Instigator / Pro
5
1500
rating
25
debates
42.0%
won
Topic
#3537
The religion of Islam does not oppress women
Status
Finished
The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.
Winner & statistics
After 5 votes and with 5 points ahead, the winner is...
rayhan16
Parameters
- Publication date
- Last updated date
- Type
- Standard
- Number of rounds
- 3
- Time for argument
- Twelve hours
- Max argument characters
- 10,000
- Voting period
- One week
- Point system
- Winner selection
- Voting system
- Open
Contender / Con
0
1483
rating
1
debates
0.0%
won
Description
Islam is a religion of peace, not a religion of oppression. Women are not oppressed.
Round 1
Right, lets get started
Islam does not allow oppression for women and does not implement it into the religion. That is my statement which I want to prove.
Oppression definition
I will use dictionary.com here and this is the 1st definition.
the exercise of authority or power in a burdensome, cruel, or unjust manner.
This is the meaning of oppression, now let me tell you why Islam does not allow it.
Islam is a religion in which both men and women are told to worship the creator Allah and accept that the Prophet Muhammed (PBUH) is the last messenger and servant of Him. It also teaches for both men and women to pray, to give charity, to fast and to go on a pilgrimage to Hajj. These things are universal to both men and women in Islam. Also forbidden things are not allowed too, such as haram foods, alcohol, sex before marriage, adultery, murder, rape etc.
The problem with western people nowadays is how women are treated in Islam. People think they are like slaves to a master (wife to a husband) whereas this is simply untrue. Men are considered to be the providers, the breadwinners. It is up to a husband to protect and serve his wife and his children with food on the table, financial funds to cover the bills, to burden to carry on the religion of Islam to his children and many other acts. So this means the man has responsibilities, it is not as if he does whatever he wants and doesn't pay the price. The price is payed for both genders.
Lets take the role of a wife now. The wife is considered to be the nurturer of children and to watch over the family as well as being there for the husband. The reason why this is not oppression is because both husband and wife have roles that are assigned to them. The wife, biologically, has the capability over the husband to produce babies. Whereas the husband has the capability over the wife to do more heavy duty things as they are naturally stronger. The idea of a family in Islam is to carry on the belief in Islam generations upon generations. A family is more than getting food on the table and working, it has a more spiritual idea as well.
Marriage in Islam is like a contract. Both men and women fulfil their duties and die then get judged based on previous actions in their lifetime.
Rights of Women in Islam
There are many misconceptions over if women have any rights whatsoever in Islam. However they do and I will list them.
-Women can work
-Women can vote
-Women have the right to education
-Women have rights to accept or deny marriage proposals
-Women have the right to freedom of expression
-Women have their share of inheritance- they can spend it all on themselves however the mans shares must be spent on the women in his life and the family
-Women are exempt of all financial liabilities
-A woman has a right to a dowry- She can ask for anything she wants and the husband has to provide it if he can financially cope
-Women have the right to a divorce
Most of the points and rights are via the help of this website
Covering of the face
Women in Islam cover there face. The reason for this is simple, to show modesty. Too many men are out on the streets hunting for prey (women) and trying to ensure their trust. They approach women because of their looks. Not their personality, but their looks. The vast amount of make-up, the way her hair is so elegant and the way her body is shaped. As a male. I am ashamed that these things happen and the good thing is in Islam we believe that prevention is better than a cure. Which is why a Muslim women would wear a covering to cover herself from men that are hungry their prey. The covering ensures that men do not even approach them as the beauty cannot be seen. This is the main reason why women wear a hijab. Also, this wearing of a hijab or niqab is actually the opposite of oppression as women wear these concealments to have a barrier between them and the men on streets. This covering protects them and reduces chances of being raped and even looked at.
Marriage in Islam
How do women get married? Forcefully? Nope. If women are presented with potential husbands, they have the right to decline. Remember, a man and a woman cannot be alone together as this forces intimacy and increases the chances of sex before marriage, a grave sin for both genders. If a man wants to marry a woman, then he must approach her father, as the father will know what his intentions are. Then if the father approves, the woman has the right to ask for a dowry. This could be something like £10,000 worth of gold and a new car. The man has to provide this if he is capable. Then the man also has to do the wedding. It can be paid for by both the man and the woman and then they can get married, sign the contracts and live happily ever after. The married couple can then have sex which leads to children and carry on Islam.
Polygamy
Many will ask, why is a man allowed to marry 4 wives but a woman is only allowed to marry 1 husband. The main reason is because no one will know who the father is. 1400 years ago, when the Quran was revealed, there was no DNA testing. The father is the person who teaches the child about Islam and ultimately is the breadwinner and provider, an extremely important figure in a family. People need to know who the father is, however when a man marries 4 wives, everyone knows who the mother and the father is.
