Total posts: 17,895
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@Greyparrot
Every time I bring up the Michael Flynn case it’s Russia to my liberal buddies they just ignore it saying the investigation was justified when Obama officials are on record under oath saying they knew no such thing. The Steele Dossier was fake. The Carter Page warrant was fake. But ya the Russia investigation which showed no collusion was justified because Mueller didn’t come to a conclusion whether Trump obstructed justice for an investigation that showed he didn’t collude.
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@Greyparrot
There’s more coming from Durham for sure.
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@Greyparrot
I still remember the day Trump said he was spied on and everyone was like wtf he’s lying.
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Crickets from Joe Biden and Kamala Harris
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@Barney
He’s probably trolling. A one for one trade benefits town anyways. If Supa was scum why would he claim cop, out one of his buddies that he doesn’t know, not to mention a good player. It has to be between Speed and Disc.
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@Dr.Franklin
150 million!not good
Yup it’s unfortunate
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@Greyparrot
Gated community is where it is at.
😂😂
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@Greyparrot
Nah, white liberals are getting canceled too as collateral damage in the quest for "equality."
Well I’m moving into a place where 150 million was just defunded from the cops. Rip
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@Greyparrot
At least racism against Blacks in a hypercritical cancel culture is absolutely on the decline. Being white is apparantly not OK so much anymore though.
Being a white liberal is ok. Just not a white conservative
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@Greyparrot
So that strategy is off the table, at least until after Nov 3.
After he wins there’s gonna he a rude awakening for the warhawks. He’s already starting to move troops to an extent. By the end of the second Id be willing to bet a vast majority are out. Peace in Afghanistan ideally. Peace between Israel and the Arabs.
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But anyways I’m not going to argue this with you anymore. There are way too many factors involved for anyone to accurately gauge systematic racism. Racism is and has been on a decline since the 60s. Eventually it’ll likely be gone. These things take time.
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@Trent0405
Basically every meta analysis I've seen has controlled for the methodology of the studies used in the meta analysis. For instance in this case my meta analysis stated that all studies must have "sufficient information to calculate effect sizes for at least one operationalization of shooter bias was included in the paper."Also, if black cops shoot black men a lot that doesn't debunk systemic racism. Just because judges tend to be male for instance doesn't mean that there isn't any sexism in the courts against men.
But that’s not how it works lol. If one paper says this factor proves racism and another says another factor proves it, you can’t combine both and say oh racism exists because of these factors, since you you don’t know the effects of the factors on each other.
And it does debunk it. If white cops and black cops shoot black people at the same then how does it show racism exists? Do black people think they’re superior than other black people?
I didn't find anything, best I could do was find the total number of participants(3427).
Well, race matters since the entire conversation is about race lol.
The way you tried to debunk systemic racism was by comparing black women to white men, that means the variable of sex is now not being accounted for. But if you compare apples to apples then black people are 20.4% worse off. Also, it's not just race alone, that's why the study accounted for things like age, education, citizenship, weapon possession and prior criminal history. We want to see if race plays some role, and the facts suggest it does.
But that’s not what systematic racism is lol. Systematic racism doesn’t account for sex, education, etc. White people should get lesser sentences than black people. Period. If race was a factor larger than sex than black women wouldn’t get smaller sentences than white men. You’re admitting that systematic sexism is a much larger problem than systematic racism which doesn’t exist.
Sure, this is why we examine the data in proportion to their criminality.(Not quite sure what you're getting at)
You don’t understand. The proportion will always be against whites because the searches are done on blacks more because they commit more crime lol. If I search 1000 blacks and 500 have something illegal, compared to 1000 whites and 250 have something illegal, I’m going to search more blacks than whites at 2x the rate which decreases the success chances of actually finding contraband because I’m simply searching more blacks. It’s the reason why stop and frisk was so effective. It disproportionately targeted blacks, a lot of whom were innocent but it decreased crime by a mile.
