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@Greyparrot
These riots were a disappointing harbinger to the Marxist Revolution. Poorly conceived and poorly executed. the globalist Marxists are not going to continue to piggyback the racism train when that unholy alliance turns into violence, terrorism, and looting.
i'll never understand why people on the right need to make conspiracy theories about everything. it couldn't possibly be that black people are being abused and harassed by the police, no. It must be a secret cabal of marxists plotting revolution so they can reanimate the corpse of Stalin and turn the US into a soviet republic. IT IS THE ONLY LOGICAL ANSWER!!!!!
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@Stephen
what would they protest?That Islam is not compatible with western society for a start.
so you are arguing that people should protest based on bigotry that isn't true?
I agree. And in this case the message should have been that mass illegal immigration and Islam is not compatible with western society.
i see. so you want mass racism. gotcha. well, no thanks.
No. Islam.
well that would be wildly illegal. you want to ban religions? you want government to decide what religious beliefs are good and bad? That is a horrible idea.
I notice you left out the Black on Black murders happening ever day in Sadiq Khan's London.
why would I include something that has absolutely nothing to do with the topic? We are talking about systemic racism and the fight against it. why don't we bring up public drunkenness too since you want to talk about irrelevant other forms of crime.
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@sadolite
It's OK, I get it you don't understand it. I once heard someone say you have mastered the art of sarcasm when people think you are serious.
i'm sorry that a) you can't finish a complete sentence so that others know what you are talking about
and b) that you can't acknowledge your own limitations and feel the need to lash out to feel better.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
I am? these voices in your head that make you read things that aren't there, stop listening to them.
you said
had they started decades ago, educating and encouraging people to wear masks especially during flu season people would be more use to it and compliant now right?
that implies that those other countries who do this have a better culture and that the WHO should have tried to force americans be like them. You think it is the WHO's fault that america has shitty culture?
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@Buddamoose
To put that into perspective, there were roughly 65 million people who had public-police interactions in 2015 with state and local law enforcement agencies, or in other words, .00014% of people who had an interaction with a police officer, experienced excessive use of force.
ok, but you are assuming that every time a cop harasses a person they file an official complaint. In most cases they are not going to do that. it might be too difficult or time consuming. They might be discouraged from filing it by other police. They might be threatened or intimidated into not filing them. They might just not do it because they know that no one will believe them and the police will do nothing about it. So pretending like the official records of documented cases is all the cases of systemic abuse is a little bit of a joke.
Not to mention that just because another cop said there was insufficient evidence, doesn't mean the cop didn't do it. We are talking about a systemic system where cops protect other cops.
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and of course there is trump sending soldiers out to attack protesters in DC so that he could walk over to a church and do a photo op.
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here's another one of police pepper spraying, then throwing explosives, then shooting at protesters when they were not in danger.
Police feel like they have the right to attack anyone they don't like. These are criminals no matter what clothes they are wearing. This kind of violence only escalates things. Do you think any of these protesters are going to be as peaceful next time they run into police? No, they have been taught the hard way the police will use violence for no reason.
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@Greyparrot
That girl seemed to learn English very quickly after being hit with a paintball.
she was standing on her own porch. There was no rioting. there were no criminals. those soldiers had no right to order her into her own home. They absolutely had no right to shoot at her when she didn't follow their orders. that was a crime.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
exactly, as Resurget pointed out in Japanese culture sick people wear masks, so if you go back to my point.....had they started decades ago, educating and encouraging people to wear masks especially during flu season people would be more use to it and compliant now right?
dear god... you are arguing it is the WHO's fault that america has a shitty culture? come on man. that is weak.
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@sadolite
Ya, I knew you wouldn't understand it based on your last response. That's OK.
go back and reread your post. It isn't a sentence. I'm not sure if you didn't finish it or what, but it doesn't make sense.
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I saw this video and it underlines my point about the abuse of police, or in this case the national guard. They walk down a calm residential street. They scream at people quietly standing on their own porch. when they aren't instantly obeyed (even though the people have no reason to do what they say) the guard open fire on them. no warning. Just screamed orders and then shooting. If soldiers did that in Iraq they would have been charged with war crimes, let alone on a peaceful street in Minneapolis. these people need to be arrested. But they won't be.
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@Dr.Franklin
it is absolutely an organized g roup, stop lying
no it isn't. There is some level of people who talk to each other and organize. But there is no president of Antifa. There is no governing board. It is a loose group of people.
1.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifaschistische_Aktion-it absolutely showed a flag.stop lying
where do you see a flag? I see photos of people and 2 posters. I see no flag.
2.there are many anti-fascist people that go under different names and are not left wing and not HAVE THE SAME EXACT FLAG
even if you could establish they had the same flag (which you haven't), what would that prove? every organization steals symbols of previous ones. The US stole tons of stuff from the romans, that doesn't make them romans.
3.it has a communist anti-white ideology
lol that is what fox news has been telling you huh? You find me evidence of antifa saying that says they are a communist and Anti-white.
you are spewing propaganda while knowing nothing at all about what you are talking about. There are members of antifa who are communists. There are members of antifa who are anti white, probably. But there are damn sure white supremacists in the republican party. Does that mean you go out on weekend wearing a white hood and burning crosses?
