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@Athias
Do you believe rights come from God?
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@Greyparrot
Pretty sure they were more concerned with Obama eliminating private health insurance choices.
They were concerned about many things it seems. Do you deny the right-wing pundits, talking heads and constituency called Obama a socialist throughout his presidency?
Trumpy has a Macy's parade baby balloon. You have to take fringe people with a grain of salt.
These things are not the same. I don't think there is a history of violence toward people being hoisted as hot air balloons.
You know the people who did the noose thing at the football game said their actions were not racially motivated. Maybe this type of obliviousness is why you think those two things (the hot air balloon or even Kathy Griffin's grotesque image of Trump's head) are equivalent. And I don't mean to be snarky by use of the word oblivious btw. I just thought it sounded nicer than "ignorant." I'm sure there are resources from more articulate people than me that can explain why Obama constantly being portrayed as a caricature or with a noose hung around his neck is a bit more problematic than your everyday left vs. right war of words and heated Facebook exchanges. I can't help but feel like some people are being willfully obtuse.
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@ILikePie5
Then again, I didn’t follow politics before 2016
Yeah, the right-wing was obsessed with Obama being a "socialist." They called him a socialist every day on Fox News. You could look it up on YouTube. They also swore he would take people's guns and many said he would implement Sharia Law. It was insane.
There were frequent demonstrations where people drew caricatures of him as a monkey or with watermelons, and people would stage fake hangings of him with a noose. If you Google it you will find many examples. It's also happened post his presidency such as when multiple people dressed as Obama in a noose costume at a University of Wisconsin football game. There was definitely a lot of unsubstantiated vitriol. That's why I'd like people to justify the claims of Obama being a socialist, race baiter or cop hater. I've seen people on this site make those inflammatory statements within the last week. I'm curious of the factual basis behind them. So far... none.
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@ILikePie5
Okay, so you don't think Obama is a socialist. Glad we cleared that up. Maybe someone else has insight on this perspective then.
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@Athias
So by your logic, Karl Marx was not a socialist because he did not hold public office.
The definition of socialist is:
noun
- a person who advocates or practises socialism.
adjective
- adhering to or based on the principles of socialism.
So it seems both Karl Marx (and Ayn Rand in your view) are socialists.
If your intent was to contrast the narrative surrounding Obama in juxtaposition to the Republican opposition
It clearly was. Republicans or other Democrats.
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@SirAnonymous
Nihilism is the logical result of naturalistic atheism.
What about any other kind of existentialism?
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@Greyparrot
That's true. We should probably classify Trump's racist remarks vs. his ethnic discrimination. I think they all belong on the list though.
Another interesting qualifier would be what kind of proof you'd need to make the list. For instance former Trump attorney Michael Cohen gave a plethora of examples of racist quotes he heard from Trump, but I'd be willing to bet his supporters feel like those allegations aren't credible without video recordings (even though first-hand testimony is admissible evidence in court).
What do you think the terms the black vote, the Hispanic vote, or the senior citizen vote mean?
I will be happy to see the democrats losing their race-bait support.
One day. Right now Trump only has support from 21% of (young) blacks and 29% of Hispanics.
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@Greyparrot
I was just making fun of Hillary's latest tweet saying she was "born" to be the president.
Haha did she really? I'm not familiar with that.
Is this a serious question though or just more snark food?
It's a serious question. I'm genuinely curious why this perception persists.
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@n8nrgmi
Notice that nobody commenting here denied that Trump says racist things. So that's that.
An interesting exercise would be to compare and contrast the scope of Trump's racism with Biden's. Like, Biden said if you vote for Trump then you "ain't black" and that's arguably racist. But is suggesting that black people are a monolithic group (something politicians - including Trump - do all the time when they refer to the black vote) more derogatory then say Trump's remarks about Mexican immigrants being rapists? Someone should compile a list to look over and satiate my curiosity. I'm too busy today.
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@Greyparrot
OP: does anyone dispute that trump says things that are racist?
Pie's response: does anyone dispute that biden says things that are racist?
Pie: Explain how Trump is more racist than Joe
Why don't you ever call out Pie's incessant and constant whataboutism? Lol I wonder.
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@HistoryBuff
This forum is mostly a right wing echo chamber.
I voted for a Democrat 1x in my life yet the people on this site call me a radical left-winger lol. They're a joke. Pretty much everything they say is wrong.