I'm not saying cops are trying to be racist, I'm just saying that they have subtle biases that should be recognized and that these biases are born out in basically every piece of data I see. Also, I think stopping black people more isn't racist but stopping them more in proportion to the amount of crime they commit is racist. Say that in this Area 40% of all crime was committed by black people, well then if 40% of the people I pull over are black then we will see no bias against black people. But if I pull over 60% black people then that is racist. We observe black people getting pulled over more in proportion too the crime they commit.(Also not quite sure what you're getting at)
That’s misleading. You don’t just pull over blacks at a 40% rate. That would actually make it racist if you always stop only a certain percentage of population lol. And the 40% number is inaccurate in the first place when the numbers are above 50% statistically for almost all violent crime, despite being 13% of the population. Because they commit more crime nationally, you’d expect there are more police interactions with black people than white people. Also given this it’s obviously more likely black people are disproportionately targeted. It has everything to do with the disproportionate amount of crime. If your analogy said 60% of the population is black but it accounts for 90% of crime, would you stop only 60% percent or more?
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@Greyparrot
In school you are taught to only have one independent variable because have more than one can misrepresent the results coming with the dependent variable.
This is the same thing going on here. The studies use one factor and determine the effects. Then they use another factor and determine the effects. In the end they combine all those to say systematic racism exists which is a terrible conclusion because you can’t determine how each independent variable affects the other.
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@Trent0405
Well this was comprised of 42 separate studies that I don't honestly feel like analyzing in depth individually. A meta analysis though will generally be rather large as it seek to form a consensus amongst academics. I feel like this is a rather unfair burden to place on me, I think after I provide the data it's on you to find a flaw in it, not on me to account for potential flaws that may or may not exist.
I did point the flaw. Not all the studies account for the same factors. They don’t account for other factors as well. You need to provide the methodology of the meta analysis study, cause if there’s no discrepancy between a white cop shooting a black man and black cop shooting a black man then there is no systematic racism. Does your study provide the races of the participants?
Your adding the variable of gender, if you isolate for race then we see a bias. Meaning that in order to debunk systemic racism you need to add in external factors.
I never added anything. Your study did. Systematic racism implies action based on race and race alone which your study doesn’t support as half of the black population will get a smaller sentence than half of the white population when it should be white getting less in all situations or at least a vast majority.
Limited environment? it was conducted across the entire country. Also, why is the search rate going to be higher if they are just as likely to carry contraband. Also, obviously it is impossible to fully account for all variables but this is the single best piece of data we have, an analysis of 95 million police stops is bound to have one blemishes, but all we can do is work off of the data available, and it seems like almost all researchers come to the conclusion that systemic racism is present in law enforcement. Also, keep in mind that this is not an appeal to authority fallacy as I'm appealing to experts in the field.
You’re missing the point lol. In a black neighborhood, both white and black cops are more likely to suspect black people than white people. It’s the same if the neighborhood was white — they’re more likely to suspect white people. The majority of cop interactions were with black people because black people commit the most crime disproportionately. The researchers come to conclusions without accounting for all the factors. They’re bound to be wrong and they are wrong. The vast majority of cops don’t go out every just looking for black people to catch and arrest. Facts depend on environment. If in my area black people are more likely to commit crime, I’m going to stop more black people than white people and I’m going to search more black people than white people. Consequently there are going to be more cases where searches on blacks don’t result in anything because I searched more blacks in the process.
I just looked, they don't account for plea agreements BUT systemic racism in plea deals has also been observed. So this further shows the bias of the courts.Also they didn't include this factor because ..."" the Commission had no data regarding which offenders were offered the opportunity to accept a plea bargain but declined.""Again we have to work off of what data is avalible to form the best and most objective opinion possible.
Blacks are more likely to commit crime than whites after finishing their sentence. That’s a good argument for prosecutors to use. But again it’s a case by case basis. White people are more likely to have families, etc compared to black people.
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@Trent0405
I did show that my study accounted for criminal history, grey just thought that they may have accounted for it improperly. It's not on me to show that the study calculated something correctly.
Did they account for plea bargains? And yes it is. You’re putting forth the study, so you’re accountable for it. If it doesn’t account for something to your knowledge then it’s a misleading study.
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@Trent0405
The onus is on you to prove they messed it up somehow.
You’re the one claiming systematic racism exists. It’s your job to prove why the study you show demonstrates. If there’s no proof that they didn’t account for the factors Greyparrot mentions then your study is inherently flawed especially if you agree those factors can cause bias.
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@Trent0405
This is the same study in post 1, look at the titles. The study clearly states ""Our results indicated that relative to White targets, participants were quicker to shoot armed Black targets (dav = −.13, 95% CI [−.19, −.06]), slower to not shoot unarmed Black targets (dav = .11, 95% CI [.05, .18)."" even when controlling for whether they were armed or not the gap persisted.
