Someone will die over this nonsense.

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Where will this end?  Someone will die over this nonsense.


TEENAGERS SUSPENDED FROM SCHOOL IN UK FOR ‘MISHANDLING’ A COPY OF THE KORAN

Edit:
Seems I spoke too soon

The man accused of murdering Glasgow shopkeeper Asad Shah has issued a statement saying he carried out the killing because he believed Mr Shah had "disrespected" Islam.
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Jesus
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That is expected. Muslims are very sensitive about Quran. They consider the book itself to be sacred and that it should be treated with most respect.
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@Stephen


         Allahu Akbar !!!!!

( See my recent comment in Religion is only for Animals)
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I still don't get how europeans let all these goatfuckers in. It's just nonsense, they rape your women, take your money, behead the dissenting voices from islam.

This is what you have to pay for letting progressivism take over your lifes.
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Stupidity sacrifices sensibleness, silly sad sacks supposed sanctimony superior sacrilegiously.

Must muslims mutilate misplaced manners? Madness!
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I still don't get how europeans let all these goatfuckers in. It's just nonsense, they rape your women, take your money, behead the dissenting voices from islam.

This is what you have to pay for letting progressivism take over your lifes.
Most of those I have met just get on with their lives and I think our goats are reasonably safe.
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The Muslims are just following the direct words of their Allah YAHWEH God when performing such drastic measures!  Remember, Allah is the SAME GOD as in the Abrahamic religions as Judaism, Christianity, and Islam!  Figure this one out after doing the simple math, LOL!


“Terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an." (Qur'an 8:12)

“Do not hanker for peace with the infidels; behead them when you catch them”  (Qur’an 47:4)

”O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.” (Qur’an 5:51)

Christians and Jews must believe what Allah has revealed to Muhammad or Allah will disfigure their faces or turn them into apes, as he did the Sabbath-breakers.” (Qur’an 2:65-66)

“(Remember) when your Lord inspired the angels, "Verily, I am with you, so keep firm those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who have disbelieved, so strike them over the necks, and smite over all their fingers and toes." (Surat chapter 8; verse 8:12)

.



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@BrotherD.Thomas
The Muslims are just following the direct words of their Allah YAHWEH God when performing such drastic measures!  Remember, Allah is the SAME GOD as in the Abrahamic religions as Judaism, Christianity, and Islam!  Figure this one out after doing the simple math, LOL!


“Terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an." (Qur'an 8:12)

“Do not hanker for peace with the infidels; behead them when you catch them”  (Qur’an 47:4)

”O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.” (Qur’an 5:51)

Christians and Jews must believe what Allah has revealed to Muhammad or Allah will disfigure their faces or turn them into apes, as he did the Sabbath-breakers.” (Qur’an 2:65-66)

“(Remember) when your Lord inspired the angels, "Verily, I am with you, so keep firm those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who have disbelieved, so strike them over the necks, and smite over all their fingers and toes." (Surat chapter 8; verse 8:12)
Quotes from the Qur’an are often taken out of context to malign Muslims. The two relating to the beheading of infidels actually relate to rules of engagement in battle. 

(Qur'an 8:12) relates to a very specific time of the battle of Badr.

And (Qur’an 47:4) to give the full quote: “When you meet the unbelievers (in battle), smite their necks until you have crushed them, then bind your captives firmly; thereafter (you are entitled to) set them free,either by an act of grace, or against ransom, until the war ends. That is for you to do.”

 There is some unpleasant intolerance towards infidels (unbelievers)but they are down to acts committed by God. But then Christians also have us suffering eternal torments for unbelieving.
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@Stephen
Do them there links  contain violence ?  

( Links on a post about Muslims ) can't be good right ? 
They aint going to be about rollerskating  Or  funny cat vids.  

 Actully .
Links in posts about religious matters can't  be good at all. 




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@Elliott


Elliott,

YOUR QUOTE THAT MATTERS NOT:  "(Qur'an 8:12) relates to a very specific time of the battle of Badr."

Nonetheless, battle of Bad or not, it specifically states that the Muslim is to Terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an."
This would include Jews and Christians, and any other person that has no belief whatsoever whether in war or not. 


YOUR QUOTE THAT MATTERS NOT AGAIN: "And (Qur’an 47:4) to give the full quote: “When you meet the unbelievers (in battle), smite their necks until you have crushed them, then bind your captives firmly; thereafter (you are entitled to) set them free,either by an act of grace, or against ransom, until the war ends. That is for you to do.”

Again, it matters not if the Muslim is in battle or not, as shown years back when they "smited" the necks off of journalists that were captured in the Mid East, and video taped it for all to see.  