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@Imabench
I flat out dont even bother posting in this forum anymore just because the chances of an actual conversation or exchange of intelligent ideas taking place in this forum are close to zero. The fact that people think Trump somehow did well in that first debate is a testament to how warped and deranged the majority of people who post in here are
I completely agree. I've resorted to constant trolling because I can't find someone to take seriously. If you ever want to have a real dialog, let me know. I love to learn so even if I don't know much about the subject I'll engage you with an open mind.
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@Athias I'm not sure if it counts as homo bashing because there was an explicit reference to Trump, as opposed to suggesting that one should feel shame for wanting to engage in homo behavior generally. Like, if someone said to a straight male "Do you fantasize about Nancy Pelosi when you whack it?" We could see this was still meant to be insulting to the subject, but it is not heterophobic per se. It's more so mocking the allegiance and fetishization of the person being referenced (i.e. Trump or Pelosi).
Hmm. I'll have to think about it.
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To add on to point #3 about Biden's argument on Covid, he said that Trump misled the public about unproven treatments, mocked people for wearing masks, and did not require or advocate masks (i.e. at events like the one for Amy C.B. and the president's rallies). So he provided a general outline for all the ways in which he think the President did a poor job at leading us through the pandemic. His position was certainly not limited to "The international plague is Trump's fault." It's that Trump did a poor job responding with lack of transparency + a false sense of hope and security, coupled with not helping to secure enough funding by prodding the Senate. I can pull up the quotes with timestamps if people request.
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@Intelligence_06
Yeah. Andrew Yang did a good job of explaining some of those concerns too. I g2g back to work for now but can expand later.
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@Intelligence_06
A true “ancap” society after years will be authoritarian capitalism.
I think so too. It gets tricky when it comes to law enforcement. An-caps assume that everyone in society magically agrees with their definition of capitalism. There's also the problem that even libertarians inherently disagree on certain subjects. For instance, how would abortion be handled in an-cap societies? Half the population might believe fetuses have rights, and the other half might not. You need an arbiter.
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When college kids learn about the non-aggression principle for the first time they get excited. After awhile they come to the realization that the concept of an anarchist society is a bit misguided, and a totally laissez faire approach like anarcho-capitalism isn't really even possible.
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Any update on cop hating by Obama? I've heard the claim that Obama is responsible for the war on cops so many times, and I've seen people here blame him for riots and the disenfranchisement of law enforcement. Surely someone can justify this claim. People wouldn't just make things up.
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Any update on race baiting by Obama? I've heard there was so much of it but I didn't get one example. Weird.
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@MisterChris
1. He openly endorsed the Green New Deal, universally recognized as the stupidest idea anyone has ever presented in American politics.
"No, I don't support the Green New Deal. I support the Biden plan that I put forward, which is different from what Trump calls the radical Green New Deal." - Biden at 1:22:35
2. He made no condemnation of the riots and domestic terrorism plaguing America.
"Violence and response is never appropriate. Never appropriate. Peaceful protest is. Violence is never appropriate." - Biden at 55:55
"I've made it clear in my public statements that the violence should be prosecuted. It should be prosecuted. And anyone who commits it should be prosecuted." - Biden at 1:03:22
3. His COVID argument literally consists of "This international plague is somehow Trump's fault."
His argument is not that the virus is Trump's fault. It was 1) Trump knew about the Virus in February but downplayed significance to the American public; 2) Trump was not harsh enough with China's president insofar as letting U.S. health experts investigate in Wuhan, and Trump praised Xi for being so transparent; 3) Trump's administration did not provide enough protective gear, or pass the other House bill to provide money that would provide PPE, ventilation and other expenditures that would allow schools and businesses to remain open.
4. His economic argument is "you killed the economy" but at the same time "we need to close the country"
Actually he spoke against shut downs. He said the reason the economy had to be shut down was largely in part to Trump's negligence, and had he taken certain measures - specifically telling the public about the virus sooner; emphasizing the seriousness of the virus rather than downplay the 'hoax' of concern; encouraging everyone to wear masks; and providing PPE to critical establishments among other things, that businesses would have been a lot safer to remain open. He said "If I were running it, I’d know what the plan is. You’ve got to provide these businesses the ability to have the money to be able to reopen with the PPE, as well as with the sanitation they need. You have to provide them classic-" before being interrupted by Trump.
Then Trump says "Well, he wants to shut down this country and I want to keep it open, and we did a great thing by shutting it down" to which Joe replies "You just admitted you'd shut it down." Then Trump accused Biden of wanting to shut the whole country down, and before Biden could reply Chris Wallace interrupts and says they need to move on. Biden demands a chance to respond 2x and both times the moderator wouldn't let him.
