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@3RU7AL
Sorry Festus. Everytime I pin you down with questions you can't (or won't) answer, you run away to other questions. I'm not here for an interrogation. Answer my questions or your questions get dumped.
Antitheist AMA
Posts
Total:
351
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@ethang5
Sorry Festus. Everytime I pin you down with questions you can't (or won't) answer, you run away to other questions. I'm not here for an interrogation. Answer my questions or your questions get dumped.
Please be slightly more specific.
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@ethang5
Wait so if god existed they wouldn't be a creature? That's funny:
Furthermore, this is an ethical dilema, for the sake of conversation a god exists and that god has the power to stop all evil, you have made a claim: that the reason there is still evil is because god is being "just" about his clean up efforts, that is a claim. Justify it.
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@Theweakeredge
the reason there is still evil is because god is being "just" about his clean up efforts,
Perhaps "global warming" is like the new version of Noah's Flood or Sodom and Gomorrah.
Kill all the evil people.
It doesn't seem to care about "freewill" at all.
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@3RU7AL
What a good point, not that I think that "Oh what about Freewill" was ever a very strong defense.
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@Theweakeredge
Wait so if god existed they wouldn't be a creature? That's funny:
What's funny is you pretending the word "creator" doesn't exist.
Furthermore, this is an ethical dilema, for the sake of conversation a god exists and that god has the power to stop all evil, you have made a claim: that the reason there is still evil is because god is being "just" about his clean up efforts, that is a claim.
I don't recall making any such claim. Are you confused?
Justify it.
Sorry, I only justify claims I make.
Now that these forums are permanent electronic records, researchers a thousand years from now will be able to verify that there
was a subspecies of humans that believed in the long discredited concept of a God.
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@FLRW
Lol! A thousand years ago, an equally deluded yokel said the same thing about paper and libraries.
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@ethang5
This is again only bald assertion, but there is consequence to God, that is why He is ridding the universe of evil in a JUST way, and not as a despot
Didn't make the claim huh?
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@Theweakeredge
This is again only bald assertion, but there is consequence to God, that is why He is ridding the universe of evil in a JUST way, and not as a despot
Didn't make the claim huh?
I made the claim above, not your fake interpretation of it before that.
I recall you making the claim that there was no consequence to God. I show yours is a fake claim by pointing out the consequence to God, and do you admit your claim was fake? Nooo. Do you address my rebuttal about no consequence to God? Nooo. You forget your fake claim, and your fake interpretation, and demand evidence of my subsequent claim(which you twisted)
You will not be allowed to run from your bogus claims Everytime you hit a bump. I will not present any evidence for any claim I make, if your previous claims are dying of lack of support.
And don't paraphrase my claims, quote them.
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@ethang5
Um... I just rephrased what you said, simply for the formatting, you see your "interpretation" was a dependent clause after a indepedent clause, in order for it to work grammatically I had to make the dependent clause an independent clause, but thats all semantic. Furthermore, you said you would not defend the claim because you "did not make it" now you claim I never addressed your refutation.... you've literally refused to answer... Secondly, how is "doing it in a just way" a consequence? No, god has all power according to your holy book, he could literally just not make evil or make evil so small it wouldn't matter, heck that god could do a million things with literally no effort if it existed. The thing is, if it did exist, it has done none of those things.
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@Theweakeredge
Um... I just rephrased what you said, simply for the formatting, you see your "interpretation" was a dependent clause after a indepedent clause, in order for it to work grammatically I had to make the dependent clause an independent clause, but...
Blah, blah, blah. Just quote me.
how is "doing it in a just way" a consequence?
The way you suggest would be unjust. THAT would have the consequence of making God unjust.
No, god has all power according to your holy book, he could literally just not make evil...
God did not make evil. Evil is like "cold" or "shadow", they are not made, but are a function of what was made, respectively, heat and light.
or make evil so small it wouldn't matter,
This makes no sense.
heck that god could do a million things with literally no effort if it existed. The thing is, if it did exist, it has done none of those things.
You could have been a better God eh? Where have we heard that one before?
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@ethang5
Hey...It's dead easy to make bogus claims to validate hypothetical information.
Nonetheless, hypothetical information requires actual proof if you want others to take it seriously.
Acceptance without proof, is what it is.....And not everyone is prepared to buy into that sort of hypothesis.
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@ethang5
Um...no... I suggested that god save people, using a comparison of a child about to be run over, you have refused to engage this.
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@Theweakeredge
you've literally refused to answer
Yep.
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@ethang5
The way you suggest would be unjust. THAT would have the consequence of making God unjust.
Coercing everyone on the planet with threats of eternal hellfire is the only moral solution.
Perhaps my neighbors should start following my special-book-of-rules because if they don't, I will burn down their homes while they're sleeping.
This is the only moral solution.
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@ethang5
God did not make evil. Evil is like "cold" or "shadow", they are not made, but are a function of what was made, respectively, heat and light.
Do you realize that "shadow" and "cold" also don't exist UNLESS THERE IS A PLACE FOR THEM TO EXIST.
Do you realize that "shadow" and "cold" also don't exist UNLESS THERE ARE LAWS OF PHYSICS THAT CAUSE THEM TO MANIFEST.
You seem to be suggesting that evil is an UNINTENDED, UNAVOIDABLE consequence of good.
Too bad your OMNISCIENT OMNIPOTENT CREATOR couldn't predict "shadows".
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@ethang5
You could have been a better God eh? Where have we heard that one before?
PERFECT GOD = PERFECT WORLD
You do the math.