Furthermore, of course Jesus being the Christian God of the Bible, has His killing nature as well, especially of innocent infants and children as shown below:

1. JESUS AS GOD SAID: “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?  For God said, ‘Honor your father and mother’ and ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.  (Matthew 15: 3-4)

2. JESUS AS GOD SAID: “Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.” (Samuel 15:3)

3. JESUS AS GOD INSPIRED THIS PASSAGE: “Happy is the one who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.” (Psalms 137:9)

4. JESUS AS GOD STRUCK DOWN THE FIRST BORN OF EGYPT: “He struck down the firstborn of Egypt, the firstborn of people and animals.” (Psalms 135:8)

5. JESUS AS GOD SAID: I will make them eat the flesh of their sons and daughters, and they will eat one another’s flesh because their enemies will press the siege so hard against them to destroy them.’ (Jeremiah 19:9)

6. JESUS AS GOD; murdered all of His Jewish Creation, including innocent zygotes, fetus,' babies, and children in His Great Flood Temper Tantrum (Genesis 6:5-7)


As it has been seen before, the #1 Bible stupid and ignorant fool always turned themselves into a violent pretzel in trying in vain to explain passages like are shown above away, which was a great Christian Apologist comedy act to say the least!  LOL!

.


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@Elliott
Your profile says you're atheist so there is no reason for you to uphold islam. May I ask why you do this?

I tell you, with all due respect, islam being an evil religion is really far from being just a mere impression of Western people. I don't need to list all the atrocities that islam's influence is doing in several nations, especially to women. And don't tell me it's a matter of interpretation because the qua'ran is quite clear about it, while Mahoma killed thousands of unbelievers in name of his religion, Jesus -called the Christ- taught and spread love and peace. And I'm not mentioning Mahoma's life because it would provoke us all retch.

Muslim is the religion of hate and intolerance, Christianity on the other side is the religion of peace and love. I don't like Christianity but I have to accept it's been a good influence for western values.


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@Elliott
Quotes from the Qur’an are often taken out of context to malign Muslims. The two relating to the beheading of infidels actually relate to rules of engagement in battle. 

(Qur'an 8:12) relates to a very specific time of the battle of Badr.

And (Qur’an 47:4) to give the full quote: “When you meet the unbelievers (in battle), smite their necks until you have crushed them, then bind your captives firmly; thereafter (you are entitled to) set them free, either by an act of grace, or against ransom, until the war ends. That is for you to do.”

Your doctored apologetic quotes are simply not true, Elliot. And if I have to concede anything, I will admit that the Quran means what it says  and says what it means.
You suggest these vile verses apply ONLY on  "the battle field" or in "battle". Well you actually need to read this vile book for yourself. It shouldn't take you too long before you realise that Islam is a perpetual "battle" against anyone that doesn't accept, believe or submit to Allah and Islam.

Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war when he had  when in  1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"? 
That was over thirty-four years ago. In August last year he was brutally attacked in a failed attempt to murder him; being stabbed over a dozen times leaving him blind in one eye and with other life changing injuries.

Would you like to show me the words "battle" or war in this verse below?
Quran 4:89 - They wish you would disbelieve as they disbelieved so you would be alike. So do not take from among them allies until they emigrate for the cause of Allah. But if they turn away, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them and take not from among them any ally or helper.

And please, do not attempt to drop the " only a tiny minority" on us.  Those School boys were suspended (probably for their own protection) because they had somehow offended Islam by scuffing a book all about total submission to Allah.
Islam is constant jihad = battle against the unbeliever.

Quran8:39
And fight them until there is no fitnah and the religion, all of it, is for Allah. And if they cease - then indeed, Allah is Seeing of what they do.

I believe the biggest sufferers of this barbaric ideology ISLAM are Muslims themselves. 



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@IlDiavolo
Your profile says you're atheist so there is no reason for you to uphold islam. May I ask why you do this?

I tell you, with all due respect, islam being an evil religion is really far from being just a mere impression of Western people. I don't need to list all the atrocities that islam's influence is doing in several nations, especially to women. And don't tell me it's a matter of interpretation because the qua'ran is quite clear about it, while Mahoma killed thousands of unbelievers in name of his religion, Jesus -called the Christ- taught and spread love and peace. And I'm not mentioning Mahoma's life because it would provoke us all retch.