The Quran states this:
'marry other women of your choice—two, three, or four. But if you are afraid you will fail to maintain justice, then ˹content yourselves with˺ one'- 4:3
This means if a man cannot cope and provide for all the women, then only marry one.
'"Do you have a mother?" He said: "Yes." He said: "Then stay with her, for Paradise is beneath her feet."- Sunan an-Nasa'i 3104
This quote from the hadith speaks for itself about mothers.
Chapter 19 of the Quran is all about 1 woman- Maryam- Jesus' mother
4:34-Men are in charge of women1 by [right of] what Allah has given one over the other and what they spend [for maintenance] from their wealth. So righteous women are devoutly obedient, guarding in [the husband's] absence what Allah would have them guard.2 But those [wives] from whom you fear arrogance3 - [first] advise them; [then if they persist], forsake them in bed; and [finally], strike them [lightly].4 But if they obey you [once more], seek no means against them. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted and Grand.
There are many non-Muslims who challenge this quote and make it seem like men are the masters of women and men can hit them etc. However this is not true. Men are not allowed to hit the face, not allowed to cause pain and not allowed to leave a mark, so how on earth are they supposed to strike them heavily as non-Muslims say? It is a myth to think like this. It means tap them, not fully fledge hit them.
2:228 is also a misconception as many think 'men are a degree of women' is some sort of oppression. However it is not, I will explain. Women have rights similar to men but not exact, however men have a degree of responsibility over women such as financially providing etc.
2:282 also states 'Call upon two of your men to witness. If two men cannot be found, then one man and two women of your choice will witness—so if one of the women forgets the other may remind her'. The reason why it cannot be 1 woman is because women are known to be more deceptive than men and have the instinct to get what they want because they are a woman. So they can lie, to get the belongings of the man or a more financial gain. However the man is less likely to do this as it is not in his nature. A woman is more emotional than a man and she can use it in her favour.
Conclusion
I think I have fairly justified (not fully however this is the opening point, introduction if you may) about how women are not oppressed and they have rights. I also have debunked a lot of quotes which people use to their advantage and twist the narratives.
Your move, Con
References
Forfeited
Round 2
As my opponent has forfeited, I have nothing to say. Does look like a full forfeit which is not ideal as I have then wasted my time, but let's see. Maybe con has something to say. I think it's fair to conclude that I have won round 1
Forfeited
Round 3
Yes, it is looking like a full forfeit, very bleak. Oh well, I feel as if I have made some good points.
Please vote me, thanks after this person forfeits again :)
Forfeited
Opponent full forfeited, please vote for pro on this one
Your joking right?
Con clearly won this debate
The main thing to grasp is I am talking about the vast majority. I am saying men who only want to marry for sex, will use and abuse that woman. The woman will have many kids, as men's desires will always get in the way, this is a fact. Men need to control their desires as they are taught in Islam, however the western world has capitalised on them and corrupted their mindset. If everyone works, who is going to look after the children. Plus if the mother has about 8 children, 2 from each father, the kid will have 4 different fathers which makes no sense whatsoever. There are so much reasons to why a woman is not allowed to have 4 husbands. Even though not all women and not all men is a thing, most men and most women is also a thing. It is ok to generalize if we are talking about the vast majority, but I am going to say there are some exceptions, the minority of women so to say.
I think I have given satisfactory answers to your question in my opinion
How do you know? im sure some women could handle it, why is it that the men have to be stay at home fathers? they can work too. I feel like its generally best not to have these massive generalisations about people because of their sex, its very easy to be wrong. Not all women are emotional nor anything exceptionally weak compared to men.
I am not saying women are incapable of working. I am just saying it is too much stress for a woman who is born to be more emotional and less physical to provide for 4 men who all have different wants and needs and her children too. And the firepower of the men must be taken into consideration. Men can be much abusive to women in these sort of scenarios
Women are more emotional on average, sex characteristics exist along a spectrum. Women do just fine in most workplaces, better than men in customer service roles usually. So should big women, lets say women above 5'10 be allowed to work in construction culturally? if not why not if a 5'4 man can? Its essential for women to work in the economy these days, otherwise economic recession is destined to happen. Especially in European nations. Its just not realistic.
It is a woman's free will to work if she wants, yes of course they are happier to be at home and look after the kids. However the thing about the GDP, you said without women the economy would be lower. Of course it would however without men it would be even more lower. Both genders are not equal in the economy by the way, men are more dominant in this saga but women are striving to be a more dominant than she is right now.