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@ResurgetExFavilla
That is mild. The graph was also of current stock, not rate of replenishment, at a time when production was being ramped up. Don't take more information from a data set than it is giving you. Common rookie mistake ;)
I was trying to tell that to you. You are assuming that because most hospitals are not out of supplies this very second that this means there is no problem. But you have yet to provide any evidence that they are receiving more supplies than they are using up.
i'm not pretending there is a magical solution. I'm saying giving medical masks to the general populace when 60% of hospitals are critically short of supplies is nuts.Not if it reduces pressure on hospitals by flattening the curve of infection rate.
There is no evidence it will do that. and if it causes a shortage leading the hospital staffs becoming sick and/or dying, then it would be massively counter productive.
The idea that other countries make major geopolitical decisions based on something like mask purchasing tactics in naive, and in the end is just a cope. America is the world's only superpower, that comes with benefits for its citizens.
there is 2 problems here. 1) you are correct that if this was a one time thing, it wouldn't matter. But it isn't. This mentality that america can do what it wants because it's america is pervasive. That very much does affect major geopolitical decisions.
2) America is only a superpower because it has the rest of it's alliance behind it. The US is the biggest kid on the block, but all the other kids together are stronger. Thinking of yourself as so powerful you can do what you want, is a good way to make everyone else hate you.
This graph is from April.
you are the one who provided this, not me. I asked you to provide a source saying that there wasn't a critical shortage of supplies as many, many doctors are saying there is. This is what you came up with. If you are now rejecting this source, then please find another that supports your argument that there is no shortage.
In the medical/biotech field, you typically call respirators respirators and surgical masks 'face masks' because they're different things. I've worked in biotech, and nobody ever called a respirator a 'mask' because, well, it's not a mask.
understood. However that article was written to be read by people who do not work in the medical field and do not know there is a difference between a mask and a respirator. I don't see anything in it that specifically clarifies what they mean. but either way, if there is a shortage of masks OR respirators, then they need to go to medical professionals 1st. That is the point of the article.
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@Athias
"Useful" is subject to a criteria you've yet to delineate. I can name a useful thing he has done: remove the tax penalty from obamacare's mandate.
Here's the thing. I don't think obamacare is perfect. It is super flawed. I would have no objection to trump destroying obamacare if he had a workable solution for how to get healthcare to people to replace it. But he has absolutely no plan for that. Not one suggestion. So blowing up the plan in place without doing anything to fix the problem is not useful, it is dangerous.
Which child doesn't inherit from their parents?
i never claimed most don't. Just pointing out that he was handed a successful business empire. It is a very relevant point when people argue he is a great business man.
About how he ran a number of businesses into the ground?Comes with the territory.
of incompetent businessman, yes it does.
Yes, he's wise enough to not micromanage and defer to competent managers.
he is too stupid to run his businesses so he needs much smarter people to do it for him. That's why alot of the ones he ran himself crashed and burned.
So he managed to turn his name into a commodity and you're trying to convince me that this makes him incompetent?
no, i'm saying that his only skill is being a con man. Other people built him up as a businessman genius for their own ends (to sell a tv show and a book). Trump then took their work and managed to con people with it.
The show managed to entertain its audience by creating suspense over overly simplified business practices--not to mention Trump's trademarked, "you're fired." The show has international spin-offs and earned Trump $214 million. Looks like good business to me.
true, the show turned into a success. but not because he is a great business man. He is just a good con man. Trump then used the success of the show to convince people he was a good business man, when he wasnt.
That's not what he said. He said one could grab them by the pussy; he didn't say that he did.
Here is the quote again.
"I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait."
So he just starts kissing them. He doesn't even wait. He just does it. That describes a sexual assault. Especially with his history of things like walking into changing rooms of teenage girls.
That's exactly what that means particularly in the absence of duress.
how do you know there was an absence of duress? He is a rich man and connected. He could ruin someone's career if they said no. That could easily create the conditions of duress.
Given his numerous sexaul assault allegationsThe operative term is "allegation."
no, the operative term is "numerous". People don't build up that many allegations, let alone credible ones, without there being some level of truth to them. Add to that he admits to sexually assaulting women, and that he likes to walk into rooms of teenage girls getting changed.
As I understand it, he owns those pageants, and presumably the buildings in which they are held. He can walk wherever he pleases.
ohh i get it. So he is rich, and therefore he can walk in on naked teenage girls against their will. Thank you for explaining that his wealth means others don't have rights.
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@Stephen
I didn't see a single protest or demonstration when Lee Rigby had his head removed in broad daylight on the afternoon of 22 May 2013 by two black Muslims.
what would they protest? Protests are intended to send a message to governemnt. Would that message be to crack down on muslims? They are doing that. Is it to fight terrorism? They are doing that too. There was no reason to protest.
In this case though, it was an agent of the government committing the murder. and this sort of abuse is quite common. there is very good reason to protest.
Emily Jones, a seven-year-old girl stabbed to death in front of her mother - on mothers day- by a woman of "ethnic minority" origin. No a single demonstration or protest.
again, what would the protest be for? To crack down on minorities? To punish murderers? They are already doing that.
