Man's own unwillingness to see the proof of Gods existence

Author: ronjs

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#61
Stephen
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@ronjs
ronjs, wrote: we all have the same evidence, it's in how you interpret it that is the difference.

So you are simply stuck for an explanation  as to why it came about that we can find Satan just walking "to and fro " on the earth making wagers with god that cost the lives of 10 innocent children Job 2:2, and millennia later can be found again tempting Jesus in the wilderness? Mark 1:12-13 after we had been told that Satan had been sentenced to crawl on his belly eating dirt for all eternity for seducing and corrupting mankind?  Genesis 3:14


                                                                                                                                                       New International Version


                                                                                                             14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, “Because you have done this,
                                                                                                                                       “Cursed are you above all livestock
                                                                                                                                                      and all wild animals!
                                                                                                                                                You will crawl on your belly
                                                                                                                                                       and you will eat dust
                                                                                                                                                     all the days of your life.



And you keep avoiding this too;

ronjs, wrote: It seems that most skeptics are unwilling ............
It seems that you are a little short on replies  and answers, yourself.  #24


ronjs, wrote: The atheists and creationists have the same rocks, fossils , sediments etc.  to interpret, usually based, in part on thier own biases.

Irrelevant. So you don't have an answer.No one is surprised.
#62
3RU7AL
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@BrotherDThomas
Even better yet, WHICH God is being defined because in the biblical era, MANY gods existed, whereas today, the main gods that are still around are Yahweh, Jesus, and Allah.
Excellent point.
#63
Stephen
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@ronjs
and mainly ask questions that are not relevant to the subject of the proof (evidence) of  Gods existence

In your opinion, is questioning the reliability of  the bible  relevant to the subject?


#64
zedvictor4
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@ronjs
Typically, you espouse this stuff as if you have actual, unequivocal proof.

Rather than just an interpretation of  ancient Middle Eastern hypothesising and folklore.

Wise Guy:   (Preaching boldly)  It was a bloke that I know what did it, and he f**ked a married virgin and she had a child and named it Jesus). So if you give me your money,  you can come into my house and sing some hymns and do a bit of kneeling and praying, and if you do this regularly, and are good and do what I say and keep giving me your money, I promise that you will go to heaven, when you die.

Poor Simple Guy:      Ok. (In a meek voice)

And so the Big Business that is popular religion was invented.



But where's your actual proof of an existent creator GOD?



Man sees the proof of creation and material evolution and cannot deny it.

But Man has never identified an existent creator....(Only ever created one in his own image).



#65
Polytheist-Witch
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@ronjs
So us being made in gods image is a lie. Either we are like gods or we are not 
#66
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@janesix
atoms aren't physical. Nothing is.
Atoms are physical. What makes you say that?
#67
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@Sum1hugme
Well they are sort of physical. The fabric of space is physical, and atoms are just nodes that resonate at certain frequencies.
#68
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So us being made in gods image is a lie. Either we are like gods or we are not 
Great point.
#69
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@janesix
Are you referring to the concept of wave-particle duality? Or are you referring to the conceptualization of particles as localized vibrations in a quantum field?
#70
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@janesix
Either way, atoms still have mass.
#71
janesix
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@Sum1hugme
Vibrations in a field.
#72
janesix
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@Sum1hugme
What is mass?
#73
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@janesix
Mass - a quantitative measure of inertia/the resistance that a body of matter offers to a change in its speed or position upon the application of a force.

  I don't think quantum field theory applies to atoms, since we can determine their position precisly enough to manipulate them, and so we don't have to model them as localized vibrations in a quantum field. Electrons sure, but not atoms. But electrons still have mass too, so they are physical. 
#74
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@Sum1hugme
a quantitative measure of inertia/the resistance that a body of matter offers to a change in its speed or position upon the application of a force.
Sure, the higgs field condensate resists the movement of certain types of (otherwise massless) "particles" based on their chiral symmetry breaking, but WHY (and or HOW) does the higgs field condensate resist the movement of certain types of (otherwise massless) "particles" based on their chiral symmetry breaking?
#75
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@Sum1hugme
I don't see how your definition of mass makes atoms, or electrons, physical. 

