin
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    --> @bmdrocks21
    good way