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@Dr.Franklin
it is a political party, many people could be anti-fascist with different name but these groups have the EXACT SAME NAME,FLAG AND IDEOLOGIES, its a match
antifa is not a political party. It isn't even an organized group. it is a loose group of people who believe kinda the same things. Like calling someone a christian or a republican. It tells you something about what they believe, but the details of who they are and certainly not a single organized group.
the EXACT SAME NAME,FLAG AND IDEOLOGIES, its a match
1) that link doesn't even show a flag. it shows some posters. What flag do you think they both have?
2) the name literally just means Anti-Facist. That would apply to a huge number of people. Just because 2 completely different groups of people use the same term to describe fighting against facism, doesn;t mean they are the same.
3) modern ANTIFA has no single ideology. it is a loose collection of people who are generally on the left and want to fight against facism. So saying they have the same ideology shows you don't actually know anything about antifa.
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@Greyparrot
You used the word "feel" 3 times while hamhandedly explaining a hierarchy of power.Make a better case why police absolutely need worker unions to coerce elected officials to turn a blind eye.In other words, do some research.
You are the one arguing why abolishing a union would be positive. You need to actually make an argument. It is not my job to prove that your point has merit. You need to do that. since you don't want to even try to back up your point, why the hell would i do research on the subject?
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@Dr.Franklin
republic stems from rome, yet there is no connection to them and an ancient empire where has there is only a 70 year difference between the two groups with the exact same flag and goals as before
they are 2 groups who used the same acronym. to fight against facists. That is all the term means. There is nothing wrong or left wing about fighting facism. America sure as hell fought against facism. The group you linked to hasn't existed in 90 years. Everyone who was ever part of it is long dead. Now completely different people, in a completely different situation are using the term because they too are fighting facism.
The idea that 2 different groups used the same word, so they must be the same is childish.
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@Greyparrot
why would that fix anything at all?Do some research.
ok, so i explain why your point wouldn't do anything and ask you tell me why it would. Your response is that I should do research to prove why your idea might work, when on the face if it it is obvious it won't. i can't tell if that is laziness or if you know your own idea is dumb.
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@Dr.Franklin
antifa is evil and is actually from the communist party in the 30's in Germany that rivaled Hitler, it was also comprised of Jewish leaders which is why Hitler hated jews so much
lol and the republicans are secretly roman senators!!! i mean they use the same word so they must be exactly the same thing!!!!
do you even think about things you write?
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
because you think the average person would know to before covid? isn't the job of the CDC to inform the citizens?
2 things. 1) they can't even get people to wear masks for a disease many, many times more deadly than the flu. Sadly, they have to take the stupidity and intransigence of people into account when making recommendations. Telling people to do things you know they won't do is counter productive. it makes them less likely to listen to other things you have to say.
2) how do you know what their recommendations were previously? I certainly don't. What the CDC recommends for flu season is not something 99% of people would ever have heard of.
again, if it's really about saving lives then why didn't they get out the information about masks long ago to minimize all the flu deaths that could have been prevented?
see my 2 points above.
Have you seen anyone or anything asking people to save masks for this coming flu season which may also include covid? neither have I.
lol the world is in a massive crisis right now, and you are pissed that they aren't giving recommendations for what to do for a lesser problem that is months away? Priorities man.
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@Greyparrot
That's an easy fix. Make it illegal for government employees to form worker unions.
why would that fix anything at all? Cops feel like they need to have each others backs. It is an "us vs. them" mentality. They feel like they are above the law as they are the enforces of the law. A union might help feed this mentality, but it is not the source of it.
Are you including DINDUS in your group of "they"?
i'm not familiar with this term. From what i can gather is is racist slang for black people which implies all black people are criminals. So this seems to be evidence that your thoughts on the subject are from a rather racist lens.
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@ResurgetExFavilla
By global standards it's very mild. The idea that we will ever be anywhere near our situation in normal times under these circumstances is completely detached from reality.
60% of hospitals could run out of critical supplies within days, that is not mild. That is critical. If those supplies run out you could see the medical system collapse as all the medical staff get sick.
It won't be resolved. We can't operate in a fantasy world where there are magical solutions to structural supply issues like this.
i'm not pretending there is a magical solution. I'm saying giving medical masks to the general populace when 60% of hospitals are critically short of supplies is nuts.
I'm definitely in support of America buying up as much masks as possible, so that average people can wear them (correctly) for great benefit while doctors in other countries figure out their own problems.
this is exactly the sort of mentality that is going to cost america in the long run. I understand america 1st. But this kind of mentality is "america only". Basically fuck the entire world, we want you all dead. That does not help. Both because if outbreaks get out of control in those countries (because all the doctors are sick) then it will re-spread to america. but also because all those other countries are not going to want to co-operate with the US if they all see america as evil assholes. Which they will if the US is actively trying to kill their doctors.
That's not how supply chains work. That data doesn't mean that one week after that graph is published, those hospitals in the red will be out of masks. If production is being ramped up (combined with aggressive action in the international market), then supplies of masks will continue to flow into hospitals, and those red areas will shrink.
that graph doesn't say that those hospitals are getting enough masks though. it says they don't have enough to last the week if they don't get more. You say production has ramped up enough to cover what hospitals need, but i haven't seen any evidence that this is true. Just a graph that says 20% of hospitals are already out of critical supplies and another 40% have less than a week's worth. If there really is enough production to cover all hospitals, then great. But so far you have provided no evidence this is true. And many, many doctors and nurses are saying they don't have enough.
