Cuba has a better healthcare system than the US
The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.
After 1 vote and with 2 points ahead, the winner is...
- Publication date
- Last updated date
- Type
- Rated
- Number of rounds
- 3
- Time for argument
- One week
- Max argument characters
- 10,000
- Voting period
- One month
- Point system
- Multiple criterions
- Voting system
- Open
- Minimal rating
- 1,400
BoP is shared.
Better: more desirable, satisfactory, or effective.
“It’s the system more than the individuals that is to blame,” Makary said. The U.S. patient-care study, which was released in 2016, explored death-rate data for eight consecutive years. The researchers discovered that based on a total of 35,416,020 hospitalizations, there was a pooled incidence rate of 251,454 deaths per year — or about 9.5 percent of all deaths — that stemmed from medical error. Afterward Chris said he discovered that pharmacy technicians, rather than well-trained and educated pharmacists, are compounding nearly all of the IV medications for patients. And many states have no requirements, or proof of competency, for these pharmacy technicians. [cnbc]
- Larger scale increases efficiency
- 26 times more resources invested in healthcare per capita
- No blockade, easier collaboration with other nations
- Actually has access to all the important equipment
- Has not sent its doctors abroad for free
So with all of that said, yes, America has among the best cancer survival statistics because of an incredible abundance of high technology equipment and drugs, more extensive screening, and more aggressive treatment.
America also in general has better survival statistics when cancers are compared stage for stage. Of course there are exceptions. Japan survival statistics for stomach cancer are much better than American numbers.
Very expensive cancer treatments such as the new immunotherapies for cancer are more widely available in America than in countries with national healthcare where there are restrictions based on cost/benefit and budget caps.
Often regarded as one of the gold standards of healthcare in the world, the American healthcare system boasts an impressive collection of accomplishments. Consisting of a vast network of specialized providers, cutting-edge research, and novel therapies, the American system features personalized treatment plans with an emphasis on patient choice [1]. In almost every scenario, individuals have the autonomy to choose their healthcare providers and the nuances of the care they receive. Moreover, this care is more accessible than ever with the continued expansion of healthcare coverage and the integration of mobile clinics and telehealth.
The American healthcare system has invested significant resources in medical research and pharmaceutical development which has led to groundbreaking discoveries and improved treatments in a variety of fields [2]. This was well illustrated during the COVID-19 pandemic, where the United States outpaced all other countries in vaccine development and distribution. This $32 million investment has led to millions of lives saved and has created potential avenues for the treatment of other diseases. Additionally, the United States leads the world in new drug and medical device approvals, holds the distinction of having the highest number of Nobel laureates in chemistry and medicine, and produces the second-highest impact of scientific works in the world [3].
The degree of medical specialization in the United States is also among the most advanced in the world. Between the years of 2011 and 2015, nearly 90% of graduating internal medicine residents, the specialty responsible for providing the majority of the medical fellows in the country, were pursuing fellowship subspecialization [4]. This degree of individual academic achievement provides patients with physicians who are highly knowledgeable and well equipped to treat them. The downstream effects of this subspecialization can be demonstrated by improvements in a variety of contexts including in cancer detection and treatment. During their additional training, physicians are exposed to improved early oncologic detection strategies and surgical techniques which has contributed to a 32% reduction in the risk of cancer death compared to 1991. This translates to nearly 3.5 million lives saved [5].
Patient-centered care and freedom of choice are major strengths of the United States healthcare system. Patient-centered care focuses on placing patients at the center of healthcare decision-making and considering their values, preferences, and needs [1]. This technique has shown great success in multiple avenues. For instance, a Cochrane review of the patient-centered care model in patients with obstructive sleep apnea showed improved patient adherence as well as significant improvements in patient outcomes [6]. Americans are also awarded the freedom of choice in selecting healthcare providers, specialists, and treatment options. This empowers patients to seek care from providers they trust and have confidence in, and it promotes competition among healthcare providers -- potentially leading to higher quality and more accessible care. Overall, the emphasis on patient-centered care and freedom of choice highlights a commitment to individual patient autonomy and the recognition of patients as active participants in their own healthcare.
