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@Lunatic
After already being accused of bussing supa that’s actually pretty funny. Maybe I’m just scum and bussing everyone on of my team mates for the glory factor eh?
V/V? Villager/Villager?
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Casey is the slot I keep going back and forth on. There was the defense on Vader, but there's also the seemingly decent and backed up role claim. The reasoning on Banana being Town-ish was a good call-out, as far as I'm aware, but they keep taking potshots at me. Conflicting... I'm not really a fan of the way most of thread seemed to coalesce around "Yes this is basically confirmed" when that isn't really true.
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I have Pie as mostly Town for his behavior, but I think there is an asterisk with Casey and the two of them possibly collaborating.
To elaborate on this: It could be possible that both are scum and Pie had a asectic/commute ability last Night, explaining Mikal's ability fail and allowing Casey to make the claim. So I don't think it's actually confirming. And even if it was, it would only be role confirming, not alignment confirming.
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Unordered because I'm lazy and a bit tired, to be frank.
What worries me is the possibility of a Luantic/REF v/v world.
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@Castin
Guess you blindly target someone during NP to heal and hope they happened to be poisoned? Shot in the dark.
Day ability.
I have Mikal/Castin as Town via angleshoot and because I'm starting to think his case on me is being co-opted by scum, though I don't have much solid evidence for that.
I have Lunatic as Town for hard pushing Vader and I believe his reasoning for the claim swap.
I have Savant/Disc as Town because I believe the way he counter-claimed Vader was town, and I find it difficult to believe that Vulture was something fake that the scum team would come up with for Vanilla, especially when one team member was already claiming Vanilla. I also believe the replacement's entrance was pure. Although I have been wrong on purity reads before.
I have Pie as mostly Town for his behavior, but I think there is an asterisk with Casey and the two of them possibly collaborating.
I think WyIted's behavior and role are Town, primarily because I'm struggling to think of a Scum character that would have that.
Banana's claim looked like a genuine blunder of saying too much, and I do believe the suggestion that was made that she's typically "lazier" as Town than Scum. Though this may be something to revisit later if she's leaning on that too much.
I am left with Ultra, Whiteflame, REF, Casey, Joebob as my rough POE.
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I think whoever is developing the new forums should include an ISO feature specifically for Mafia games.
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UNVOTE
I'm done playing defense for today. I'm going to properly backread before I put my vote back on REF.
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@Mikal
@JoeBob
More than that a campfire isn’t primarily used for poison.
And a pressure plate isn't primarily used for detecting wires, but Iron was a partial Cop. I'm not sure if you're trying to be obtuse here.
Based off what I learned from Google about your role, the campfire doesn’t nullify the poison effect, like the healer does to the poison in mafia.
The point is that it can reduce the effect significantly enough that the timer runs out and you survive. A Campfire can save your life from the Poisoned status effect.
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@ILikePie5
"offset damage over time" is the exact phrasing in my justification.
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I'll be back. Don't turbo hammer me before this evening or I will drop a gravestone and haunt all of you. (Metaphorically, of course.)
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It's an opportunistic claim that could have employed the flip for pseudo-confirmation.
Of course, yes, an opportunistic claim when I was barely under any pressure. An opportunistic claim when there are no poisons, so nobody has a solid reason to believe me. An opportunistic claim about something with nuance that would initially draw raised eyebrows because Campfires -> Curing Poison is a confusing connection to anyone who hasn't played the game. An opportunistic claim that has clearly and obviously made my thread position significantly worse. That kind of opportunistic claim, yes.
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@Mikal
I also just checked in depth and a campfire does not heal a poison effect in the game. It gives health regent. It doesn’t remove it. Which makes me waymore sus now having read through it mechanically.
I can't be properly online for a little bit, but I also can't let this particular misinformation go unchecked. This is the mistake I made internally on Day 1 when I said that my justification was bad- I didn't understand how health regeneration mechanics worked.
Ladies, gentlemen, creatures of other persuasions, open your Terraria Wikis to the Health regeneration page.
It's complicated, and I won't go through all the details, but the gist is this: There is a value called the Regeneration Rate. When you have Poison, it brings that value to -4, meaning you're losing health per second. However, a Campfire adds 1 to that value, changing it to -3.
So, in other words, the presence of the Campfire mitigates the effects of the Poison, which is exactly what I already said about my justification.
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@Castin
I'm going to head out for now, because Lord knows I've spammed this thread enough for the evening, but I do want to hear more about what Castin thinks of the game circumstances so far. I want to come back tomorrow and hear from the other head of that hydra.