Muslim is the religion of hate and intolerance, Christianity on the other side is the religion of peace and love. I don't like Christianity but I have to accept it's been a good influence for western values.
Valid question. I am as you say an atheist but not necessarily an antitheist. I don’t particularly like religion, as I find it divisive, particularly the two main monotheist ones Islam and Christianity. Of one thing I am pretty certain of is that religion in some form will always be with us, it goes way back to the origins of humanity and shows no signs of disappearing. There was a time I thought it could be overcome with rational discourse but that was when I was young and naive.

 I don’t uphold Islam or any religion but I respect the right of people to hold religious beliefs providing they do no harm, that is the people not necessarily the religion.

 My main concern when I see parts of the Quran being cherry picked and taken out of context is the fact that is that this is used not just to attack the religion but those who follow it, the Muslims. By attacking Muslims they see themselves as persecuted and one thing about the both Christianity and Islam is that they can thrive on persecution and oppression.

 One concern is that those who preach radical Islam love this form of oppression, they thrive on it, they use it to make themselves stronger and they know they can obtain converts from those who feel oppressed.

 The fact that some of those who follow Islam have and still do commit atrocities is indisputable but the majority of Muslims don’t.

 That Christianity is a religion of peace and love for me is something of an anomaly. Jesus in the gospels preached exactly that, apart from Matthew10:34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword,” that is a weird one and seems totally out of character.The religion of love and peace went on to persecute kill and torture thousands of people and not just unbelievers but other Christians deemed to be heretics. Something went wrong, possibly they should have ditched the Old Testament as they often referred those texts to justify the atrocities.

 To return to my main cause for concern when I see the quotes being used it is often to promote intolerance towards Muslims and sometimes to justify nationalistic and racist agendas. By promoting this intolerance you risk creating a vicious circle of intolerance and feeding Islamic radicalisation. Islam isn’t going away, what we need to hope for is that it moves towards a more moderate position as Christianity has.
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@Stephen
 Would you like to show me the words"battle" or war in this verse below?Quran 4:89 - They wish you would disbelieve asthey disbelieved so you would be alike. So do not take from among them alliesuntil they emigrate for the cause of Allah. But if they turn away, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them and take not fromamong them any ally or helper.
Here is the full quote. Again it clearly refers to actual conflict and the meaning of the bit you posted is not to take allies useless they support the cause of Allah and if they turn away, basically becoming traitors,kill them.

  "4.89] They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.

[4.91] You will find others who desire that they should be safe from you and secure from their own people; as often as they are sent back to the mischief they get thrown into it headlong; therefore if they do not withdraw from you, and (do not) offer you peace and restrain their hands, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them; and against these We have given. you a clear authority  

[4.90] Except those who reach a people between whom and you there is an alliance, or who come to you, their hearts shrinking from fighting you or fighting their own people; and if Allah had pleased, He would have given them power over you, so that they should have certainly fought you; there fore if they withdraw from you and do not fight you and offer you peace, then Allah has not given you a way against them.  "
  
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@Elliott
 Would you like to show me the words"battle" or war in this verse below? Quran 4:89 - They wish you would disbelieve as they disbelieved so you would be alike. So do not take from among them allies until they emigrate for the cause of Allah. But if they turn away, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them and take not from among them any ally or helper.
Here is the full quote. Again it clearly refers to actual conflict and the meaning of the bit you posted is not to take allies useless they support the cause of Allah and if they turn away, basically becoming traitors, kill them.

  "4.89] They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.
I quoted it in full just have you have now repeated it.

And nothing there about "battle" is there?   As you repeatedly insist here> #9
And it hasn't gone un-noticed that you replaced the word "battle " with 'conflict'. 

But there again the "conflict"  that you now refer to is as, is all about the "conflict" between  the two houses;  the house Islam and the house of war; Dar al-Islam and the Dar al-harb. <<<<<<<<<<<< right there, is your religious intolerance of anyone that isn't Muslim and intolerance of any country that isn't Islamic.  Or didn't you know this? 

Maybe that is why you ignored this clear command from the Quran and Allah himself.

Quran8:39
And fight them until there is no fitnah and the religion, all of it, is for Allah. And if they cease - then indeed, Allah is Seeing of what they do.

"Fitnah" means until there is no opposition to Allah or Islam. But you probably didn't know that either.  The Quran teaches that all Muslims must fight "Jihad" holy war "until all the religion is for Allah". I suppose we in the West can thankful that not all Muslims adhere strictly to his command.

And you missed my question;

Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle"   when in  1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"?  Yes or No?



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@Stephen
And you missed my question;

Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle"   when in  1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"?  Yes or No?
Okay to answer your question and the answer is obviously “No,”but then the Quran doesn’t prescribe the death penalty for blasphemy or apostasy.
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@Elliott
And you missed my question;

Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle"   when in  1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"?  Yes or No?
Okay to answer your question and the answer is obviously “No,”


Indeed,  obvious to us in the West and are non Muslim.
But now taking into consideration what I have said about "conflict and houses" and the Quranic verse Quran8:39  above#16,  I pose you the same question.

Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle"   when in  1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"?  Yes or No?


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Stephen and Elliott both have valid ponts.

From Wkipedia: Islam and blasphemy

The Quran curses those who commit blasphemy and promises blasphemers humiliation in the Hereafter. However, whether any Quranic verses prescribe worldly punishments is debated: some Muslims believe that no worldly punishment is prescribed while others disagree. The interpretation of hadiths, which are another source of Sharia, is similarly debated.

In the modern Muslim world, the laws pertaining to blasphemy vary by country, and some countries prescribe punishments consisting of fines, imprisonment, hanging or beheading. Capital punishment for blasphemy was rare in pre-modern Islamic societies.
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@Elliott
 To return to my main cause for concern when I see the quotes being used it is often to promote intolerance towards Muslims and sometimes to justify nationalistic and racist agendas. By promoting this intolerance you risk creating a vicious circle of intolerance and feeding Islamic radicalisation. Islam isn’t going away, what we need to hope for is that it moves towards a more moderate position as Christianity has.
Of course Islam is not going away, but it can be controlled as in Switzerland, just to mention a case where a nation can decide INTELLIGENTLY who are able to get in so not to do more harm than good to its own country.

The problem of the rest of Europe, like in Sweden, which I consider the worst case of how woke culture can spoil a country, is that they cannot help being politically correct. They are so obsessed with woke culture that they are willing to destroy their country just to not offend a fucking religious group.

Is it so difficult to kick out the muslims that don't integrate to the western society? Europeans are incapable of realizing that this is going to be the reason of their decadence as an advanced society. France has already realized it and I guess Macron is planning on doing something to mitigate their error.

You cannot justify european's mistake saying that fundamentalism is held by a minority. Remember that small groups of fundamentalists have taken over several secular and prosperous muslim countries with almost no resistance. You can't defeat people that are willing to explode themselves in the name of a religion. Can you mention a case of a christian that did so in the past? There you have the difference between Islam and Christianity, and both religions have appeared almost at the same time, there's no much difference. If Islam didnt evolve is because there is an unsavable problem of content -of the qu'ran-.
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@IlDiavolo
@Elliott
Atheist myself,

I like the truth, as I see it,

I don't like using lies, bad logic, or out of context quotes. (Mostly)
I also dislike being affiliated with such,

. . .

An example,
I might say Trump lies, a 'lot,

I wouldn't say Trump eats human babies for breakfast,
And I wouldn't like other's saying it either.
. . .

I like the truth,
I like honesty, integrity, good faith,

I'd 'prefer to oppose something, without lying or demonizing it.
And that's generally speaking,
I don't have a strong opinion on Islam.
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@Lemming
I like the truth, as I see it,

😒 
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@Stephen
If I'd said I liked the truth,
I suppose you would have bolded the word 'truth.

We all have our own perspectives,
To recognize others are seeing something different, is not wrong.

To recognize 'why other's act as they do, is not wrong.
And for me, one reason, is I like the truth, as I see it.
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@IlDiavolo
Of course Islam is not going away, but it can be controlled as in Switzerland, just to mention a case where a nation can decide INTELLIGENTLY who are able to get in so not to do more harm than good to its own country.

The problem of the rest of Europe, like in Sweden, which I consider the worst case of how woke culture can spoil a country, is that they cannot help being politically correct. They are so obsessed with woke culture that they are willing to destroy their country just to not offend a fucking religious group.

Is it so difficult to kick out the muslims that don't integrate to the western society? Europeans are incapable of realizing that this is going to be the reason of their decadence as an advanced society. France has already realized it and I guess Macron is planning on doing something to mitigate their error.

You cannot justify european's mistake saying that fundamentalism is held by a minority. Remember that small groups of fundamentalists have taken over several secular and prosperous muslim countries with almost no resistance. You can't defeat people that are willing to explode themselves in the name of a religion. Can you mention a case of a christian that did so in the past? There you have the difference between Islam and Christianity, and both religions have appeared almost at the same time, there's no much difference. If Islam didnt evolve is because there is an unsavable problem of content -of the qu'ran-.
The trouble is the Muslims who become radicalised are not that easy to identify. One factor is that those who become radicalised and commit acts of terrorism are not always the devout Muslims, they are people have partaken in acts that are considered harem such as gambling drinking alcohol and taking drugs. The ones who seem likely to develop extremist views and are the ones who feel that they don’t fit in and as they search for a sense of identity they are ideal candidates for radicalisation.
 