You need to understand, it does not matter what time or era it is, women will always be naturally weaker than men. Whether this be emotionally or physically, they are designed to be more emotional and less biologically stronger. Sure a woman can work, Islam gives the right for a woman to do that, but for a woman who is already naturally weaker, to look after and feed and provide the money for and shelter 4 men and her children is too much of a ask. Not all women are the same, some can be stronger yet the vast majority are born with a more emotional side. Plus you have to account the firepower of the men, as they are naturally more stronger, they can be abusive to the 1 female. There are a range of factors.
Also about the safety net and divorce thing, in Islam we have a thing called a dowry. A woman can demand anything, it could be £100,000 or a new car or a new house etc, and if the man is financially capable to give her these things, then she is given a right to keep everything she demands and not pay a single penny of the divorce if she gets it. So she has left the marriage with something.
We can know who the father is, rayhan. I don't see why women should be societally pressured into being reliant on a man their entire lives. We don't live in a time where people can have 1 parent working, we don't live in a time where women can afford to have a man do everything for her, she has no safety net if they get divorced and she has no money or anything now.
I think women should have the opportunity to be career women, even if i think that's the wrong choice for them to make, most women are happier being stay at home mums, but i shouldn't dictate what others do with their free will. I shouldn't dictate if someone is allowed to let themselves experience sad emotions. Women being in the workplace also adds so much to the economy, that without women you will lose massive amounts of a nations GDP making everyone significantly poorer.
Allah commanded him to marry all of his wives except Khadijah because they were all grieving as they lost their husbands. The Prophet (PBUH) provided for every single one of those wives and protected them until his death. It is not ok for a woman to have more than one husband. Not only because we won't know who the father is, but because that 1 woman has to provide for all 4 of her husbands and children. If we look at a woman in society now, we see that yes they think they can cope, but no.1 it is not their role in society to be the breadwinners, they have a right to work but their main aim is to keep stability in a family and look after children and no.2 they are mentally strained. 4 husbands need to be looked after, fed and kept in good condition. same with children. same with anyone else in the 1 woman's life. A man is told if you cannot handle 4 wives then only marry 1. So if he has a mental strain then only marry 1
Why would Allah command him to marry women which wont reproduce? it appears to be a double standard to me. Since he made his followers turn away baron women. Based on your own standards, if women cant have more than one husband due to not knowing who the father is, isn't it now ok for a woman to have more than one husband since we do have DNA testing? since we do have condoms now?
Because Allah commanded him to marry. Plus some of his wives reproduced
Why didnt prophet Muhammad simply donate money too then? why is he the exception to the rule? this same thing happened when he raided caravans, he kept most of the booty.
The Quran doesn't state more than 4. It says marry two, three or four and stops. It implies 4 is the limit, even if they are widows. A man can donate money to the widow if he really wants to be just
why cant any man take extra widows in as long as he's just?
Thanks and men can marry 4 wives if he wishes to but not more than 4. So 4 is the limit. The Prophet Muhammed (PBUH) was an exception because Allah had ordered him to marry 12/13 wives he did as almost all were widows who were suffering
I think you provided a pretty good argument rayhan. Although im confused about the "men can marry 4 wives" quote. Is there a limit to how many women a man is allowed to marry in Islam?
I think you should change the resolution to: The Religion of Islam Does Not Oppress Women, as I think that is what you are trying to convey. Right now, you could argue that women who are Islamic are being oppressed (not necessarily because of their religion), which is a truism.
That is just an opinion. There must be a reason why people may think Islam is sexist (in a bad way) if they are not within the religion. Maybe the scripture or maybe because they don't understand the true value of rights that Islam gives Muslim women
Maybe my wording is still that confusing there. I am trying to say that Islam is not sexist ideally(in Quran), not sexist considered by themselves, but sexist considered by other people outside the culture.
Isn't this double standards? Women are told what to do yes. But Men are told what to do as well. Men are told to 'lower their gaze', men are told to respect parents, men are told to do many things but why are you only referring to women and not men?
Well, maybe such misinterpretation was due to my poor choice of words that I have in writing text. I don't think women have a fixed "place" or don't know how to distinguish ethically, but simply that women in Islam are told that what they are supposed to do and gladly accepts it as they think it is right, well at least a numerous portion of them minus outliers.
Your name has the opposite reflection of you. Women have brains and are smart enough to make their own decisions. Are you saying that women do not have the capability to find a difference between right and wrong because that is certainly what you are implying. According to your logic, women do not have the knowledge as much as men do which is extremely sexist
Does women being brainwashed upon entering the religion so they will accept their place count as oppression? Because that is the only question. We think they are, but they don't.