The article is clearly about facemasks, which are very different from respirators.
this is a quote from the article:
"There also is the issue that we have a massive global shortage," Ryan said about masks and other medical supplies. "Right now the people most at risk from this virus are frontline health workers who are exposed to the virus every second of every day. The thought of them not having masks is horrific."
They are talking about medical masks. they are not talking about masks people make at home.
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@Greyparrot
That's not even remotely true. The number of deaths caused by police on compliant unarmed people can be counted on one hand out of billions of encounters.
oh i'm sure that is true. because after a cop kills them, they were "resisting arrest". Even in this case the cops said he was resisting when video proves he wasn't. I'm sure there are very few cases where a cop would admit he killed someone who was compliant and unarmed.
There isn't anything "fundamentally" wrong with the police system, or it would be far more than a handful out of billions of encounters and interactions.
i've already established above why this "stat" is irrelevant. But I will add to it that it is not limited to murder. Police are much more likely to harass, assault, or arrest without cause a black person than a white person. They don't have to straight up murder someone for it to be racism.
If anything, the police system has become much less authoritative and less willing to engage criminals, as we saw with the mass stand-down orders from every Democrat leader.
ok. so political leaders in some places ordered the cops not to attack people. That doesnt say anything about whether or not there is systemic racism in the police.
The very real problem is with people using a handful of those bad cops to incite riots to fundamentally change the country into a collection of warring tribal states based on skin shade and country of origin.
so, black people who want the same rights that white people have are try to "change the country into a collection of warring tribal states based on skin shade and country of origin"? That doesn't even make any sense. Black people want to be able to go about their lives without being harassed by police. They want to be able to interact with the police without the inherent threat of immediate and overwhelming violence because a cop felt like it. White people have that.
Let's assume you think there is something fundamentally wrong with the police system. What exactly would you change?
I don't pretend to have all the answers. But for starters we need much stricter punishments for cops who break the rules. we need mass firings of police who have records of abuse. Because if you have a record of abuse in a system that turns a blind eye to it, you are probably really bad. We need to strip out the command structure of police in areas that are particularly bad. Any area where these issues happen, commanders should either be coming down hard on the violators or the commanders are fired.
These are just ideas of course. But the point is that the police have a culture of protecting their own and being above the law. That needs to be broken. And minor changes to policy or personnel won't cut it as long as the underlying culture survives.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
they never promoted or informed the public in any meaningful way about wearing masks during flu season have they?
what is your point? I don't see how your question is relevant to what we are talking about.
anyone who has u.r.i. symptoms should be encouraged and voluntarily wear a mask if they are able.
has anyone ever told them not to? again, what is your point?
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@Alec
So your saying the punishment for murder should only be a few years in jail?
i didn't say how many years in jail, that isn't my point.
Poverty would barely exist if it wasn't for Lyndon B Johnson's war on poverty, which caused people to become dependent on the government.
lol so poverty didn't exist until the government declared war on it? Do you realize how silly that sounds?
Murderers and rapists don't deserve human rights. They denied their victims human rights, they deserve the same treatment.
you are using a contradiction in terms. You say humans don't deserve human rights. Either they are human rights (ie all humans have them) or they aren't. You can't pick and choose which humans are worthy of them.
They sorted people based off of race or religion, things that who cares if your black and/or jewish. Being a rapist or a murderer are like the worst things you can do in society. They therefore deserve to be punished more.
no one has ever argued that murderers shouldn't be punished.
ok, you are now moving beyond the who "public good" aspect of the evil and want to directly profit off of chopping human beings into spare parts. how are you not seeing the cartoonishly evil aspects of this plan?Because ... it saves innocent people.
ok. if the US government took every single gun in america away it would save countless lives. If they took ever single car away, it would save countless lives. Just because something saves lives doesn't make it good. The nazi's would have argued that killing the jews would save the world from wars the jews started. They could make horrible fake moral arguments too.
Why does the left advocate for sympathizing and rehabilitating criminals so much?because they are humans.So what?
so humans have human rights. That is why they are human rights.
the US has highest imprisoned population per capita in the world by a sizable marginThis is because of the drug war, which too has failed. I want the drug war to end. But rapists and murderers don't deserve freedom and they are rare enough to make this possible.
they don't have freedoms, that is what prisons are for. They do have rights though. And i'm pretty sure the constitution includes are rule about cruel or unusual punishment.
I don't want rapists and murderers to have human rights.
then you don't believe that anyone has human rights. Either everyone has human rights, or no one does. If you can decide that people don't have them, then that de facto makes them government provided rights, not human rights.
Your technically a clump of cells too. What separates a human from a cancer cell is if the cells are specialized.
this isn't a discussion about abortion and i dont want to get into one. but short version is that a murderer is still a person, a fetus is not.
The left cares about the poor.Then the WoP would have been overturned decades ago.
No one on the left has held power in decades. both republican and democrat establishment are right wing economically.