The United States is well positioned to be a global leader in the emerging field of personalized medicine. Personalized and precision medicine, utilizing a patient's own DNA to guide treatments and predict potential future diseases, is poised to revolutionize the field of medicine and shape its future [7-8]. By analyzing an individual's genetic makeup, healthcare providers can tailor treatments and interventions to their unique genetic profile, maximizing effectiveness and minimizing adverse effects. This approach holds great promise for improved patient outcomes and enhanced precision in healthcare delivery. America is home to a very large number of experts in this field including Vanderbilt University’s Dr. Dan Roden who is well-known worldwide for his pioneering work on personalized and precision medicine [9]. Through its combination of strong research infrastructure, significant investment in genomic research, and precision medicine initiatives, the United States will continue to innovate at the forefront of this transformative field.
The United States is also implementing new policies to increase accessibility to healthcare insurance and services. The Affordable Care Act (ACA), enacted in 2010, expanded Medicaid, created health insurance marketplaces, and limited insurance denials due to pre-existing conditions. Further supplemented by legislation such as the American Rescue Plan and Inflation Reduction Act, which provide additional subsidies for health insurance coverage, these policies have led to a near year-over-year reduction in the rate of uninsured. From 2013 to 2021 there has been a 38% drop in the number of uninsured patients, and more than four million people have gained coverage in the past year alone [10].
Interpreted resolution: Cuba has a more desirable, satisfactory, or effective healthcare system than the US. BoP: SharedThe healthcare system is the way in which the available medical resources are organized and distributed to meet the needs of the population, and the laws regulating this system.Healthcare outcomes = resources invested into the healthcare system * how good the healthcare system is.
- You "win" by getting sick enough that your medical bills ecclipse your insurance fees.
- You "lose" by staying healthy enough that paying medical bills out of pocket would have been cheaper.
Unfortunately, the costs of maintaining such a system are quite profound, and the higher investments do not pay dividends in health outcomes.
- A strong primary care system that allows physicians to see their patients regularly and detect health problems early.
- Patients suspected of having cancer are referred to specialized centers for diagnosis and appropriate treatment.
- Cuban scientists have made tremendous progress in finding new treatments for cancer and new tools to improve diagnosis and prevention.
- There is not a single country on earth that has achieved even remotely comparable health outcomes with an economy of comporable strenght to Cuba.
- In documents sent between US government officials is a direct admission that the blockade aims to "deny supplies in order to bring about hunger and desperation"
- The global community has voted each year for 30 years that this blockade is inhumane and illegal [2].
- "The Cuban socialist healthcare system is internationally recognized as one of the best in the world. It is innovative, preventative, people-oriented, comprehensive, community-centered, internationalist, and, of course, de-commodified—treating healthcare as a human right, not a profitable commodity. However, in spite of its extraordinary successes, the United States’ sixty-year long blockade has tremendously detrimental effects on Cuban life in general, and their healthcare system in particular. As Amnesty International reported, the US blockade “limits Cuba’s capacity to import medicines, medical equipment, and the latest technologies, some of which are essential for treating life-threatening diseases.” [3].
- It is denied the drug Nusinersen which could significantly help more than half of its children who struggle with infantile spinal atrophy
- 158,800 Cuban patients are harmed by the impossibility of accessing technology for the implantation of percutaneous aortic valves
- At the height of the pandemic the US company Vyaire Medical bought ventilator manufacturers and immediately banned all sale of ventilators to Cuba.
- This is just a small selection. There are more examples than the character limits allows.
