Speedrace

I've got my misgivings about Supa's claim, but I'd still like to compare it with Speed's. Since the latter has been pretty weakly active and didn't take his opportunity to claim, I'll push him.

• I meant to add that I don't like Supa's "1X" claim. 
  
• 1XROLE COP seems underpowered for a role madness game
  
• seems to be trying to match lunatic's 1XGLADIATOR but that role would be crazy unbalanced if unlimited
  
• I'd more expect and EVEN/ODD kind of dynamic for this game
  

Speed has been somewhat laying low but bandwagoned the lynch on Lunatic without justification. I have given my justification in this thread as to why and I even said in DP1 I have an FoS for aggression. Granted I don’t remember much, but still. Speed does this as scum and I have a slight scum read on him

and Speed voted with no justification. 

if lunatic normally does this i dont see how it's scummy now. i feel like oro differing from his meta and wanting to vtnl is much more scummy.

Town should have a genuine interest in solving the game; VTNL when there's been little activity, and not answering questions for how you expect the game to be solved demosntrates that you do not want to solve the game. I am led to believe that oro already has all the information about the game he needs, as scum. 

So does town. How do you suggest town win? Praying on results? People keep refusing to answer this. 

you continually ignore that even if Grey only delayed claiming for one DP it would still be a net benefit to TOWN, and that most of TOWN would buy that he delayed claiming a DEFENSIVE POWER ROLE and veered from his meta to make scum's job harder.

Why is there no one on the damn list this is shameful

That does not give him a free pass to claim protective power roles DP1. We should pressure him so we can get an idea of whether this was town Grey being wayyyy dumber than he's ever been or if he is mafia counting on "bUt hE AlWaYs ClAimS" logic. There's another possibility but I want to keep that vague. 

well, GP twice claimed that early wincon justified his TOWN.  Speed argued that Bullish would provide wincon but GP still got voted out and proved TOWN.

For the record, I was first to claim wincon in post #10

https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/5819/post-links/253471

Chris voting Bringer instead of Speed sort of makes me town read him.

Town has 2 cop roles. Scum need a powerful role to counter them (role cop is weak in utility to scum), and while Bringer was investigated innocent, him being a godfather is just about the only thing that makes sense here.

I don't buy the argument of "I'm usually active." You can have a debate tourney and still be scum

But you never scum read him and in DP1, never explicitly scum read Pie and were avoiding topics on Pie despite it having a large context

It isn't affiliation indicative thought. If you got an innocent on someone and not a guilty, why did you even say? Would you out this as a normal cop? 

That's barely a reason

1. There was a huge conversation with Pie and I about his bad reads and bandwagoning on Bringer's logic and constantly sticking to it to hunt for votes. Speed went AWOL for that entire phase, instead, shifting focus onto Greyparrot and neglecting anything with Pie. He also went AWOL in DP1 and only posted around 5 times

extend: Speed also decided to show up dp2 to push a mislynch on oromagi, but when discussions of lynching Pie were on the table, he seemed awol, despite him being active on discord

2. Speed claimed cop and then claimed vanilla to "bait" the NK. This is a scum Speed strategy. Speed will argue he does this as town, but more recently, he has used this tactic when he was scum

3. The vote count, speed was on oromagi with no justification onto being on oromagi. 

You might note the lack of CX periods. They're replaced by the ability to ask questions during debate rounds (we'll need some way for people to indicate a question without being seen if they don't want their cameras on). There are limitations there as well, though, as you can only ask questions after the first minute and before the last minute of someone's speech, and they have to take your question (usually, a brisk "not at this time" will work for questions you don't want to take).

The MG and MO speeches can add something new to the debate (maybe that's just NPDA - APDA might have a stronger rules against that), though it's generally frowned upon to add a lot, given that they're the second speeches (and especially the MO because they're part of a 13 minute bloc of speeches that the PMR will have to address in 5 and a half minutes). Still, during prep periods, I'll usually partition arguments a bit, giving more to the first speaker and something substantial (but usually small) to the second.

There may or may not be any value in a debate, depending on how the debaters seek to handle it. Usually that's topic-dependent (some scream value debate while others are more policy or fact oriented). We could talk about this a lot, but suffice it to say that I don't believe there are that many topics that are slated into one of these three categories so securely that it can't move around at all.

I saw you were wanting to do a parli debate, and I would love to be a part of one.\. I actually do it for my college, so the practice would be great. If you're still up for it, lemme know some way and maybe we can get a forum post going.

I guess I probably hurt whiteflame by mentioning the cop theory