A policy I call, "Find and grind" meaning we show low income people where they can get good jobs that only require a high school degree, we loosen the regulations on businesses so poor people have more incentive to start a small business that hopefully grows and hires more good paying jobs, and poverty is virtually gone in less than a decade.
gotcha, your plan is "capitalism will magically make everything better" even though history proves that it won't. Unregulated capitalism fuels poverty, it doesn't help it. You only have to look at what the labor market looked like before governments started regulating it. Workers were basically just meat to be used up and discarded for profit. If they died, so be it. They just hired more. And since everyone treated their workers like that, competition drove worker pay and safety standards down, not up, in an attempt to cut costs.
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@Greyparrot
Orangemanbad can do it because he has the power of Orange.
no. he's too stupid to pull it off. The only way he succeeds in becoming the dictator he wants to be is if his cult followers fight to destroy democracy. And there is the very real threat they will do that.
I know it's easier to blow off the whole situation and describe all of white skinned police officers as violent thugs
when did I, or anyone else, say that all white skinned police officers are violent thugs? Going strong on the straw man arguments today.
but the reason the situation is so bad is because that is exactly what people on the left have been doing for years.
no one is doing that. They are saying there is systemic racism, not that all white cops are violent thugs.
They point to some bad actors and ignore the problem of systemic tribal divisions in the country based on skin shade created and promoted by actors that would see the country dismantled. America has plenty of enemies within and without..
the problem isn't just a few bad actors. If it were then when these incidents occurred they would be getting punished for it and the bad actors would quickly be out of a job. But that isn't what generally happens. most of the time the system closes ranks around the cops committing the crimes and prevent justice from being done. That is why the issue is so bad, they get away with this sort of behavior for years and end up training more cops who learn that this behavior is acceptable. Take this specific guy who just committed murder, he had 18 complaints filed with the internal affairs department in 18 years on the force. He never received any kind of significant punishment until he literally murdered someone.
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@Greyparrot
Plot Twist, Trump secretly funds Antifa to start riots, just so he can become an authoritarian dictator.
well he does really want to be an authoritarian dictator. but history has proven he is far too stupid to be able to secretly fund a group and not have people find out. he can't even fund a porn star without it leaking.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
ok, your own quote says that it is unknown if surgical masks are effective against covid so I fail to see how this is useful.
huh, makes you wonder why masks were never recommended during flu seasons....
because people wouldn't wear them. people are throwing an absolute fit over wearing them now for a disease that is 6-30 times deadlier than the flu. Do you really think people would wear them for the flu?
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@Greyparrot
Fundamentally changing the country, one Nike store at a time.
you seem to think that the looters and protesters are the same people, they are not. one group is looking to protest and better their situation and the country's. The other is looking to steal stuff and destroy things under the cover of the protests. I know it's easier to blow off the whole situation and describe all of them as violent thugs, but the reason the situation is so bad is because that is exactly what people have been doing for year. They point to some bad actors and ignore the problem.
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@ResurgetExFavilla
Hard data is hard to find, but the chart in this https://time.com/5823983/coronavirus-ppe-shortage/ shows that a majority of facilities in the US had at least a week's supply.
i'm looking at your source and it seems to contradict you. look at that 1st graph. It says 20% of hospitals have no supply of masks. 41% have less than a week's worth. only 11% of respondents had enough supplies to last more than 2 weeks. That seems like an extremely critical shortage.
The US has the manufacturing capacity and technical expertise to increase production by switching over product lines, many countries do not.
ok, but at present hospitals cannot guarantee they can provide their employees with protective equipment. Until that is resolved it is irresponsible to get people who should be staying inside to buy up the masks they need.
The USA is also the largest consumer market in the world, is immensely wealthy, and so can throw its weight around in the now strangled global PPE market.
There is a worldwide shortage of masks. Everyone needs them, everyone is short of them. Are you arguing that america should buy up all the masks in the world so that average people can wear them (incorrectly) for probably no benefit while doctors in other countries die due to not being able to get medical equipment?
These smaller, more poor countries are very much reliant on supplies from international organizations like the WHO or UNICEF, and so their unique situation warrants intense rationing. The US, relatively, is in a much better condition, and so can apply a different standard.
but your own source says that 61% of hospitals have less than 1 week's worth of supplies. that is a critical shortage. rationing is very much warrented.
There are masks which have much stricter protocols for use and which are meant to protect you by filtering out viral particles. These are typically fitted products, are expensive, and should be retained for medical professionals and first responders. Homemade masks, or even surgical masks, will do nothing to protect you personally from the virus; the weave is not tight enough to filter out the causative agent.
I don't believe this article is about homemade masks. It appeared to be about medical masks like n95 masks. I'm not sure if the WHO has an official recommendation about that.
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@sadolite
I'm guessing you are one of those mask Nazi's and like to play dumb by saying what other virus's
this doesn't appear to be a complete sentence. I don't know what you are saying.
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@RationalMadman
ok, but the underlying problem is systemic racism. Black people get treated as 2nd class citizens at best, both by society at large but especially by the police. there have been lots of attempts to protest this that go completely ignored (both by republicans and by democrats). So people have learned that peacefully protesting is useless and the only way to get attention to the issue is violence. And since the police have been actively making things worse (attacking peaceful protesters, arresting or shooting journalists) they are only making the problem worse and proving the protesters are right. The police have become militarized and see themselves as above the laws they are enforcing.
what other option do you think the protesters have?