But it's clear that Biden's proposal is not to shut down - it's to spend a lot of money allowing businesses to stay open.
5. Weirdly enough, Biden hurled more insults at Trump than vice versa. This was the time he was supposed to be the grown up. Instead, they both looked childish.
How would we determine this considering there is no way to quantify tone or sarcasm? What we can do is tally the number of insults and interruptions, but that wouldn't say much about the breadth of the dig (like some insults are worse than others). For instance Biden told Trump to shut up and called him a clown, but Trump mocked Hunter Biden's drug problems. I'm curious what your metric is and then I'll be able to go back and see if this is true. Trump interrupted 70+ times; Biden interrupted 20+ times if that counts for anything.
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@Athias
So your take is that if we utilize or implement something socialist (such as the MTA) the government is therefore socialist. Does that mean when we practice a hands-off or market based approach or prioritize private property, we are simultaneously capitalist?
Do you think it's possible to have a government that is not socialist? Do you like the socialist aspects of government?
As far as Obama goes, if your metric is that all politicians are socialist then it doesn't really provide much utility to what I was getting at. That means Trump's a socialist, Rand Paul's a socialist, Ron Paul's a socialist, Ted Cruz is a socialist, Ayn Rand is a socialist. Errbody a socialist up in here.
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@ILikePie5
Is Obama a socialist? Not one of your posts addresses the OP so I'm trying to figure out why you bothered to comment.
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@Greyparrot
Enjoy the election results!
I guess. I don't really have anything invested. Just because I make fun of Trump supporters for their rampant falsehoods doesn't mean I <3 Biden.
I am sure you were born to snark.
I think so too. I'm so good at it and it comes naturally. But I'll scale it back to see if I can get a straight answer :) How is Obama a socialist?
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@Athias
All presidents, especially post World War II have been serving an agenda of creating a communist state in which, for the most part, they've succeeded.
We're not communist lol. Things like the minimum wage and MTA do not prove we are socialist either. But what does any of this have to do with Obama? Are you saying his support for publicly funded endeavors makes him a socialist? You seem to be arguing that the very fact we have a government at all means capitalism is not possible. In that case every politician is a socialist. Republicans support ALL of the things you mentioned (public transportation, social security, social safety nets, etc.) so by that logic they're socialists too.
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@Greyparrot
Of course, leftist diehards like Danielle are going to say the ends justifies the means in their neverending whataboutery quest to justify the bullshit.
Lol @ leftist diehard. Yep, you know me! I don't even know what you're talking about here and I don't think you do either.
But anyway, um, yeah it is insanely hypocritical to say Democrats are not being "kind" enough for people, so they are forced to choose Trump instead. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You don't have a response or justification for that stupidity so all you can say is that it's "whataboutism" for me to point out that Trump is more rude than any Democrat. How observant of you! It absolutely is whataboutism. It also happens to be true which is why you have nothing else to say about it lol. Derp.
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@Greyparrot
I have no idea why you bothered to comment here. Of course you didn't make a single point in response to the OP. We all know you can't prove this claim you've made so you don't have the audacity to even try. Good! I'm glad you know better. Stick to your strategy of not responding to me directly because that's the only way to limit the shame I guess.
What I don't get is why you made a useless quip to MisterChris about how the Dems lost because they were too condescending lol. (Aww. Too condescending.) Who gives a shit and how is that relevant to the OP at all? I don't care that Hillary Clinton hurt your fee fees. I don't care that you require a safe space to be protected from Democrat's snark. Leave it to Trump supporters to be the biggest cry baby snowflakes on the planet. These anti-PC folks were so offended per your article that they decided to vote against Dems and you think I... care... about that... for some... reason?
I'm not a Democrat lol. I couldn't care less if the Democrats were the rudest, most snarky, most scumbag politicians on planet Earth because their advocacy does not align with mine. I don't care if they win or lose. In fact my life will probably be better if Trump wins because I do well enough that I don't rely on government food stamps, government healthcare, government social security and all the other programs his uneducated and low-income supporters depend on but vote against. That's their problem. I'ma be fine no matter what.
