More Gospel Un -truths from Jesus Himself.

Author: Stephen

Posts

Total: 43
#31
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Stephen
they closed the thread yesterday. But my research has indicated that blameless and sinless are two different things. Blameless means walking in faith. It's not about obeying God's laws. You are called blameless because your sins have been cleansed through the blood of christ.

When I said none are sinless other than christ. The Bible does not contradict this when it calls Enoch blameless. Enoch is blameless because he walked in faith with the lord. The Bible mentions Enoch walking in faith.  He is blameless because his sins are forgiven. 

The Bible also calls Moses blameless. But in the same story, and by the same writer it shows that Moses did kill a man when he was younger and was never punished for it, so we know blameless does not mean sinless. 
Topic's author
#32
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,321
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@Wylted
I just sent you a message responding to some of your comments because the thread was locked. Would you like me to repost them here?
Topic's author
#33
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,321
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@Wylted
(A) they closed the thread yesterday. But my research has indicated that blameless and sinless are two different things. Blameless means walking in faith. It's not about obeying God's laws.


Then what is it about. 


(B) When I said none are sinless other than christ. The Bible does not contradict this when it calls Enoch blameless. Enoch is blameless because he walked in faith with the lord. The Bible mentions Enoch walking in faith.  He is blameless because his sins are forgiven. 

You need to read closely as to what you have written there^^^^^^^^ You may want to change it?


You are called blameless because your sins have been cleansed through the blood of christ

 Cleansed of what?

#34
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Stephen
cleansed meaning that his punishment was taken. Forgiven is just short hand for saying that Jesus decided to take his punishment and act as a sacrificial lamb. 

Then what is it about. 

That's literally already explained in the preceeding sentence to the one you highlighted. 

You know the difference between 

Salvation through works

And

Salvation through faith

It's probably the most popular debate between theists with each other and you have spent enough time on this forum seeing the arguments between theists on those points. 
#35
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Stephen
You need to read closely as to what you have written there^^^^^^^^ You may want to change it?

I think I get your objection now. It confused me at first.

In the Bible it explains that Jesus is God or at the least with God since the beginning of time.

In the beginning was the word. Jesus is being referred to as the word. I think it is in the book of John chapter 1. 

Faith in God is faith in Jesus and visa versa. 
Topic's author
#36
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,321
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@Wylted
(A) they closed the thread yesterday. But my research has indicated that blameless and sinless are two different things. Blameless means walking in faith. It's not about obeying God's laws.
Then what is it about. 


You are called blameless because your sins have been cleansed through the blood of christ

 Cleansed of what?

Could you first please answer those questions if you can.




#37
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Stephen
Then what is it about
The preceding sentence to the one highlighted says walking in faith. Preceding means "the one before"

So being blameless means walking in faith. 

Cleansed of what?
Are you literally thinking cleansed means like washed with soap?

In this context it merely means Jesus took the punishment of mankind's sins. He is the sacrificial lamb. 

God commands sacrifices for sins in the old testament as a punishment for sins. Jesus became the sacrifice for all sins and the greatest sacrifice. 

Being cleansed is just flowery language here, that really means that our sins are already paid for. 

As much as you debate. Christians on here, is this legitimately the first time you have heard of this concept?

Topic's author
#38
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,321
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@Wylted
Cleansed of what?
Are you literally thinking cleansed means like washed with soap?

 Nope. I am thinking that you are going to say cleansed of our sins.

And sweet as a nut you say just that below.

Jesus became the sacrifice for all sins and the greatest sacrifice. 
Nice. I am glad you said that , and I will explain why later , if you are still about.


As much as you debate. Christians on here, is this legitimately the first time you have heard of this concept?


 Nope!  But you are coming across as if it your first time debating this or any biblical  "concept"..

 Ok we can back up a little now, given that you believe you have it all correct- in your mind at least.


Blameless means walking in faith. It's not about obeying God's laws. You are called blameless because your sins have been cleansed through the blood of Christ.


Then the question here is why, for instance, were not Job, Noah, Zecharia and Elizabeth simply said to be sinless instead of ` only ` blameless. If, as you say, there is a difference?