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@Alec
If there is no punishment for a crime, then it is done very frequently. Don't mean to straw man you, but your going to have to draw a line eventually as to how harshly to punish murderers and rapists.
you say you don't mean to straw man me, as you are straw manning me....
But the severity of the punishment does not correlate very well to whether or not someone commits a crime. the punishment needs to be strong enough that people wouldn't want it to happen to them. (like a few years in jail). But making punishments more and more severe beyond that are counter productive. It is far more effective to go after the underlying reasons the crimes were committed, like fighting poverty and providing better education.
rich rapists are supposed to be punished now, usually they aren't. So massively increasing how badly you treat people who actually get convicted has no effect on rich people because they don't usually get charged, let alone convicted.So then charge the rich rapists.
They are protected by a corrupt system. I haven't seen anything in your proposal that addresses that.
chopping someone up into parts because you don't see them as having any value. That is straight up evilWhy? They're dead when its being done to them.
ok. so you are now having the government murdering people and chopping them into parts for your own benefit. That is pretty much the darkest sort of dystopia I can imagine.
They thought the jews had no value and were detrimental to society, so it was perfectly fine to run experiments on them, work them to death etc.There is a moral difference between being Jewish and being a murderer or rapist.
You are making a blanket statement that everyone in a certain category, their lives have no value and you can do whatever you want to them. That is precisely the logic used by slavers, nazi's etc.
The women want justice for the rapes done to them.
there is a HUGE difference between justice and farming humans for meat.
If we take the rapist's blood, we can sell it to other domestic or foreign hospitals, get some money or assets for the blood we sold, if necessary convert that to cash by selling it to another company, and with that cash, partially fund a UBI for rape victims, paid for by the rapist's blood.
ok, you are now moving beyond the who "public good" aspect of the evil and want to directly profit off of chopping human beings into spare parts. how are you not seeing the cartoonishly evil aspects of this plan?
Why does the left advocate for sympathizing and rehabilitating criminals so much?
because they are humans. and because it is far more effective. the US has highest imprisoned population per capita in the world by a sizable margin. but it hasn't magically fixed crime. locking them up forever doesn't fix the problem because it doesn't prevent crime. It does however create a massive expense in housing and feeding huge numbers of people.
It seems though as if they have a bleeding heart for everyone, including literal killers and rapists, while pretending to be pro women at the same time because they believe in killing unwanted unborn babies..
if you think that upholding human rights is a "bleeding heart", then you clearly do not give a shit if people have human rights.
The left sympathizes with rapists more than they do with the unborn, even though unlike the rapist, the unborn is not a felon.
Let me translate. The left sympathizes with human beings more than a clump of cells (which is not a human being).
This is slightly off topic, but the left cares about the poor votes, not the poor folks.
no, you are incorrect. The left cares about the poor. The democratic party establishment only cares about the poor votes. The democratic party establishment are mostly right wing (economically).
If they cared about poor people, they would have overturned the socialist war on poverty a long time ago since it failed its only goal; to get people out of poverty.
and replaced it with what? throwing people out on the streets to die? Or more likely imprisoning them, the good republican way?
The left however has a fetish for keeping people dependent on the government, so they want people to stay poor so they can vote for democrats.
again, you are confusing "left" and "democratic party". They are not the same thing. The people who run the democratic party are not left, they are right of center on economic policy.
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@Athias
No, he really isn't. Dislike of Trump informs neither his capacity nor his competence.
no, his failure to accomplish anything useful informs his capacity and his competence.
How much of his abilities as a businessman are you familiar with? Do you have intimate information on his practices?
about how he was handed a fortune by his father? About how he ran a number of businesses into the ground? About how most of his businesses are now run by other people and he largely just trades on the brand name he managed to make out of his name?
Trump was basically washed up before the apprentice. He got onto that show because real business men had better things to do than be on some TV show, so the show creator turned to trump. That show managed to convince people that he actually knew something about business. He then built a business around that false impression by selling on his name. The same way he sold on that name and belief that he was competent to run for president.
He's a talented con man.Well... he is a politician.
no, he's a con man whose con got out in front of him. He wanted to run for president to pump up the name recognition of his brand. He didn't intend to win, he intended to do the only thing he cares about, make himself richer and more famous.
but an absolute garbage president.All presidents are or have been underwhelming. Trump no more than the others.
trump has accomplished extremely little in office. He is a really shitty president.
But again, his ability to con people into believing in him does not mean he is a powerful president. His inability to get anything done proves he is inept and ineffective.What hasn't he got done?
What has he got done? He hasn't accomplished anything to do with globalization. He hasn't ended wars. He did manage a tax cut, but it was 99% for the rich and corporations, so not exactly a huge success for most americans. He has succeeded in ballooning the deficit (that the right loves to pretend they care about when democrats are in office, oddly silent about it now). So tell me, what has he accomplished?
You mean that conversation with Billy Bush where Trump states that his stardom would give him discretion to grab women by the pussy. Are you forgetting that he also stated in that conversation that the women would "let him do it"?
i believe his statement was "you know I'm automatically attracted to beautiful—I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything. Grab 'em by the pussy. You can do anything."
