Instigator / Pro
billbatard's avatar
4
billbatard
1294
rating
75
debates
18.0%
won
Topic
#1384

Freedom

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
0
3
Better sources
2
2
Better legibility
1
1
Better conduct
1
1

After 1 vote and with 3 points ahead, the winner is...

Exile
Tags
Philosophy
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
2
Time for argument
One day
Max argument characters
1,000
Voting period
One week
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
Exile's avatar
7
Exile
1543
rating
8
debates
75.0%
won
Description

By most objective standards the USA is not as free as for example Canada to the North

Round 1
billbatard's avatar
billbatard
Pro
#1
i was looking at the Cato institutes index on freedom  online in it it marks Canada much higher in individual freedom that the  USA and more free in terms of economy https://www.cato.org/human-freedom-index-new  https://www.cato.org/economic-freedom-world  https://www.heritage.org/index/ranking
Exile's avatar
Exile
Con
#2

This all depends on how you define "freedom." If we're purely talking about economics, then countries with the largest and diverse economic systems like Hong Kong and Singapore are going to be more "free" based off of the sources that you cited. Or if you're referring freedom to the presence of social programs with countries like Canada then sure it may seem like those countries are more free than the US. What many people overlook is the amount of taxation is required to maintain social benefits, which is sky high in Canada. 

Freedom has always been defined as the minimal role of government in a person's life. What made the founding fathers so smart about creating the constitution is that they realized that there are certain rights every human being should have. It wasn't until  the 20th century that people began to see the beauty in the constitution, and ended up moving to the US. Our constitution is so effective that it has remained unchanged since then. Not reworked. 

Round 2
billbatard's avatar
billbatard
Pro
#3
No that is NOT the definition of freedom freedom is the options and opportunities all citizens have to live life as they please, and even the cato index of freedom you can google it conceeds that economic freedom is just one sort of freedom and that sometimes a bigger government exists to protect its ctizens from predators a police force protects citizens from crime an army from invaders a fire department from natural disaster and a social safety net to protect the poor and middle class from the abuse by the rich here is my proof https://www.cato.org/human-freedom-index-new  
also the heritage foundation has data showing many big government welfare states in europe are still very competative and business friendly https://www.heritage.org/index/country/denmark
Exile's avatar
Exile
Con
#4
Your definition of freedom is contradictory, because you can't have options and opportunities for all citizens without a strong government presence in an individual's life. In Canada and Scandinavian countries, the plethora of government programs they offer come with MUCH higher taxes. Last I checked, being taxed on programs that don't benefit every one of it's people isn't free. Is it truly "free" to have a 50% income tax to pay for benefits that your government FORCES you to have? [1]

The concept of freedom has always been the minimal impact of government on an individual's life. Otherwise, US Constitution would be obsolete today. People who live in developing countries yearn to come to the US for opportunity; to open a business, get better education, etc. If that weren't the case, then who would immigrate to the US? Cite whoever you want, but you can't deny our foundations as a country.