It was a meta-analyzed study time begin with. How many of the participants were black? How many were white? Do black cops shoot black people at the same rates as whites? As I mentioned, there are a plethora of factors involved which studies don’t account for especially since this study was meta analyzed.
Systemic sexism is a big problem for me, but so is systemic racism....
But systematic racism isn’t a problem because black women don’t get longer sentences than white males. If systematic racism existed black women would have longer sentences than white males. Your problem here is systematic sexism not racism. The evidence points to the former not the latter.
They do look at the odds that they did something illegal. If you read the full study you'll see it state that the 'hit rate' for contraband was accounted for, use crtl f 'hit rate' if you wish. Even with the hit and search rate accounted for, racism is still detected.
From the first control F search: “therefore, when possible, we exclude non-discretionary searches, such as vehicle impound searches and searches incident to arrest.” So no, they don’t factor in arrests.
And even then, they don’t mention violent crime. Having contraband isn’t a violent crime. Not to mention the study was conducted in a limited environment. Of course the search rate for blacks is going to be higher in black neighborhoods. As I said, there are factors that each study ignores because there are simply too many variables in a determination. Factor in that each case is different irl and in a controlled environment, you get significant discrepancies.
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@Trent0405
They are shooting them more in disproportionately white areas, even when accounting for the percentage of nonwhite citizens the false alarm rate, shooting sensitivity or reaction time for no gun trials. I will admit that accounting for this did reduce the shooting threshold gap by a lot
And how many of those black men had weapons? It’s seems as though every time you point to a study it leaves out a key aspect of what causes the shootings in the first place.
There is systemic sexism and basically all of the data I've seen suggests that the disparity between the sexes in the courts are far greater than the disparity between the races. Also, if the study is inconclusive why did they say ""The Commission found that sentence length continues to be associated with some demographic factors, in particular race and gender"" in their conclusion? This quote states that race was at least playing some part, that was the end finding, they certainly weren't unsure if race played a role or not.
You’re just proving my point. The case for systematic sexism against men is much much stronger than systematic racism against blacks. So why is systematic sexism not as big of a problem to you? Every court case is a case by case basis. Women are more likely to be given the benefit of the doubt because they care for children which is a common tactic used in pleading sentences. There are just so many other factors that contribute to the decisions of sentencing.
When I say African Americans are discriminated against I mean that they are discriminated against in proportion to the amount of crime they commit. Just think about it, do you believe that a massive analysis like this would leave out such a clear and powerful factor?
Yes they would and they are. There’s no mention of any talk of disproportionate crime. If anything, it’s common sense police interactions are higher with black people. Black people are more likely to get shot because they are more likely to have a weapon. All of this matters. Cops are killed by black males 18x or something like that than vice versa and that’s including justified shootings.
The key point is that systematic racism implies black people regardless of their sex are targeted just for the color of their skin when we know that isn’t true. Of course there will be pockets around the nation but compared to 1960, there’s far far less.
There’s no coordinated effort nationwide to target black people just cause they’re black.
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@Trent0405
If we look at an analysis of 42 studies, there is clearly bias against African Americans in police shootings. This held up for both armed and unarmed criminals.
African Americans disproportionately commit more crime. Police shootings generally occur in areas where the black population is high. Systematic racism would imply cops are shooting black people in disproportionately white areas.
I think this one is pretty clear, an analysis of 95 million police stops demonstrated that African Americans were pulled over significantly more than white people. The researchers further found that the disparity shrunk at night time, supposedly this is because it is harder to identify the race of a driver at night.
Black people disproportionately commit more crime than whites especially against other blacks. Obviously police encounters are higher for black people because black on black crime is the highest by a mile. Crime statistically occurs more in the day especially in big cities. The night is generally when violent offenses take place and even then black people disproportionately commit it.
Even after controlling for age, education, citizenship, weapon possession and prior criminal history among other things, racial disparities still exist in sentencing. To be specific, the study found that black people were sentenced 20.4 percent longer relative to white people in similar situations.
The study also found that women of all colors were less likely to be sentenced longer compared to white men. So is there institutional sexism as well? If there was systematic racism, blacks, whether male or female would have higher sentences than white people. At best your data is inconclusive because it points to both sides.