He "doesn't even wait". he just kisses them and grabs them. This is sexual assault. And just because they "let you do it" doesn't mean it isn't sexual assault. if you didn't get consent (which he pretty explicitly says he doesn't bother with) then it is sexual assault. Given his numerous sexaul assault allegations, and creepy history (like walking into beauty pageant changing rooms) he isn't even trying to hide the fact that he is a sexual predator. So he really doesn't have any kind of moral high road over other sexual predators.
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@sadolite
No one gave a shit about all the other just as deadly viruses, why do they care now?
what viruses would those be exactly? The reason that corona is so bad is that it is quite deadly, but also spreads extremely easily. There are lots of other diseases that are more deadly, but their extreme symptoms tend to make them obvious which makes containing them much easier.
Corona virus is about 100th on the list of things that could kill me tomorrow.
given that you have made it clear you do not take the proper precautions and that you appear to be in an age bracket which would put you at increased risk of death, I'd say it is much higher on your list than you seem to think is.
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@Greyparrot
It's flawed because the government was in charge.
those two things are in no way correlated. private businesses fuck things up all the time. Pretty much constantly. The idea that anything the government does is somehow bad is stupid and childish.
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@ResurgetExFavilla
We have a good supply in the US now,
do you have any sources that confirm this? I have heard there are critical shortages among medical professionals. If this is not true please provide a source.
If they told people that masks worked everyone would go out and buy them in those countries.
in the article linked, they aren't saying people shouldn't wear masks. They said there isn't conclusive proof they help and that when medical professionals are critically short, they need to get priority access to them. I have seen lots of people lately using masks wrong and touching their face anyway. I don't find it hard to believe that they may not be very effective for the average person who can't/won't use them properly.
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@Vader
Can't prevent a disease if there is no vaccine. You can't just stop an extremely contagious disease from spreading
ok, what does this have to do with what we were talking about? We were discussing how Covid is way more dangerous and deadly than the flu.
also, yes you can. Thats what the world has been doing the last few months.
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@Greyparrot
I don't think you understand how Marxism works.
i do. and there is virtually one in america who advocates marxism. certainly not me. Which would lead me to believe it is you that does not know what marxism is.
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@Athias
Donald Trump is by no means "inept."
he really, really is.
Don't let the simple manner of his speech and his brash demeanor fool you. He understands his base very well, and he's pandering to them.
true. he's a bit of an idiot savant at salesmanship. He's a talented con man. but an absolute garbage president.
The very same people who said he was too idiotic to "win" the presidency (although, in reality he was "selected,") are the same people who have had egg on their faces since November 2016.
even he didn't think he was going to win. he was doing it in order to make money and pump up his brand. But again, his ability to con people into believing in him does not mean he is a powerful president. His inability to get anything done proves he is inept and ineffective.
And to his credit, the minutia of his stance against child-sex trafficking is by far more substantial than these pedophile politicians boast. That fact, unfortunately, loses to the "fake news."
i have no idea what you are trying to argue here. Are you trying to say that trump (an admitted sexual assaulter) is somehow morally superior to people who commit other sex crimes?
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@Alec
Its not and you can say the same thing with being less tough on crime. If we rahab serious felons, how long would it take before they only get a slap on the wrist for a murder or rape and commit the crime again?
the evidence suggests that being "tough on crime" is ineffective anyway. if people thought they were going to get caught, they wouldn't do it. so putting a super harsh punishment for a crime they don't think they will get caught committed is actually counter productive.
Historically the law has been used by the rich to punish the poor and protect their own powerRich rapists would get punished the same way a poor rapist would under my rules.
rich rapists are supposed to be punished now, usually they aren't. So massively increasing how badly you treat people who actually get convicted has no effect on rich people because they don't usually get charged, let alone convicted.
Saving people's lives by using rapist's and murderer's blood is not evil. It's utilitarian.
chopping someone up into parts because you don't see them as having any value. That is straight up evil. That is nazi levels of evil. They thought the jews had no value and were detrimental to society, so it was perfectly fine to run experiments on them, work them to death etc. You are proposing the same sort of thing.
Also, it's not very pro women to sympathize with rapists.
Making ourselves into inhuman monsters doesn't help women.
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@Greyparrot
those are almost a contradiction of terms, "rich", "conservative" and "don't rely on suppressing minorities". The rich become the rich by leaching wealth away from the poor.Thank you for demonstrating your level of Marxist mastery. You must be among the highly indoctrinated.
you think that understanding that rich want to get richer makes me a marxist? I'm not sure you understand how capitalism works.