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@Casey_Risk
if there is a scum Poisoner, I doubt they'll use it tonight,
Good. That means as long as I'm alive, I'm denying scum KP. That's what my role is meant to do, even if this is a roundabout way of going about it.
Either they kill me, a borderline-POE slot and let more confirmed people like Lunatic or Pie live, or they let me live and are effectively locked out of using Poisons.
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If it weren't for the angleshoot on Mikal, I think I would have him in POE, to be quite frank. Pushing for the WF vote late Day 1 and now wanting what I suspect to be a 0/2 immediate POE (me/WF) here is not a good look. Probably just wrong Town.
I do concede that WF can be scum, I think I said this before, but I don't have a behavioral reason to really townread him. (I seriously struggle to read WF in general, usually need a few flips.) But being the sort-of CFD to a scum wagon strikes me as being a strong point in his favor, and the claim is bad in a way that I think he could have come up with something better as Mafia.
In any case, I don't think he should be anywhere near POE for today when Joebob, Ultra, and REF exist.
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@JoeBob
You don't need to reread everything multiple times. That's something I've never found productive, personally, although I know it works for some people. At some point, things can just start to run together.
What are your thoughts right now? If you were keeping up at the start, you must have some perspective, even if it's muddled now. Where are you at?
You, Banana, and Ultra, are going to be very difficult to read because of the lack of activity, so I want you to try to actually put the cards in your brain on the table and be as transparent as possible when you are here. Otherwise, you're just going to be a forever-POE slot that Mafia drags to LYLO.
...Assuming you're not Mafia, of course...
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To avoid skipping steps, I'll say that I have noticed that Casey's claimed ability would not have stopped a Poison. So JOAT seems more likely to me. It's also possible, if we have a 3rd Party, that there might be Poison Immunity or other passive that would prevent a Poison in play.
Holstering it for the sake of holstering doesn't make sense, because as someone said earlier, there was no way for them to know that a Poison Healer was in play. So, clearly, there was a reason we're not seeing it.
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If Vader wasn't Black Slime, I would suggest Brain of Cthulhu as a scum role because in Expert mode it deals several different status effects, including poison, which would explain my existence.
But Confusion is also a status effect, and I think that if Mharman wanted a randomizer ability on the scum team, he would have given that to Brain (instead of Black Slime), if it existed. So I'm moreso suspecting that the scum team is just three slimes and that's the theme split.
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@Casey_Risk
I don't like how he never responded to my own post calling out his inconsistent behavior.
In 42?
It's not really inconsistent. The first was me being snarky, the second was me pushing on calling the existing claims scummy because I don't really scumread Savant, Lunatic, or WyIted.
My ability can't be used on a non-poisoned person, so no dice there. I'm back to Square 1 about figuring out why there wasn't one. Possibly a JOAT ability that wasn't used in lieu of something else?
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@ResurgetExFavilla
@Mikal
Ceru, can you use your role on someone that isn't poisoned? Could that result in any sort of mod confirmation of your role?
I doubt it, but I'll check.
Ceru just feels wrong. That claim+ Supas on point reason for why a short sword would be vanilla.By assumption is they got short sword as a character claim but not a role and ceru worked in why. The verbiage supa gave almost matches exactly to why ceru said it made sense.
I'll accept that my role is hard to believe when there are no poisons. And I'll accept that my lukewarmness on the Vader chop puts me in POE (which is part of why I claimed in the first place).
However.
I'm not going to accept as valid reasoning that something which is explicitly described in the wiki and would be known by anyone who has ever played the game is something that incriminates me specifically.
- The uselessness of the Copper Shortsword, even at the beginning of the game which it is supposedly suited for, has earned it "memetic" status within the Terraria community. For instance, on videos of people completing challenges in Terraria such as unusual boss fights or speedruns, comments saying "Now do it with a copper shortsword!" are not a rare sight, to make the seemingly impossible challenge even more ridiculous, although completely possible in some cases. (Here)
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VTL REF
Is "tiered NPC" a correct representation of the softs REF made? I'm not sure exactly what that would entail.
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There is also the possibility of a Poisoner 3P. Although, I can't think of a good flavor for it when Spiked Jungle Slime or Hornet fit more with Black Slime.
But I'm willing to treat Pie as soft cleared for now, that helps me clean upper POE a bit.
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@ILikePie5
Justification?
Campfire increases health regeneration, so it mitigates the effect of Poison.
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@Casey_Risk
I asked explicitly. Poisons work like MU: They are announced at Day start and take effect at Day end of not cured.
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I was actually wrong about my justification being bad. Health regeneration mechanics in Terraria work differently than I thought.