- "A humanitarian catastrophe has been averted only because the Cuban government has maintained a high level of budgetary support for a health care system designed to deliver primary and preventive health care to all of its citizens. Cuba still has an infant mortality rate half that of the city of Washington, D.C.. Even so, the U.S. embargo of food and the de facto embargo on medical supplies has wreaked havoc with the island’s model primary health care system. The crisis has been compounded by the country’s generally weak economic resources and by the loss of trade with the Soviet bloc. Few other embargoes have so restricted medical commerce as to deny the availability of life-saving medicines to ordinary citizens" [4].
- His choice to not present a framework means my framework has been implicitly accepted.
- RM's sources have literally the opposite conclusions from what he wants them to say, and have only further strengthened my case.
- He made a nonsense claim that Cuba is crippled by some vague socialist boogeyman and not the US blockade.
- He has not yet responded to my arguments from R1, so I extend all of them.
- His points are not arguments but just examples of conflating medical resources and the healthcare system.
Health insuranceRM has not even brought up a single benefit the system of health insurance has over Cuba's single-payer system. His claim that complexity and confusion are good is unsupported.
- Work for 50 states and more territories all allowed different local laws and rates for healthcare and different standards and maximum payouts for civil lawsuits against doctors in malpractise cases.
- Keep up the apex healthcare cutting edge innovations globally.
In the United States, the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA), a federal agency funding disease-fighting technology, announced investments of nearly US$1 billion to support American COVID‑19 vaccine development and manufacture of the most promising candidates. On 16 April, BARDA made a US$483 million investment in vaccine developer Moderna and its partner, Johnson & Johnson.[44][53] BARDA has earmarked an additional US$4 billion for development. It will have a role in other programs for development of six to eight vaccine candidates destined for clinical study into 2021 by companies such as Sanofi Pasteur and Regeneron.[53][54] On 15 May, the government announced funding for a fast-track program called Operation Warp Speed to place multiple vaccine candidates into clinical trials by the fall of 2020 and manufacture 300 million doses of a licensed vaccine by January 2021. The project's chief advisor is Moncef Slaoui and its chief operating officer is General Gustave Perna.[55][56] In June, the Warp Speed team said it would work with seven companies developing vaccine candidates: Moderna, Johnson & Johnson, Merck, Pfizer, the University of Oxford in collaboration with AstraZeneca, and two others,[57] although Pfizer later stated that "all the investment for R&D was made by Pfizer at risk."[58]
Better outcomes
Patients more satisfied
Although medical attention remains free, many patients did and still do bring their doctors food, money or other gifts to get to the front of the queue or to guarantee an appointment for an X-ray, blood test or operation.
If you do not have a contact or money to pay under the table, the waiting time for all but emergency procedures can be ridiculously long.
Many Cubans complain that top-level government and Communist Party officials have access to VIP health treatment, while ordinary people must queue from dawn for a routine test, with no guarantee that the allotted numbers will not run out before it is their turn.
And while the preventative healthcare system works well for children, women over the age of 40 are being shortchanged because yearly mammograms are not offered to the population at large.
I saw many hospitals where there was often no running water, the toilets did not flush, and the risk of infections – by the hospital’s own admission – was extremely high.
Healthcare for hard currency
In all fairness, in the past five years, the government has made great efforts to improve hospitals and health centres, but again, lack of resources is making the process painfully slow.
The system is free, but it is neither fast nor efficient for two important reasons. One is obviously the lack of financial resources, and the other – which is related to the first – is the “export” of doctors, nurses and dentists in exchange for hard currency.
Thousands of Cuban doctors go to Venezuela to provide primary healthcare there. Their tour of duty lasts a minimum of two years and they are paid approximately $50 a month, plus expenses. In exchange, Hugo Chavez, Venezuela’s president, sends Cuba petrol, part of which can be sold for hard currency.
When a friend of mine was unable to be operated on as scheduled, because there was no anesthesiologist available, “they are all in Venezuela” was a complaint I regularly heard.
Another way the country is attempting to obtain hard currency is to offer health services to foreigners – something that has been dubbed “health tourism”. But some question whether visitors really get what they pay for.
