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@secularmerlin
Heart attacks and being shot are both objectively harmful.
How do you prove that objective harm?
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@Tarik
How do you prove that objective harm?
Is there some disagreement that they are objectively bad for ones health?
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@secularmerlin
No, so what do you mean by this
Until we agree that we are using these events as a measure of human behavior they are equal.
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@Tarik
I mean that if you are killed by a heart attack you are just as dead and stay that way just as if you are killed by a gunshot wound. Until we use them as a measure of whether some human actions are "right or wrong" they are equal. Our evaluation changes again subjectively if we use human welfare and prevention of harm to measure who would be given priority for treatment in an emergency room at a hospital.
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@secularmerlin
Until we use them as a measure of whether some human actions are "right or wrong" they are equal.
So why do you use them as a measure?
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@Tarik
Now it is important to know what you are asking whith that "why" before I answer. Are you asking me what mechanisms govern human attitudes? Because I'm not sure I understand it entirely but I feel like I have a better grip on the possible mechanisms than your other possible meaning. If you mean why are there thinky thoughts in my brainy noodle about morality and stuff at all instead of just blowing around like tumbleweeds I can't really answer that question. I can address how to a limited degree I am not prepared to address why with the information available to me.
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@secularmerlin
If you mean why are there thinky thoughts in my brainy noodle about morality and stuff at all instead of just blowing around like tumbleweeds I can't really answer that question.
Your inability to answer that question is exactly why I can’t get on board with whatever your ideology is.
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@Tarik
Your inability to answer that question is exactly why I can’t get on board with whatever your ideology is.
Well in as much as you are not arguing for any alternative you have not given me any alternative.
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@secularmerlin
I don’t have to you said it yourself, you can blow around like a tumbleweed.
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@Tarik
I suppose we both could.
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@secularmerlin
Yeah but what’s your point?
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@Tarik
I don't know what is your point? You are the one who thinks everyone has to justify the existence of their own mind. I mean you haven't explained to me why you have thinky thoughts in your brainy noodle.
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@secularmerlin
Because I believe in life after death.
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@Tarik
Because I believe in life after death.
That neither demonstrates that there is any afterlife nor explains why you have thinky thoughts in your brainy noodle.
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@secularmerlin
If you believe you’ll get rewarded or punished for certain thoughts than it makes perfect sense to have or not have certain thoughts.
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@Tarik
If you believe you’ll get rewarded or punished for certain thoughts than it makes perfect sense to have or not have certain thoughts.
That doesn't answer why you have thinky thoughts at all instead of just blowing around like a tumbleweed. Especially since you believing something does not have any effect on whether you are correct.
How do you justify having thinky thoughts in your brainy noodle if your beliefs are not justified by rigorous application of the scientific method? Hell how do you know you aren't a brain in a jar? Not believe but know. Please recognize the difference.
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@secularmerlin
Especially since you believing something does not have any effect on whether you are correct.
You don’t have to be, as long you believe you are then anything you do under that belief (true or false) makes sense.
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@Tarik
You don’t have to be, as long you believe you are then anything you do under that belief (true or false) makes sense.
You mean subjectively?
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@secularmerlin
No I don’t.
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@Tarik
as long you believe
Please explain how being dependent upon your personal beliefs isnot subjective.
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@secularmerlin
I’m talking about from the outside looking in (objective), whether or not I agree with someone’s ideology if I see that their actions are consistent under their belief (or lack thereof) then that makes sense because it’s consistent.
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@Tarik
I’m talking about from the outside looking in, whether or not I agree with someone’s ideology if I see that their actions are consistent under their belief (flawed or not) then that makes sense because it’s consistent.
Please explain the inconsistency and how your subjective belief in a thing you subjectively believe to be objective resolves the inconsistency.
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@secularmerlin
I disagree with the framing of that question.
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@Tarik
I disagree with the framing of that question.
I'm sorry to hear that. Can you answer it or not?
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@secularmerlin
Only if you change the framing.
On a side note when I mentioned consistency it was UNDER a belief, your question is in regards OVER the belief.
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@Tarik
I'm not sure what your objection is please be specific.
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@secularmerlin
Did you read my side note in my previous post?
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@Tarik
On a side note when I mentioned consistency it was UNDER a belief, your question is in regards OVER the belief.
I'm not sure what this means. What does over a belief mean?
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@secularmerlin
Think along the lines of your chess example.
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@Tarik
The rules of chess were decided upon subjectively and arbitrarily by its creator so I'm not sure what your point is.