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@3RU7AL
I mean, if I had the powers of god? Sure. But to be fair I don't think thats a very high bar - I mean.... I'm pretty sure anybody could be a better god than what god allegdedly is.
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@Theweakeredge
I mean, if I had the powers of god? Sure. But to be fair I don't think thats a very high bar - I mean.... I'm pretty sure anybody could be a better god than what god allegdedly is.
Here's a good illustration.
In the television show WATCHMEN, Dr. Manhattan is (very nearly) omniscient and (very nearly) omnipotent.
This power has been demonstrated publicly and nearly everyone on the planet believes Dr. Manhattan is a de facto god.
Some people accept that Dr. Manhattan is "doing what's best for everyone even if we don't understand it".
Other people think they could do a much better job and have made plans to become gods themselves by carefully studying how Dr. Manhattan became a god.
Dr. Manhattan doesn't care about their ambitions because he knows that any being with his same power and knowledge would act exactly as he acts.
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@Theweakeredge
Um...no... I suggested that god save people, using a comparison of a child about to be run over, you have refused to engage this.
Lie.
I told you that you were not God's child.
I told you that God was not obligated to your ethics.
I told you that you felt no obligation to God, so why should He be obligated to you.
I told you that to God, death was not what it is to you.
I told you God was not our Genie, here to save us from our stupidity.
You pretended to obtuse and simply repeated your lame comparison. Eh.
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@3RU7AL
Coercing everyone on the planet with threats of eternal hellfire is the only moral solution.
God disagrees with you.
Perhaps my neighbors should start following my special-book-of-rules because if they don't, I will burn down their homes while they're sleeping.
You definitely seem stupid enough.
This is the only moral solution.
Luckily for Christians, we follow a different morality. One much less stupid.
You seem to be suggesting that evil is an UNINTENDED, UNAVOIDABLE consequence of good.
No, I suggested that evil was not "created" like your logic challenged pal said.
Too bad your OMNISCIENT OMNIPOTENT CREATOR couldn't predict "shadows".
He did, ask any good b+w photographer.
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@ethang5
I told you that you were not God's child.
I thought Jesus loved everyone?
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@ethang5
You seem to be suggesting that evil is an UNINTENDED, UNAVOIDABLE consequence of good.No, I suggested that evil was not "created" like your logic challenged pal said.
Your only other option is to pretend that evil "shadowdarkness" "existed" "before" "YHWH".
And if that's your solution then your "eternal" and "creator of all" both go out-the-window.
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@ethang5
Again, I could care less what you believe god is ethically obligated to do, I am talking of what god is necessarily obligated to do if he were to be a moral being. IF he made humans with inherent value, THEN he is neccessarily obligated to protect them. Furthermore, IF god is responsible for human's lowering threshold of understanding, THEN the bad decisions made by humans are his fault.
For example: If you were to code a robot to walk in a straight line and it walked right would that be its fault or your fault? Your fault clearly - you were to the one to program it.
I've noticed you've made several claims yet you decline to either, A) engage the so-called "stupid" analogy, or B) provide any sort of evidence or demonstration for your claims.
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@3RU7AL
No, I suggested that evil was not "created" like your logic challenged pal said.
Your only other option....
I needed no options. He said God made evil. God did not make evil. I told him so.
I told you that you were not God's child.
I thought Jesus loved everyone?
When you answer questions, yours will get answered. Till then, your questions will get sent to file #13.
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@ethang5
Actually.. if god created everything then god neccesarily made evil, that's how that works. If there is no mind to comprehend it then there is no good nor evil, as god created everything which is material and not him, according to your world-view, then he would need have created evil... or do you not comprehend basic cause and effect, ah, no my bad you believe in god.
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@Theweakeredge
IF he made humans with inherent value, THEN he is necessarily obligated to protect them.
Sound logic.
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@ethang5
I needed no options. He said God made evil. God did not make evil. I told him so.
Who made evil?
(IFF) you stick with your "shadow" analogy (THEN) whoever made "light" also made "shadow" at the exact same time.
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@Theweakeredge
Again, I could care less what you believe god is ethically obligated to do, I am talking of what god is necessarily obligated to do if he were to be a moral being.
Yet you can't tell me what or whose morality you're applying to God! Your saying God is obligated doesn't mean God is obligated. Answer this question. If God is your creator, do you have any ethical obligation to Him?
he made humans with inherent value, THEN he is neccessarily obligated to protect them.
This is bald assertion. Value to whom? Protect them from what? What moral value system are you using? Logically argue your points, don't simply assert them.
Furthermore, IF god is responsible for human's lowering threshold of understanding, THEN the bad decisions made by humans are his fault.
Sorry, this is gibberish.
For example: If you were to code a robot to walk in a straight line and it walked right would that be its fault or your fault? Your fault clearly - you were to the one to program it.
Are you a robot or do you have free will?
I've noticed you've made several claims yet you decline to either, A) engage the so-called "stupid" analogy, or B) provide any sort of evidence or demonstration for your claims.
You are a liar. In your last post you accused me of not engaging your points and I numbered and listed my responses. You have dodged my rebuttals. Please stop lying.
Actually.. if god created everything then god neccesarily made evil, that's how that works.
God didn't make evil festus. Evil is not a created "thing". Address the analogy I gave you about cold and shadows.
If there is no mind to comprehend it then there is no good nor evil,
Asserted gibberish.
as god created everything which is material and not him, according to your world-view, then he would need have created evil...
Evil is material??
or do you not comprehend basic cause and effect, ah, no my bad you believe in god.
What caused the universe, O great man if science?