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There is also the pragmatic issue of getting majority of town to agree on a lynch in less than a day. I'm fine with you using your power on GP or Water. But the second you have a good scum read on someone they'll NK you out of fear.
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@Greyparrot
@Bullish
@ILikePie5
@Speedrace
@WaterPhoenix
Let's NL today and get a fresh start.
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@David
@Barney
@oromagi
@Discipulus_Didicit
@Zaradi
Let's NL today and get a fresh start.
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Oh yeah. Well, I think we should decide on a lynch rather than get more claims. I don't really have a strong read on anyone, with the spillage and replacements has everything messed up.
Actually, with that in mind I'd just rather NL and do a reset next phase.
VTNL
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That's a fair point. Person who suggested it should be first to claim, lol.
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Typical Mafia behaviors:
- Voting for a person who already has a vote. (Bandwagoning)
- Voting for a person who doesn't already have a vote. (Vote splitting)
- Agreeing with a townie. (Buddying)
- Disagreeing with a townie. (Anti-Town)
- Agreeing with a mafioso. (Pro-Scum)
- Disagreeing with a mafioso. (Manufactured arguing)
- Posting too much. (Spamming)
- Posting too little. (Lurking)
- Going with the results. (Sheeping)
- Not going with the results. (Generating Confusion)
- Acting like you've acted before as Town (Hiding your scum tells)
- Not acting like you've acted before as Town (Change in behavior = change in affiliation)
- Acting like you've acted before as Mafia (Scumtell)
- Not acting live you've acted before as Scum (Hiding your scum tells again)
- Playing too good (Insider knowledge)
- Playing too bad ("He's better than this")
- Playing just average (Trying to stay below people's radar)
- Being CC'd (CC)
- Not being CC'd (Mafia given fake claims)
- Voting Town (Forcing mislynches)
- Voting Scum (Bussing)
- VTNL (Not contributing)
- Claiming too early (Too eager to seem like Town)
- Claiming too late (Trying to avoid CC)
- Being Mafia in a previous game (You're always Mafia)
- Not being Mafia in a previous game (You're due to be mafia)
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UVC
Greyparrot - 2/6 - iLikePie5, speed
Pie - 1/6 - Ragnar
Water - 4/6 - Grey, Zaradi, DD, drafterman
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VTL Water
Claims
Ragnar - Antidoter - Star Trek (bsh1) - Bajoran - Miller
DD - Geographia - Hindu - Ganesh - 1x Executioner
oromagi - Marauder - Animal Kingdom - Frog - Doctor
Bullish - SolonKR - OITNB(?) - Alex Vause(?) - Vigilante (?)
Virtuoso - 1harderthanyouthink
drafterman - Koopin
Greyparrot - Danielle
Zaradi - Endarkened Rationalist
Pie - Nymphomaniac
Unclaimed
Water
Speedrace
UVC
Greyparrot - 2/6 - iLikePie5, speed
Pie - 1/6 - Ragnar
Water - 3/6 - Grey, Zaradi, DD, drafterman
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I was looking at my first game. 24 people.
13 votes to lynch someone.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
Have drafter popcorn someone since he never got a chance to maybe?
Already on it, Cochise.
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@Bullish
Imagine if Supa and Single rolled scum together, and that's why they were so mad.
It isn't.
Anyway, we need to decide what to do with this day phase.
I don't think we have player-characters from Water, Speed, or Pie.
Let's do Pie.
VTL Pie
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He also said Pie was 100% town last game. So, I'm not sure they make grains of salt big enough to take this with.
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I want to tally up the times someone has been "town confirmed" when they weren't
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Damn, I thought I had a theory about theme, but that was just crushed.
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Claims
Ragnar - Antidoter - Star Trek (bsh1) - Bajoran - Miller
DD - Geographia - Hindu - Ganesh - 1x Executioner
oromagi - Marauder - Animal Kingdom - Frog - Doctor
Bullish - SolonKR - OITNB(?) - Alex Vause(?) - Vigilante (?)
Virtuoso - 1harderthanyouthink
drafterman - Koopin
Greyparrot - Danielle
Zaradi - Endarkened Rationalist
Unclaimed
Pie
Water
Speedrace
UVC
Oromagi - 1/6 - Bullish
Greyparrot - 2/6 - iLikePie5, speed
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@oromagi
Since you're big on mathematics precision here I just want to point out.
This:
Hickory dickory DOC!Bullish climbed up my cock.he licked my logcried, "tastes like FROG!"then splooged his shorts, hard as a rock.
Is not a full claim. It is jibberish.