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@n8nrgmi
is it racist to simply point out that asians tend to be smarter than white people?
No? It’s statistically true at least in the US because of the strong family culture and support compared to whites and blacks. Affirmative Action is systematic racism against Asians.
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@Dr.Franklin
they cant appeal to the middle class working suburban citizens anymore, they have burned all bridges with them now
What type of blue collar worker sees Kamala Harris, a California liberal, and says gee she sure is a moderate
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@MisterChris
Kamala Harris: I believe Tara Reade
Also Kamala Harris: Joe Biden will support women
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@HistoryBuff
again, so we only target demcoratic mayors. We completely ignore any republicans in state of federal government who have spent decades making poor people's lives worse? Do you not see how partisan and ridiculous your argument appears to be?
You mean Andrew Cuomo and Bill de Blasio in NY
JB Pritzker and Lori Lightfoot in Illinois
Eric Garcetti and Gavin Newsome in California
Mike Duggan and Gretchen Whitmer in Michigan
Democrats has filibuster proof majorities in 2008 and they didn’t do anything. No Republicans could do anything statewide and nationwide and nothing happened. Ofc you’ll just say those weren’t real Democrats while supporting the same old Joe, who is proven to do nothing for poor people.
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So who’s planning on hammering before the day is over because it looks like Press ain’t comin
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@HistoryBuff
ok, but systemic racism fuels poverty. Poverty fuels crime. Crime fuels the murder rate. So systemic racism is still a big factor in that.
What has Lori Lightfoot done to solve poverty in Chicago
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@Username
The whole protest was over “systemic racism” in police departments. Where here do you see racism is what the thread is asking.
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@Vader
In all honesty I really liked Maya Rudolph’s impersonation of her so I’m glad I get to see the memes on SNL
Straight fax. She fo sho a “funt”😂😂
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@Vader
Rules for thee but not for me
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@Greyparrot
I saw that 3 minutes after it was posted by Trump on YouTube lol. I was dying. They are great for each other but not great for America.
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Lol Kamala is a blessing to Trump. So many things to attack both of them on now. How does Joe appeal to white working class voters with a California liberal
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@Crocodile
why do i always get lynched or die first dp :(why have i been town always except for once.if i'm scum 5 times in a row that's pure luck.Let's see, every single mafia game you have decided to lynch me or lead a bandwagon on me first dp. the only one you didn't, I was scum.So....think about it, i don't wanna die :(
If you’re town you helped us catch scum. You should be proud of yourself
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If there’s a Jester soak it up to bastard. Not much we can do about it
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Yo this should be an easy lynch. If Croc is Vanilla we don’t lose much and catch scum in return. Let’s get on with it
VTL Croc
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@Barney
@Discipulus_Didicit
We’re waiting for Croc to full claim and then we can proceed.
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@Greyparrot
That's their main purpose, yes.
The same one funded by Iran and wants total Palestinian occupation right?
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@Greyparrot
The same Hezbollah that wants to abolish Israel right?
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@BearMan
Why are trying to guess other people’s characters?
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@Lunatic
Again, warren mentioned this is bastard in his participation, not in included roles. Also you didn't defend my argument that no one as scum claims millers and gets away with it. And the one time someone (me) did it, it technically failed since I was CC'ed almost immediately, further adding to the point that millers are commonplace in games these days.
Just because it doesn’t happen doesn’t mean it can’t exist. I’m policy lynching millers if there’s no suitable lynches.
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I’m rewatching CNN’s 2016 Election Night Coverage. It’s beautiful lol
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@Lunatic
When is the last time you've seen a fake miller claim, besides the one where I got CC'ed in your Narcos mafia? Genuinely asking because I've missed like 3 games on here since then. Maybe fake claiming miller suddenly became an actual scum tactic in every single game since I've left, but it's generally so rare it's not even worth considering. I did it and failed lol.
Anything is possible in a bastard game
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@oromagi
It’s only if we can’t find a suitable lynch. Miller’s are negative town roles. Possibly scum. I’d prefer to not have a miller at MYLO and LYLO
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@n8nrgmi
The Social Security Act states that the government must pay the full benefits. It’s required by law until changed, so the govt is forced to go through the options I mentioned or do total social security reform via other legislation. Until the reform is done the govt will be required by law to fully pay the benefits even if it means transferring general funds to the trust fund.
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