An example is  the  9/11hijakers who contrary to Islamic law, were known to drink alcohol. This link shows a few more examples:


I totally agree that Muslims should be encouraged to integrate but the hostility towards Muslims, the anti-Muslim rhetoric and attacking their holy book is not really conducive to this and as I said previously it creates a vicious circle of distrust and hate.
 
The reason Christians didn’t become suicide bombers in the past is pretty obvious.
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@Stephen
Indeed,  obvious to us in the West and are non Muslim.
But now taking into consideration what I have said about "conflict and houses" and the Quranic verse Quran8:39  above#16,  I pose you the same question.

Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle"   when in  1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"?  Yes or No?
No.

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@Lemming
Atheist myself,

I like the truth, as I see it,

I don't like using lies, bad logic, or out of context quotes. (Mostly)
Same here, but the truth can sometimes be hard to identify, as far as possible I like to try and remain objective when debating.
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@Elliott
Indeed,  obvious to us in the West and are non Muslim.
But now taking into consideration what I have said about "conflict and houses" and the Quranic verse Quran8:39  above#16,  I pose you the same question.

Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle"   when in  1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"?  Yes or No?
No.

Then you would be wrong from the Islamic stand point. They believed he has disrespected and insulted Islam i.e had committed blasphemy.

What do you believe had caused them to believe this?

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@Elliott
Funnily enough,
I'm actually fairly xenophobic/tribalistic/nationalistic in my views of what societies 'ought do,
In regards to keeping itself, honoring itself, and it's past.

I just don't care much 'personally, usually,
I don't see the 'gain for me as an individual.

. . .

Of that (Qur'an 8:12),
Just Googling it,
I see a number of pages arguing it as 'specifically of a certain battle,
As well as encouraging peace if the enemy lays down their arms.

It's not as though Muslims don't disagree among themselves how they ought be,
Culture has a large influence, is my view.

. . .

Personally a favorite quote of mine, is,
 "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Ben Franklin

Though I don't think I've ever used it in the context he did,
Just such a cool use of words and person though,
That I like misappropriating.

I mean, I'd not even use his name, if I didn't feel obliged,
Not my intent to claim he 'meant it in the way I misappropriated it,
But again, just such a cool use of words.
Elliott
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@Stephen
Then you would be wrong from the Islamic stand point. They believed he has disrespected and insulted Islam i.e had committed blasphemy.

What do you believe had caused them to believe this?

I did a quick search on this. I had assumed that the law against blasphemy was in the Hadith as it is the basis for much of Sharia Law but apparently the idea of blasphemy may have occurred much later, as I found this and it may answer your question:

 “The idea of blasphemy is foreign to Islam. It was justified by many medieval Muslim scholars on the basis of their understanding of Christian and Jewish texts supporting laws against those who blaspheme and vilify their religions. 

The word "blasphemy" came via Middle English blasfemen and Old French blasfemer and Later Latin blasphemare meaning "Iinjure." Based on this definition, rulers used laws to victimizenon-members of and dissident members of the ruling sect or cult. Countries that had a state religion used it often to serve the interests of the rulers. In Judaism, the third book of Torah, Leviticus 24:16 states that those who speak blasphemy shall surely be put to death. The seven laws of Noah seen by Judaism as applicable to all of humankind prohibits blasphemy In Christian theology,”

 Hear is the link to the source it also mentions the fatwa against Salman Rushdie.

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@Elliott
 I had assumed that the law against blasphemy was in the Hadith as it is the basis for much of Sharia Law 

Sharia, or sharia law, is the Islamic legal system derived from the religious precepts of Islam, particularly the Quran and the Hadith. The term sharia comes from the Arabic language term sharīʿah, Arabic: شريعة‎  which means a body of moral and religious law derived from religious prophecy, as opposed to human legislation. Sharia deals with many topics, including crime, politics, and economics, as well as personal matters such as sexual intercourse, hygiene, diet, prayer, everyday etiquette and fasting. Adherence to sharia has served as one of the distinguishing characteristics of the Muslim faith historically. In its strictest and most historically coherent definition, sharia is considered in Islam as the infallible law of God. There are two primary sources of sharia: the Quran, and the Hadiths (opinions and life example of Muhammad).

"Those found guilty of blasphemy or apostasy or converted to another religion can be executed. The punishmnets for adultery including public flogging and stoning to death".


I asked you:
They believed he (Rushdie) has disrespected and insulted Islam i.e had committed blasphemy.

What do you believe had caused them to believe this?#27