The 14th amendment bars those who insurrection or rebels against the constitution. I don't buy the argument that he committed insurrection but he did try to overturn a legit election. Should that count as rebellion?
Should trump be disqualified as president for rebellion against the constitution?
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@n8nrgim
I vote YES.
Remember that one of Trump's professors at the University of Pennsylvania’s Wharton School of Business and Finance said that he was “the dumbest goddamn student I ever had.”
Well, Trump did say that election was stolen and fueled the mob to attack and overturn election results. What more does one need to do to be disqualified?
No. In fact he should be installed as a dictator
JFC, this subject was already covered and I shut it down with actual legal facts and proper analysis of the 14th Section 3. Again…
14th Amendment, Section 3 Disqualification from Holding Office:
"No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability."
First key legal term in that criteria is "shall": Shall is an imperative command, usually indicating that certain actions are mandatory, and not permissive.
Second key term here is "engaged": involved in activity; involved especially in a hostile encounter
Third key term, and its legal definition thereof is, "insurrection": A rebellion of citizens or subjects of a country against its government.
- Rebellion: The taking up arms traitorously against the government and in another, and perhaps a more correct sense, rebellion signifies the forcible opposition and resistance to the laws and process lawfully issued.
The final legal term (phrase) in that criteria is "giving aid and comfort to the enemy": SECTION 3. Clause 1. Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open court.
"The two branches of treason, "levying war," and "adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort," are distinct, and do not embody synonymous actions."
"The term 'enemies,' as used in the second clause, according to its settled meaning, at the time the Constitution was adopted, applies only to the subjects of a foreign power in a state of open hostility with us. It does not embrace rebels in insurrection against their own government."
"...whereas giving aid and comfort is generally committed in connection with a war waged against the United States by a foreign power."
President Donald J. Trump did NOT (shall have) directly engage in an armed insurrection "in a hostile encounter" against the United States Constitution for which he gave oath to support. Equally, President Donald J. Trump did NOT give aid and comfort to the enemy since there was no enemy (a foreign power) to give aid and comfort to on January 6, 2020. More importantly, the United States Government via the F.B.I. emphatically declared that J6 was NOT an insurrection. Nor was President Donald J. Trump charged with inciting a riot and/or directly engaging in said riot that was facilitated by FBI agents placed within the J6 crowd and Capitol Police who aided in the breach of the Capitol.
"The FBI has found scant evidence that the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol was the result of an organized plot to overturn the presidential election result, according to four current and former law enforcement officials."
No insurrection, as such no rebellion either.
No enemies (agents of a foreign power) were present at the events of J6 either. Therefore, no enemies for anyone to give aid and comfort thereto.
The 14th Amendment, Section 3, does not apply where President Donald J. Trump is concerned.
He can and will likely serve another term as POTUS.
I shut it down with actual legal facts and proper analysis of the 14th Section 3.
Lol, yes let’s hear that great legal mind again.
You obviously have a better understanding of the law and the constitution than Retired Federal Judge Michael Luttig
You obviously have a better understanding of the law and the constitution than Retired Federal Judge Michael Luttig
Yes, I do. He was a corporate lawyer, not a constitutional law lawyer. Same goes for the stupid tax lawyer that filed a federal motion in his state to bar the SOS from putting Trump on the ballot per 14/3. The federal Judge told him to pound sand.
Either YOU prove me wrong or just STFU and GTFOH with your whiny nonsensical ad hom retorts derailing the subject at hand.
Since the Presidential Oath of office swears to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution", then yeah, "rebellion against the constitution" should disqualify someone, if you are guilty of Treason you should not even be allowed to run for President.
Since the Presidential Oath of office swears to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution", then yeah, "rebellion against the constitution" should disqualify someone, if you are guilty of Treason you should not even be allowed to run for President.
Intellectual cowardice denialist.
There was no rebellion.
There was no insurrection.
There was no sedition.
There was no coup.
Only thing that happened J6 was a handful of FBI agents, human sources and Capitol Police egging on riotous behavior. Those involved should be charged accordingly and lose their jobs (in effect, get cancelled).
End of story.
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@n8nrgim
Should that count as rebellion?
As soon as he is indicted for an insurrection.
but he did try to overturn a legit election
Asking for recounts and election verification isn't an insurrection.
Asking for recounts and election verification isn't an insurrection.
He got recounts and election verification. Then he continued past that point genius.
He also outright lied when he said the election was stolen. He told the American people the election was stolen and that he won in a landslide and that was a complete lie.
Only thing that happened J6 was a handful of FBI agents, human sources and Capitol Police egging on riotous behavior.
That is a lie
He also outright lied when he said the election was stolen. He told the American people the election was stolen and that he won in a landslide and that was a complete lie.
All lies, if believed true by the one saying them, are protected by the 1A.