You have also said that;


“Enoch is blameless because he walked in faith with the lord. The Bible mentions Enoch walking in faith.  He is blameless because his sins are forgiven.”



Yes Enoch, probably the most enigmatic and interesting character in the bible although, he is only mentioned in the Old Testament twice, I believe.

Genesis 5:18-24. 1 Chronicles 1:3

And the only piece of anything of substance we get about Enoch the person is this> “Enoch had lived 65 years, he became the father of Methuselah. After he became the father of Methuselah, Enoch walked faithfully with God 300 years and had other sons and daughters”.

Strange then that although Enoch didn’t die and it was said that he was “taken directly to heaven” there is no mention of him being “blameless”  OR sinless while he was here on earth. And further, although Enoch’s book is mentioned in the bible, his book wasn’t included at all?

How do you know that Enoch's sins have been forgiven/ or cleansed by god? Does the scripture say as such?



You have said that;


The Bible also calls Moses blameless. But in the same story, and by the same writer it shows that Moses did kill a man when he was younger and was never punished for it, so we know blameless does not mean sinless.
Was he?  Do you have the bible verse to support this.   Here are the first five books of the bible.Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy, now  show me.

But my research has indicated that blameless and sinless are two different things.Blameless means walking in faith. It's not about obeying God's laws. You are called blameless because your sins have been cleansed through the blood of christ.

I see, so John is wrong then?

1 John 3.4 (KJV)   for sin is the transgression of the law.

Now the last time I looked , "the law" was handed down by god, they are gods laws, if we are to believe the bible?


#39
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Stephen
Then the question here is why, for instance, were not Job, Noah, Zecharia and Elizabeth simply said to be sinless instead of ` only ` blameless. If, as you say, there is a difference?
This sounds like gobbledygook.  Like everything you wrote. They were said to be blameless and not sinless because they sinned. 
#40
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Stephen
I see, so John is wrong then?

1 John 3.4 (KJV)   for sin is the transgression of the law.

Now the last time I looked , "the law" was handed down by god, they are gods laws, if we are to believe the bible?


Are you seriously mentally disabled? Being blameless is not about being sinless.

That isn't a statement condoning sin. It is merely a statement saying blameless refers to a different concept than sinless. 

How do you know that Enoch's sins have been forgiven/ or cleansed by god? Does the scripture say as such?

The Bible doesn't say that Jesus took a shit, but we all know he did. Please be less stupid. 
Topic's author
#41
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,321
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@Wylted



Wylted wrote: “Enoch is blameless because he walked in faith with the lord. The Bible mentions Enoch walking in faith.  He is blameless because his sins are forgiven.”
Stephen wrote: How do you know that Enoch's sins have been forgiven/ or cleansed by god? Does the scripture say as such?

The Bible doesn't say that Jesus took a shit, but we all know he did. Please be less stupid. 

So you don't know and  you don't have any evidence - not even biblical evidence for this then, again. But are simply surmising and guessing what may or may not of happened. You see Wylted, you are confusing yourself with what Jesus and the bible actually says, with that which you want it to say , when it fkn doesn't!

And you have missed this too>>



The Bible also calls Moses blameless. But in the same story, and by the same writer it shows that Moses did kill a man when he was younger and was never punished for it, so we know blameless does not mean sinless.
Was he?  Do you have the bible verse to support this.   Here are the first five books of the bible.Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy, now  show me? 
 Or are you just guessing again?


Being blameless is not about being sinless.

Breaking the law of god is a sin according to the BIBLE.  To not ever have broken the law of god means that your are sinless/blameless because one has walked
IN ALL the ways of god.
. As John says here>>

1 John 3.4 (KJV)   for sin is the transgression of the law.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<which fkn law do you think this refers to?


Are you seriously mentally disabled?

 NOPE!
 Now to those two questions above.

and a question from me to you on this thread here>>https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/6433-response-on-apostasy-and-stoning  at post #6 . When you have the time.
#42
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Stephen
how are you still conflating sinless with blameless?
Topic's author
#43
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,321
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@Wylted
how are you still conflating sinless with blameless?

How are you still not understand the sinless means blameless?

1 John 3.4 (KJV)   for sin is the transgression of the law.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<which fkn law do you think this refers to?