Instigator / Pro
4
1500
rating
2
debates
0.0%
won
Topic
#4119

Holocaust-denial legislation is driven more by a desire to criminalise thus stigmatise dissent than by a desire to mitigate harm, resulting from Holocaust denial, to individual Jews.

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
0
3
Better sources
2
2
Better legibility
1
1
Better conduct
1
1

After 1 vote and with 3 points ahead, the winner is...

Sir.Lancelot
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
5
Time for argument
Two weeks
Max argument characters
30,000
Voting period
Six months
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
7
1587
rating
182
debates
55.77%
won
Description

Definitions:

Holocaust: the WW2 Jewish Holocaust
Holocaust denial: any attempt to deny, distort, dispute or downplay the established popular history of the WW2 Jewish Holocaust
Holocaust-denial legislation: the legislation varies across countries but generally criminal fines and/or imprisonment is enabled via this legislation for public Holocaust denial, usually without a requirement to prove intent to cause harm (there are some exceptions). Some countries have a general genocide-denial law: this includes Holocaust denial in this definition.
Dissent: having or expressing an opinion different from a prevailing or official position; disagreement.
Harm to individual Jews: hate crimes or tangible criminal behaviour as reported by individuals identifying as Jewish (not the Jewish community overall) and suffered by that person.

Notes and rules:

I use the words "individual Jews" rather than "the Jewish community" because I am sure you will agree it's a given that there would be harm caused to the Jewish community if the desire was generally accepted to be to criminalise thus stigmatise dissent. The rationale given for the introduction of these laws is in most cases pertinent to hate crimes suffered by individual Jews - also consider that there is no way for a community to collectively report to authorities a hate crime on itself so there is no way to find or gauge statistics on this.

The debate is about *the desire* that drives the legislation to come into effect, *not the reason* for it to come into effect. i.e. the motive behind the introduction of legislation. Please note in this regard by "desire" I mean the mission (an ambition or purpose that is assumed by a person or group[https://www.wordnik.com/words/mission]) of NGOs (non-governmental organisations) who lobby for the introduction of such legislation via the creation thereof by a governmental authority.

In short: the debate does not concern the desire of *government* to create the law (that is the government's job anyway), rather that of *the group* behind the introduction of it to government.

Debate will be mostly theoretical and statistical.

BoP is effectively shared.
No new arguments in final round.
No kritiks.
No timewasters.
No timeout-forfeits, please.

Disagreements about the definitions and notes and rules can be settled during the debate and any disagreements and resulting discussions thereof should be considered part of the debate arguments, unless those disagreements are settled in the comments prior to the first round being argued by Pro.

Someone got booped:
https://youtu.be/cwZyoaiSsgU?t=28

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@fivesix

Well, I would think the explanation is fairly simple - he was running low on time, and didn't want to rudely forfeit, so he just waived a round.

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@Sir.Lancelot

wasn't a mistake, was it? so? why the "boop?" explain yourself, kid

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@fivesix

Uhh.
My bad.

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@Sir.Lancelot

so? no message from you; no comment. any explanation for the "boop?"

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@WeaverofFate

The update took away people’s ability to vote.

If I created a 1 round debate and you accepted, you’d get your voting abilities back.

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@Barney

Man I wish I could vote so I could follow this. Do you know why I can't vote?

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@Barney

I reckon he's taking the mickey tbh

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@fivesix

He most likely was too busy to post a round, so booped to stay in the running and not commit the rudeness that is forfeiting.

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@Sir.Lancelot

what's going on? I said no timewasters