E=MC2 just means mass and energy are equivalent (in some undefined way)

The only reason I even allow for "fields" to be physical is because everything is vibration (but there has to be  "something" that is vibrating. What the F is vibrating?)
#76
FLRW
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@janesix

I don't see how your definition of mass makes atoms, or electrons, physical. 
Every physical object has a mass, which is a measure of the object's resistance to a change in its direction or speed, once a force is applied. While we can easily push a light-mass shopping cart, we cannot move a heavy-mass 6-wheel truck by simply pushing.


#77
fauxlaw
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@FLRW
The flaw in Einstein's quote, and your effort to make it meaningful for others is in the quote, itself; "For me..." says Einstein. Seems he was not trying to speak for anyone else.

As a chemistry student obtaining his PhD at Yale, my father once went to Princeton to attend a lecture given by Einstein, and had the privilege of meeting and having a short conversation with him. My father's conclusion: "Einstein had to have been the loneliest man in the world. To whom could he converse on a level with him?"

I conclude that, as God does not appear to be involved in many backyard fence conversations with folks [not to say he does not 'speak' to man by other means - I am convinced he does - by personal experience], I understand Einstein's perspective. He must have wanted a conversation with someone who would challenge him, and never had it. No wonder that, "for me,..." was his conclusion.
#78
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@fauxlaw

"Before we understand science, it is natural to believe that God created the universe. But now science offers a more convincing explanation. What I meant by 'we would know the mind of God' is, we would know everything that God would know, if there were a God, which there isn't. I'm an atheist."

Stephen Hawking  2013
#79
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@fauxlaw
What is your personally preferred static reference point?

What is your personally preferred "center of the cosmos"?
#80
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@FLRW
"if there were a God, which there isn't. I'm an atheist."
Fine. but what Hawking misses, surprising for one so intelligent, is that by admission as an atheist, he is only saying he has not discovered how to prove God to himself, a self-limiting admission. To bad, happens to the best of us.

#81
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@3RU7AL
What is your personally preferred static reference point?

What is your personally preferred "center of the cosmos"?
1. I do not have a static reference point. Why do you assume that I do? Eternity has no static reference point, and that is the realm in which I live and breathe.

2. Tied to #1. Eternity has no center. The cosmos is eternal. Why would you assume that I believe there is a center?

Can't wrap your head around eternity? Argue for your limitations; they're yours.
#82
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@janesix
@FLRW
For the sake of simplicity, we are mass.

And our mass when broken down into it's decreasingly smaller component parts, is still mass.

Though unless mass is  continuously infinitesimal, at some unobservable point  we will cease to exist.


Nonetheless:   I would suggest that to accommodate the concept of creation, it is therefore mathematically necessary, that the fractional reduction of matter cannot be infinite


It is perhaps that which cannot be observed that is key to everything.....Call it a GOD principle, if you will....But do not give it two arms, two legs and a beard.
#83
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@FLRW
I think Hawking is wrong. A child born an atheist will likely remain an atheist unless otherwise convinced of a God.  My family reinforces my theory.
#84
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“I’ve made a vaccine that kills God by altering the genetic structure of the brain. If you are one of those silly people who still believes in God, this vaccine will immunize you against that erroneous belief and turn you into a nice normal person who doesn’t believe in God…. Yes, we’re thinking of vaccinating billions of people to cure them of their toxic God Delusion. This is my second most important aim in life, apart from world depopulation, which is my principal aim : to kill the God Demon that lurks in the sick mind of man.”
— Bill Gates, disputed quote, possibly invented by evil conspiracy theorist.
#85
janesix
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@FLRW
The guy's a creep. but that still feels like a fake quote.
#86
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@janesix

Yes, but you have to admit that it is an interesting concept.


#87
janesix
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@FLRW
I don't think it is possible.
#88
janesix
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@FLRW
I think God is more powerful than any human.
#89
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@janesix

Maybe they could use it on the Taliban first?
 The Taliban are a movement of religious students (talib) from the Pashtun areas of eastern and southern Afghanistan who were educated in traditional Islamic schools in Pakistan.


#90
janesix
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@FLRW
Just the thought of anyone trying to control the thoughts of others really pisses me off. Even if the person is evil and a horrible scum. They still have the right to their private thoughts.