For years, the country sold itself to the world as a medical powerhouse, but Cuba has long been in a health crisis that has only worsened in the wake of the coronavirus pandemic, just as other sectors of the economy and life in general have deteriorated. Even as the sick, the hospitalized and occasional patients complained about the lack of medicines, the shortage of hospital beds and the few ambulances, the government continued to claim that the island was a medical powerhouse.
Now, the problem is not only the lack of medicine in pharmacies, but the lack of medical personnel in a country that has reported an exodus of over 300,000 Cubans in just two years. According to the National Statistics and Information Office (ONEI), some 12,000 doctors left the Cuban public health system last year.
“They don’t say it, but there are no doctors in Cuba; they don’t want to acknowledge it,” Cuban doctor Lucio Enriquez Nodarse, a member of the Free Cuban Medical Guild, says from Spain. “It is a more serious issue than anyone imagines. They are never going to say that the great Cuban medical school, the great [medical] powerhouse, has no doctors.”
A doctor in Havana looks at a map of the sites where there are Cuban medical missions, before leaving for Mozambique, in 2019.RAMON ESPINOSA (AP)
This year, during a meeting Prime Minister Manuel Marrero Cruz only acknowledged that “the lack of foreign currency income” prevented “the acquisition of resources to meet the health needs” of the population. In other words, the government can hardly take care of its sick citizens.
Cuba has a population of 11.2 million inhabitants and 2.3 million of them are under 18 years of age. According to the 2022 Health Statistical Yearbook, the main causes of death among minors are malignant tumors, septicemia, accidents, congenital malformations, deformities and chromosomal anomalies. While the total number of children who are being neglected by the Cuban health system is unknown, every day there are numerous complaints about this situation from parents on social media.
For years, Yurislay Leyva Vasconcelo, Yurisay Marín Leyva’s mother, has been demanding a better quality of life for her daughter. Now 22 years old, Yurisay was born with achondroplasia (bone growth disorder) and congenital glaucoma, and she also suffers from epilepsy, hypertension and drug-induced gastritis.
“She never has the medicines she needs, because when she doesn’t lack one, she lacks another, and for a year nothing has been coming into the pharmacy,” says the mother of Yurisay, one of the cases presented to UNICEF.
9-year-old Geobel Damir Ortiz Ramírez is another of the cases submitted to the UN agency. Geobel has been diagnosed with a plexiform neurofibroma in his right eye, among other diseases.
“My son has a chronic condition and in Cuba there are no options for surgery or treatment for him,” says his mother, Eliannis Ramirez Baez. “I have even reported the situation to MINSAP. I have asked for help everywhere and no one will lift a finger to do anything. I am desperate, anguished, sometimes depressed, weak, because everything in this country is fruitless.”
Another case is that of 8-year-old Yoahira Lía Zulueta Jorge, who has infantile cerebral palsy (ICP), as well as epilepsy, diabetes, asthma and cleft palate. Her mother has not only asked for help for her healthcare, but also for the housing conditions in which she lives: “The house is at risk of collapse. I have gone to all the agencies and nothing [happened], they just tell me that there are no funds,” she says.
The fifth case, Cristofer Antonio Olivera, 4, has been waiting for an operation for almost his entire life. When he was 1 year old and just learning to walk, he accidentally took caustic soda (lye), which permanently damaged his gastric tube. The doctors have told his grandmother that there are not enough supplies to operate on him; in the meantime, Cristofer is fed with a syringe and a tube connected to his stomach.
Like the rest of the aforementioned parents, Cristofer’s caregivers are requesting humanitarian visas so they can leave the island and care for their children in other countries. Activist Avana de la Torre, who went to the UNICEF offices in Madrid, has since documented the cases of 1000 other minors unprotected by the Cuban government.
“This is a cry from the mothers and grandmothers of vulnerable children in Cuba,” she says. “This situation is probably not going to change anything, other than exposing the Cuban government and UNICEF.”
