Futile

Author: janesix ,

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  • janesix
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    I find it futile to argue with atheists on the existence of God. 

    Because unless they experience God for themselves, there is simply no way to convince them that God exists. 


  • RationalMadman
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    --> @janesix
    In time you will come to learn that she created the atheists in order to get outsmarted, used and profited from. Do not hate the stupid for being what they are, do not envy the ignorant for not being burdened with what you know; you are enlightened and supreme and you should enjoy it.
  • Goldtop
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    --> @janesix
    Unless of course, those who claim to experience God are lying, mistaken or delusional. Can any of them show they are not?

    The problem is not atheists or God, the problem is those who claim God but cannot demonstrate it. They are the problem.
  • janesix
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    --> @Goldtop
    Unless of course, those who claim to experience God are lying, mistaken or delusional. Can any of them show they are not?
    Like I said, there is no way to convince atheists. I rest my case.

    The problem is not atheists or God, the problem is those who claim God but cannot demonstrate it. They are the problem.
    I didn't say there was a problem. There is no problem. God has obviously decided to remain anonymous to some people. That's between you and God.

  • Goldtop
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    --> @janesix
    Like I said, there is no way to convince atheists. I rest my case.
    Since you can't show you're not lying, mistaken or delusional, I rest my case.

    God has obviously decided to remain anonymous to some people. That's between you and God.
    That's Special Pleading, which means you're either lying, mistaken or delusional. That's between you and you. If you can't be honest with yourself, then how can you be honest with others?

  • janesix
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    --> @Goldtop
    Like I said, it's futile to try to argue with an atheist about God. You prove the point of my thread. Thank you Goldie, I wouldn't have expected anything else from you.
  • Goldtop
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    --> @janesix
    Like I said, it's futile to try to argue with an atheist about God.
    That's just a lame excuse for not wanting to be honest with yourself. Probably a good thread question, "Why can't believers be honest with themselves"?


    You prove the point of my thread.

    And, you prove my point of not being honest with yourself about being mistaken, lying or delusional.  You haven't even bothered, just like you've never bothered to form an argument about God. That's three strikes against you.

  • janesix
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    --> @Goldtop
    I have always been honest about not being certain about my experiences with God. Of COURSE I could be mistaken. Of COURSE I could be delusional. I have said that before, and you know it. 
  • Goldtop
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    --> @janesix
    Then, you haven't anything to complain about in regards to atheists.

    It's no different than if I was trying to argue Leprechauns riding Unicorns in the Kentucky Derby. Is it futile to argue such things simply because others don't accept the argument? Clearly, the problem lies entirely in the formation of any argument for God's existence. They are all incredibly weak, pointless or just all out ridiculous.

    So, if you think it;'s futile, better have a look at your argument then, most likely, it isn't valid. That's not any problem with atheists, the problem is with the argument.
  • Mopac
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    --> @janesix
    Sometimes we never get to see the plants that grow out of the seeds we plant.

    Johnny appleseed over here.




  • janesix
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    --> @Goldtop
    Then, you haven't anything to complain about in regards to atheists.
    Not really complaining, just saying it's pointless to argue with you guys. Because you won't beleive unless you experience God for yourself. 

    It's no different than if I was trying to argue Leprechauns riding Unicorns in the Kentucky Derby. Is it futile to argue such things simply because others don't accept the argument? Clearly, the problem lies entirely in the formation of any argument for God's existence. They are all incredibly weak, pointless or just all out ridiculous. 

    So, if you think it;'s futile, better have a look at your argument then, most likely, it isn't valid. That's not any problem with atheists, the problem is with the argument.


  • janesix
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    --> @Mopac
    what are you saying, that we should argue for God anyway, even if it seems futile?
  • Mopac
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    --> @janesix
    If they had it their way, we would all be silenced. Debate, if not for their sake for the sake of those who are witnessing.
    But do it for the right reason. Do it for the sake of love. 



  • Goldtop
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    --> @janesix
    Because you won't beleive unless you experience God for yourself. 
    I doubt you have either. At least, I'm honest about it. I don't have to lie to myself.


  • Goldtop
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    --> @Mopac
    If they had it their way, we would all be silenced.

    No one is trying to silence you, but it would be nice if you didn't repeat the same thing over and over, that's just annoying.
  • Castin
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    --> @janesix
    I find it futile to argue with atheists on the existence of God. 

    Because unless they experience God for themselves, there is simply no way to convince them that God exists. 
    No one who comes on this forum is likely to change their core beliefs. If you measure arguments here by outcome or product, everything we do here is futile. The only one whose mind you're guaranteed to be able to change is your own.

    I will say, as an atheist, that I have tried to experience God for myself. I never got an answer that didn't feel like it was just my own imagination talking back to me.
  • drafterman
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    --> @janesix
    Might be true. It's a surprise then why a god that wants to be known doesn't make himself known.
  • Mopac
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    --> @Castin
    Maybe you are expecting a miracle. 

    God is The Truth. You know The Truth exists. A relationship with God is a relationship with that.
  • janesix
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    --> @drafterman
    What makes you think God wants to be known?
  • Goldtop
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    --> @Mopac
    Yes, we understand truth, but unfortunately, your dictionary has let you down. Notice that God is NOT in the definition of truth and truth is not in the definition of God. Sorry, looks like God is not the truth according to YOUR standards.

    Truth

    - the quality or state of being true.
    - that which is true or in accordance with fact
    - a fact or belief that is accepted as true.

    God

    - the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
    - a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.
    - an adored, admired, or influential person.
  • janesix
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    --> @Castin
    How did you try?
  • Goldtop
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    --> @janesix
    If God didn't want to be known, you're claim of experiencing God is definitely false.
  • drafterman
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    --> @janesix
    Well, either it does it doesn't want to be known. If it does, then everyone should know about it. If it doesn't, then no one should know about it.

    We're clearly not in the first world, so we must be in the second. So either a god exists, but no one knows it, or a god doesn't exist.
  • Mopac
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    --> @Goldtop
    Supreme Being


    It's right there in the definition you posted.

  • janesix
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    --> @Goldtop
    If that is the case, then you are right.

    But we don't know what God wants.