Only thing that happened J6 was a handful of FBI agents, human sources and Capitol Police egging on riotous behavior.That is a lie
we know you can’t handle the truth.
Still can’t prove my 100% factually accurate legal analysis of 14/3. You’re dismissed.
No one here can disprove my 14/3 analysis. No one.
And certainly no one out in the real world could either.
Trump's speech Jan 6
All of us here today do not want to see our election victory stolen by a bold and radical left Democrats which is what they are doing and stolen by the fake news media. That is what they have done and what they are doing. We will never give up. We will never concede. It doesn't happen. You don't concede when there's theft involved.
Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore, and that is what this is all about.
And to use a favorite term that all of you people really came up with, we will stop the steal.
Today I will lay out just some of the evidence proving that we won this election and we won it by a landslide. This was not a close election. You know I say sometimes jokingly, but there's no joke about it. I have been into elections. I won them both and the second one I won much bigger than the first, okay?
Trump should be in prison.
Remember that Trump lost the popular vote by 2.8 million in his first election.
I've checked on many sources about this topic and most of them agree that it's very unlikely that Trump ends up in prision for this case and for any case against him. He sure will pay a lot of money as indemnification but he won't go to jail.
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@IlDiavolo
Now why would you go and ruin all the fun like that. It's nowhere near closing time!
All lies, if believed true by the one saying them, are protected by the 1A.
Is that the George Costanza defense?
You don’t know what you are talking about
No one here can disprove my 14/3 analysis. No one.And certainly no one out in the real world could either.
You are an unemployed, former army enlisted wack job.
Nobody is going to listen to your crackpot ideas.
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@IlDiavolo
I've checked on many sources about this topic and most of them agree that it's very unlikely that Trump ends up in prision for this case and for any case against him. He sure will pay a lot of money as indemnification but he won't go to jail.
What if he was black? Would that increase the odds he would go to jail?
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@IlDiavolo
Did you know that Florida prohibits inciting or encouraging a riot? A conviction results in a third-degree felony, punishable by up to five years in prison and a $5,000 fine.
Yes, I do. He was a corporate lawyer, not a constitutional law lawyer.
You are so full of shit I’m surprised you didn’t float away in the last heavy rain.
He was a judge of the United States Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit for 15 years from 1991 to 2006.
You are an unemployed, former army enlisted man who got his degree from a correspondence course in the mail.
Second key term here is "engaged": involved in activity; involved especially in a hostile encounter.
Did Jefferson Davis engage in insurrection? He was never involved in a hostile encounter during the Civil War.
More importantly, the United States Government via the F.B.I. emphatically declared that J6 was NOT an insurrection.
When did they supposedly do that? They never put out such a statement. You are lying. And Since when do the police get to do the job of the prosecutors who are the ones Responsible to bring charges in court? You read the Washington Examiner (lol) and you hear what you want to hear.
We all know several people have been convicted of plotting J6. It was not just a spontaneous riot for them. And Trump summoned the mob to the capital just as Mitch McConnell said.
Prosecutors have filed conspiracy charges against 40 defendants, alleging that they engaged in some degree of planning before the attack. Trump is next.
On June 16, 2022, Luttig testified during a televised hearing conducted by the United States House Select Committee on the January 6 Attack.[41] Before the hearing, Luttig wrote a statement for the record,[42] stating that Trump and his allies "instigated" a war on democracy "so that he could cling to power." He continued, "It is breathtaking that these arguments even were conceived, let alone entertained by the President of the United States at that perilous moment in history" and that January 6 "was the final fateful day for the execution of a well-developed plan by the former president to overturn the 2020 presidential election at any cost." At the close of the hearing, Luttig said:
Donald Trump and his allies and supporters are a clear and present danger to American democracy. They would attempt to overturn that 2024 election in the same way that they attempted to overturn the 2020 election, but succeed in 2024 where they failed in 2020. I don't speak those words lightly. I would have never spoken those words ever in my life, except that that's what the former president and his allies are telling us.[43]
IWRA continues to bang his T-Rex hands on his kiddie table while screaming at the top of his lungs his pathetic, imbecile-like temper tantrum oft seen when he knows he can’t win a debate/argument.
I mean really, it’s not hard to tell you’ve prevailed because as soon as you do the litany of ad hom jabs flows like a $2 hooker on PMS night.
You don’t know what you are talking about
Easy to claim, harder to prove. And since it is clear you will never meet that burden of proof, well…
You’re still dismissed, little boy. Now go get the Sears catalog and play find the needle in the hay stack.
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@FLRW
Ever hear of the 1st Amendment?
Yeah, didn’t think so.
People don’t go to prison for a speech.
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@FLRW
Did you know that Florida prohibits inciting or encouraging a riot? A conviction results in a third-degree felony, punishable by up to five years in prison and a $5,000 fine.
DJT did not incite or encourage “[a] riot” in Florida, or anywhere else for that matter.