"don't believe science, they're stupid"They don't actually say that. They say don't believe crony scientists in authoritative power because they are systemically corrupt.
bottom line, the right systematically chooses to ignore any science, or facts that don't reinforce what they want to believe. they only see what they want to see, and reality be damned.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
well I disagree, since government makes laws and police policy they are very much related.
in the same way that you are related to the farmer that grew your food. that doesn't make you a farmer. So comparing you is likely not particularly relevant.
so you don't believe in elections and the process, well not much else to say then I guess.
elections are important in positions that determine policy and what the law is. elections are not important in positions of upholding the law. they should answer to elected officials, but having police directly elected, simply opens up more avenues for corruption.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
that is actually incorrect, in mismatched years the flu vaccine still offers SOME benefit, often when people get the flu even though they received the flu vaccine they don't get AS sick as they would have otherwise. They don't prevent the spread of the disease, the vaccine stimulates the body to produce antibodies to the virus much like the hepatitis and other vaccines.
i know, but I'm struggling to get him to understand even the most basic terms. I have no intention of trying to explain something more complicated.
So in a way having the vaccine could make you an asymptomatic carrier potentially. Have you ever been told or heard not to share drink containers etc during cold and flu season? That's partly because of asymptomatic people.
true. few things in life are simple. however after repeating the same basic point to him over and over and have him completely not understand it, I fail to see the point in trying to explain more detail. I'm trying to get across that covid is much deadlier that the flu and he is totally not getting it.
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@ILikePie5
Take biology class brother. Good day.
i'm sorry, but I can't explain it to you in simpler terms than that.
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@ILikePie5
You really need to go back to biology class homie and understand how viruses work. I can’t debate you unless you have studied and understand the biology beyond viruses.
i'm going to try to simplify this for you. there are 2 concepts here. there is how far the virus spreads, and there is how deadly the disease once it spreads. Vaccines prevent the spread of the disease. They slow down or inhibit this so that it affects less people. That is a very good thing. But it does absolutely nothing to affect how deadly the disease is once someone has it.
Covid kills a much higher percentage of the people who catch it. that makes it's mortality rate much higher. That combined with how easily it spreads, makes it a much, much more dangerous disease than the flu.
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@Greyparrot
There are plenty of rich conservatives living in the suburbs that don't rely on suppressing minorities for a quick buck.
those are almost a contradiction of terms, "rich", "conservative" and "don't rely on suppressing minorities". The rich become the rich by leaching wealth away from the poor.
Most urbanites are so heavily highly indoctrinated with state propaganda that they cheered Cortez for destroying jobs and prosperity.
lol, yes that damn education indoctrinates people by teaching them actual facts. life would be so much simpler if people just didn't learn things and did as they were told.
In fact, there are zero scientific reasons for most of the government programs, yet they get away with the "follow the science" bullshit because state indoctrination has fooled the highly indoctrinated to believe authority = science.
and there is that "don't believe science, they're stupid" mentality that shows how intellectually devoid right wing ideology has become.
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@ILikePie5
TL;DR Vaccine reduces chances of infection, therefore less people get infected and less people die. The Flu isn’t novel and Americans have some immunity against it.
you're missing my point yet again. you are describing something that changes how many people will get a disease and then confusing it as something that effects the mortality rate of the disease. it doesn't matter how many people get the flu, the mortality rate of it stays pretty much the same. the mortality rate of Covid is much higher than that of the flu. if we hadn't gone into lock down to prevent the spread, covid would have killed potentially millions of people. if every single person in america got the flu, it wouldn't kill nearly that many people.
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
that doesn't even make sense. The police and congress are 2 very separate entities.really? hmm you were talking about how the police cover for each other and investigate each other thus a conflict of interest, you don't think Congress and the Senate do that too?
I didn't say the senate can't do the same thing. But that isn't related to what we are talking about.
what unconstitutional orders?plenty of orders have been overturned etc, you should have no problem finding some and catching up to date.
I'm not doing research for you. If you can't tell me what you are talking about, i will just assume you don't know what you are talking about.
ok, but without those "people with guns" to enforce the laws, society fails to function, crime runs rampantsure I'll bet there was very little citizen crime in nazi germany and some were content to live like that, would you?
no, but would you want to live in london in the late 1700's when people had to walk the streets armed all the time because without any professional police, crime was pretty much everywhere? We obviously need professional police, and we obviously need oversight to keep them in line.
really? you don't think people who vote for others who will be just and fair? you don't seem to know much about this but it's not a permanent position, they have to be re-elected. electing people who would uphold the constitution and protect rights is a terrible plan, wow, you'd love a police state apparently, but then bitch they are so ruthless.
why do you think making it an elected position means they want to uphold the constitution? It just means they got people to vote for them. Typically, winning an election means you need money. If you need money, that breeds corruption. Not to mention it incentivizes the police to do what is popular, not necessarily what is legal.
except for the bad trade deals, though I fail to see how all this time globalism hasn't helped black unemployment then a non globalist is elected and the black unemployment breaks records, but just be luck huh.
lol why would you think those things are related. trump has done absolutely nothing that has reversed globalization. you are giving trump credit for the end result of trends that began under Obama.
lol Bernie Sanders who never had a job in his life and became a millionaire being a "public servant" um no thanks.We need term limits, far better accounting and oversight.
I don't disagree with term limits or better accounting and oversight. totally on board with that. But we need politicans who aren't bought and paid for. almost all politicians today rely on corporations and billionaires to give them money to get elected. Once they get elected, the issues they pay attention to are the ones their donors care about. Bernie sanders doesnt take money from super pacs. the only people he listens to are the constituents, not the big money donors. Whether or not you agree with his policies, I don't see how you could disagree that that is a good thing.
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