The system needs capitalism and not single-payer itself because it has to run for profitable scheme to encourage the end results it gets.
Cuba has long been in a health crisis that has only worsened in the wake of the coronavirus pandemic, just as other sectors of the economy and life in general have deteriorated. Even as the sick, the hospitalized and occasional patients complained about the lack of medicines, the shortage of hospital beds and the few ambulances. [RM's source].
for a year nothing has been coming into the pharmacy,
- Their life expectancy is 78 years, more than any other developing country, and nearly identical to that of the US.
- Their infant mortality is less than half of that in Washington DC.
- They are a leading player in the fight against cancer.
- The Cuban healthcare system is more desirable because it is based on morally superior foundations, reflects good on the country internationally and respects doctors and patients.
- Unlike Cuba, America does not guarantee women the right to good sex education, contraceptives and abortion. Many states and regions, those basic human rights are outright denied.
- Cuban doctors serve communities where they form close bonds with the people. This increases trust and emotional connection which substantially improves patient outcomes.
Cuba's health outcomes is leages above all developing nations, but "the US lags significantly behind most of the developed world in a wide range of health outcomes"
I will not use the established framework because it is very subjective and to prove which is more desirable would require showing a statistical analysis of the support of both systems to determine which demographic is bigger.
That said, I shall judge which healthcare system is more effective, in terms of functionality & morals.
I will state that I don't buy Pro's argument that Cuba's healthcare system "would" be better than the US's healthcare system if it had the same amount of funding because this is arguing potentiality and a hypothetical, this is off-topic and isn't comparing what is current.
That said, Pro mentions that Cuba's healthcare's principles value the lives and satisfaction of the people, and grant accessibility to all of its citizens ensuring they all receive the same quality treatment. And that the healthcare industry in Cuba is more effective in ensuring doctors get employment stability. When Pro says that Cuba's healthcare system is simplistic and that American's healthcare system is too complicated, what he means is that Cuba is more competent at accomplishing more with minimal resources than America is with their huge supply of resources. Pro criticizes America's healthcare system as being too apathetic and insensitive, and that veterans and other people are unable to obtain insurance. Pro also mentions that America has a higher body count because they mistreat their doctors, and the overworked doctors are more prone to making mistakes and suffering a chronic lapsee in judgment because of this labor abuse, contributing to the death toll. Conversely, Cuba treats their doctors better.
Con counters that the complications of the American healthcare system are not the faults of the United States and are due to unrelated factors. Con makes the case that the American healthcare system has more money and resources and have been able to access better technology and medicine to treat illness whereas Cuba failed to develop a Covid vaccine, and that there is a minimal supply of doctors in Cuba. However, Con concedes to Pro's argument about the 8% of people that die. Con mentions that patients have more choices and control about which treatment they choose. However even with these comparisons, Con fails to convince me that the United States's healthcare is efficient mechanically, despite their superior clout & resources. So the win does ultimately go to Pro for arguments.
As for conduct, Con does get the point because of Pro's insults.:
1. "RM's laziness apparently knows no bounds. Another completely copy pasted round. And he complains about character limit, but it is his own laziness than reduces his argument density."
2. "RationalMadman stays true to the latter half of his name by citing a study that clearly refuted his argument right in the motherfucking abstract."
The problem is not really the healthcare systems, it's mainly what's going on in terms of crime and illegal activity tbh
Vote bump.
Vote bump.
Vote bump.
i will vote on this later, but i just wanted to point out that the times that pro called out con was really unnecessary and could really forfeit the point for conduct, depending on how many times it occurs in this debate
>Complains the entire debate that he doesn't have enough characters to do any rebuttals or framework or anything important.
>Writes practically nothing in R3.
can you for the love of god contact me before opening these challenges up. Before your elo gets any lower I want a piece of you
North Korea is an evil dictatorship. Their people are starving and living in fear from government.
Just joking. North Korea is best.
Are you not going to interject and tell us that North Korea has the greatest healthcare system on the planet?