This:
I am Marauder/doctor/FROG from Animal KIngdom, the very first game Archived (which is why I felt it was too obvious to reveal)
Is a full claim. And no, your character would not have made this evident. A simple google search pulled up 4 games not including the Animal Kingdom one. It would not be evident that this is the game Lunatic chose. All of your posturing was for nothing.
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I'm fine with lynching someone that refuses to cooperate with town.
If he has decided in his limited wisdom that dying is more beneficial to town than claiming then who am I to question it.
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@oromagi
Well, that's where your math+linguistics went wrong. "limited" suggests a defined sample, not a small sample. In this case, our subset is defined by the DDO archives.
Yeah, we know. So why did you decide it was necessary to point it out?
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@oromagi
This isn't a math problem, it is a linguistics problem. Necessarily there are a limited number of games no matter what the scope is because there aren't an infinite amount of games anywhere. The decision to qualify the statement with the word "limited" suggests a relatively small sample. Otherwise the statement is just a pointless observation.
You still need to claim.
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@oromagi
Limited set. lol, it's almost 300 games over the span of 7 years. It's basically all the games that ever happened on DDO.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
I see it, but am inclined to disagree.
1. Forcing people to claim a game requires more research than forcing them to claim a player. Indeed, I see no reason to fake claim a player at all unless it is a player who only played in a few games. Grey claimed Danielle. Danielle was in a ton of games. There would simply be no reason to fake claim a player.
2. Yeah, they can hand pick a game that has a lot of roles, but this isn't a problem unique to this strategy. If you have a character like Danielle or me or Lunatic or someone else that was prolific, then you that necessarily comes with a ton of roles to choose from. Consider: In even the largest of Mafia games only had 20-30 people. However, players like me were in over a hundred mafia games over the years. Claiming me presents them with more role options than picking even a huge game.
3. Locking people into games first, then players increases the possibility of a CC since games are fewer than players and players are necessarily unique. The reverse makes it less likely since a given player will have more games than a game will have players and games aren't necessarily unique.
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Official Vote Count:
Oromagi- 3/6-Bullish, drafterman, DD
Greyparrot- 2/6- iLikePie5, speed
Virtuoso- 1/6- Oro
We should continue to add votes to oro until he claims
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I think Grey gets locked into a way of thinking about the game and sticks to it to the end. Which is his way, most often as town.
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@oromagi
I only declared that claiming my character is anti-town because it will make my role obv.
That's not for you to decide. The town has chosen you to claim, so you claim. If that's antitown to do so, that is the risk that comes with the claim. But you still claim. You just don't unilaterally decide to snub town.
Also, the claim would only make your role obvious if your player was in exactly one game which is unlikely.
Still, you need to claim.
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I wonder if it would have been better to claim the games rather than the players.
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Claims
Ragnar - Antidoter - Star Trek (bsh1) - Bajoran - Miller
Bullish - SolonKR - OITNB(?) - Alex Vause(?) - Vigilante (?)
Virtuoso - 1harderthanyouthink
DD - Geographia
drafterman - Koopin
Greyparrot - Danielle
Zaradi - Endarkened Rationalist
Unclaimed
oromagi
Pie
Water
Speedrace
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I could only find three games with Endarkened in it and he was town in all of them.
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Though Anti is the player who had that role, not the character.
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@Speedrace
An archived list most mafia games is here:
There is no easy way to search for each players games, but you can come close with this google search:
"site:http://debate.org/forums/games username"
Which will return all mentions of that username in the games forum.
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You also have to factory in that Grey deliberately looks at the things people thinks are his "tells" and subverts them.
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I reread the OP:
"Mafia were encouraged to fake claim..."
This does change my view a bit. Last game I was scum partner with Grey he indicated he disliked fake claim, even when we were provided a fake claim by the mod.
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@oromagi
This is false. In truth I lock myself into an explicit claim very early on but I try to encrypt it or disguise it somehow if I don't think I should say. But I try to make it sufficiently sensible so that the clue could not be more than one possible claim. This should lend my claim credit for early claiming while preserving uncertainty where advantageous. I think everybody should be doing it because it makes fake claiming that much more dangerous.
I think any sensible interpretation of my request that you explicitly claim would be to do so clearly, and openly, without obfuscation. Historically your "clues" aren't sensible and do not lock you into a single claim, just as you were confused for Kenny in South Park mafia when you weren't.
Your clues are too arcane, obscure, and vague to actually lock you into a single claim.
I don't see anything in your post remotely close to a claim that has been requested, so I want it put on the record that you are refusing to cooperate with town.
My vote stays until you make a clear, unobfuscated claim.
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@Speedrace
But fake claiming a player is completely unnecessary in this game. So why avoid it?
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Guys we’ve been over this. It isn’t a town tell for him because he full claimed as scum in Virts game.
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