(I can elaborate on the cause of that particular misunderstanding if necessary.)
I know that multiple people sussed me in the Vader!scum world, so my initial intention was to claim at Day start so we could discuss the poison heal. The fact that there wasn't one threw me off.
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I was planning to come into today hard claiming this anyway, so I don't mind doing it now.
I am Campfire, Poison Healer. I don't believe my role only exists to counter Iron, so scum must have a Poisoner.
The fact that nobody is poisoned suggests to me that the person who tried to do it was blocked or otherwise unsuccessful.
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Wf can still be scum
I was thinking about this because I had a game recently where we cleared someone for being a scum counter wagon and they endgamed.
Still, I think there are probably better vote options than WF. I can't point to a behavioral reason to vote him as opposed to Banana or REF.
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Also, I have a reason to believe that an evil player was roleblocked last Night. If someone wants to claim that, they're free to do so and I can elaborate. Not 100% necessary, we're not in a bad position right now, but I just want to put that on the table.
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@ResurgetExFavilla
We already have several scummy claims out there. Have we lynched anyone based on that?
Who? Which remaining claim exactly are you calling scummy?
Vader was lynched because his was the worst.
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Huh? Take Vader off L-1. We have hours and wagons are still swinging. At least let him give a final legacy.
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@ILikePie5
Do you believe Shortsword is a Vanilla?
I believe it. The Copper Shortsword that was mentioned is a meme because of how it's nearly useless- you almost always replace it in the first two minutes of the game and never use it again. In general, Shortswords don't get much use because there are far better weapons in the game at every stage of progression.
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Probably not rampage attacks, I hardly ever see those in forum games and I think this game has enough KP already.
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@JoeBob
They must target and visit a player each Night. I take it to mean that we have at least one or two roles in play that interact heavily with visits. Watchman, Stalker, Rampage attacks, etc.
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@ILikePie5
I really appreciate the fact that we've already outed several useless roles that will now proceed to never get nightkilled. Truly stellar gameplay we have going on here.
JoeBob reeks town
Elaborate, I've seen almost zero original thought.
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I can only remember seeing a double voter once, on MU, and they were Town.
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Double voter as scum seems like a weird balance decision, since it essentially gives Town one less mislynch by its mere presence.
WyIted moves up a tier, in my opinion.
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I would be a bit surprised if the vote modification was an active scum ability, it doesn't seem useful to reveal that off the bat like this.
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There's so much going on with Vader that I think I'm going to have to read it several times before I actually come to a conclusion. Later.
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I'm roughly caught up now.
I have:
Savant Mikal as Town strongly
Lunatic WyIted as Town less strongly
Vader Joebob Banana (REF (maybe)) as my rough POE
Everyone else occupies a nebulous "Unsure" category in my brain right now because I either have things about them I'm hesitant on (WF, Casey) or just have not seen/do not remember enough (Ultra, Iron, Pie)
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@Mikal
Nobody has claimed a monster yet, as far as I recall Personally, I thought the theme split was going to be that monsters are scum roles- so I think it's risky for Savant to drop a character like that into an already volatile situation.
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I'm townlocking Savant for today minimum unless someone can provide me an example of him running a risky claim like that as scum.
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Because that feels like it mod confirms supa and he is trying to cover up for the fact he gave supa wrong info (437)
I think this feels like maybe we should stop angleshooting about mod comms, hm?
VTL Joebob (for unrelated reasons)
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The main susses up to Page 14 were Lunatic and Vader and they're still the top wagons now? Might be dead Air, dead Villager. Not sure how warm I am on Vader, will probably have to go back and triple check what happened there.
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This is hard to read.
Is there a way to see who's liked a post? I've seen a couple I'd like to know, although I'm not sure how relevant it would be.
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Up to post 308, I can't remember ever seeing Lunatic this gloomy. And he's been in worse positions before, maybe this is because it's Day 1?
I'm willing to accept the Loom claim because despite what Mikal said about being mostly for vanity, it can be used to make useful items, like this: https://terraria.wiki.gg/wiki/Amber_Robe
So far, what actually has me hung up on Lunatic's alignment is 306, because it reads like an assumption Joebob is Town.
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Actually, I want my stale pre-actual-thinking vote to go here instead.
VTL Casey
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The quieter he becomes the more suspicious I become
I'd be surprised if nobody else was saying this, considering my most recent two scum games I coasted and let my teammate do most of the heavy lifting.
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To clarify: My character does have variants, but the differences between them are almost entirely cosmetic, so it wouldn't be accurate to call them "tiers."
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