I just like to mock people for not being able to back up their nonsense. You repeatedly spew the most asinine, falsifiable bullshit. It's a shame you don't have the decency or integrity to acknowledge it every time (or any time) I prove you wrong. I just wish you wouldn't waste my time by replying at all if you have nothing relevant or useful to add. All you do is whine incessantly about the left. I'm the one who said in response to Michelle Obama that my personal M.O. is when they go low, I go lower so I don't know why you think I care about the strategy of being nice to win hearts and minds. I don't, Trump doesn't, and you're only pretending to so you can complain about Democrats some more. That's all you do. Unfortunately that's not good enough to back your incessant falsehoods up which is why I have to correct you all the time.
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@ILikePie5
How does it feel to know I was right that Lunatic was scum.
It feels fine! He played great. If we lynched him and proved he was lynchproof, it wouldn't have proven he was scum you cry baby piece of shit.
Not a single person agrees with you which is why you got lynched. Now you're embarrassed and taking it out on me because you humiliated yourself.
I'm surprised you even had time to play the game in between feedings. What do you suck on mommy's titty to breastfeed while you play? Idiot.
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@Greyparrot
Condescension is a huge foible on the left.
The fact that you have the audacity to make this point when Trump's twitter feed exists is honestly hilarious and shows me you are not capable of an honest dialog. You're too biased. When people who are open-minded and fair show themselves to me, I engage them fruitfully and I love it. Some people (like Mikal) and I disagree constantly yet have really interesting and thought provoking conversations all the time. I don't have that opportunity with most people. Sad.
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@Greyparrot
But condescension is part of the tradition on the left.
Lmao Dems lost for being too condescending say the Trump supporters who hoot and holler like giddy school girls when Trump says mean things to anyone and everyone who speaks against him. Compared to the words and insults Trump hurled at everyone during the campaign and beyond, I'm not sure how much credence we should give to politicians being "nice" anymore. In fact Trump and his supporters say that being nice is a negative and they prefer people who "tell it like it is." These MAGA morons live and die by the logic "It's not about being nice!!!" when it comes to Trump's indisputably harsh and hostile rhetoric, but when Hillary Clinton calls people deplorable (the horror!) or anyone dare insult them or their way of life, they faint on the floor while clutching their pearls and practically choke to death on their own hypocrisy.
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@MisterChris
Just gonna put this out there, I don't think you'll be changing many minds this way.
One can provoke people into trying desperately to prove their point by getting them all riled up, and when they try hard and fail to prove said point, that may be enough for them to change their own mind. That's all we can hope for.
Most people aren't evolved enough to have a legitimate exchange of ideas without being inherently defensive and tribal. I'm capable of it but often defer to ridicule as I've found it a more fruitful (and amusing) endeavor.
For instance you'll see that instead of saying "You're right - I'm not able to justify the claim I made about X" most people will just ignore me and not admit to prior ignorance or misunderstanding. Since most people are not capable of this honest dialog, I often don't extend to them my more friendly and reasonable side because I don't think they deserve it lol.
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That was me thumbs-upping your comments, 3RU7AL.
The irony of self-righteous lawyers pontificating to laymen about how THE MEDIA IS LYING TO YOU in a video where they are actually the ones spreading lies is too much lolol. What's extremely troubling is that most people aren't bright enough to see how this entire conversation was predicated on the misrepresentation of it being an "honest and fair assessment" when it was anything but, at least not the beginning part that I watched.
First off the title of the video itself is poisoning the well. It immediately tells the viewer that the MSM's perspective (Breonna Taylor deserves justice) is wrong, which already presents a biased view to the person watching thus it is inherently fallacious. Secondly Nate kicks off the conversation by assuring the audience that he's looked into the merits of the case. He comments "Oh you know me - I like to look into everything; I look into the warrants and all that stuff" to provide a false sense of security to the viewer that oh yeah he's a lawyer, he must know what he's talking about, he's "looked into" the warrants and therefore what he says must be true... please.
Everything he claimed about Breonna Taylor was unsubstantiated and disproven in court, so the fact that he felt confident enough to speak so self-assuredly on the "facts" of this case as an attorney is very troubling. All he did was give the background of what the warrants were for, when the entire point of holding law enforcement accountable is that the information they gave to get the warrants was wrong. The lawyers seemed to discuss this a little before I stopped watching when they acknowledged there must have been issues with the warrants, which they remarked is why Louisville settled the case the way they did for the amount they did. But that means they knew everything Nate said about the justification for going into Breonna Taylor's house was false, and the fact that no one called him out on it means these people have lost all credibility insofar as being fair and forthright.
Btw this is why I tend to brush off people who lament the dishonesty of the media (even though the media is problematic af). These people tend to prefer sources like YouTube as if social media isn't media. Meanwhile every source has the capacity to be wrong, regardless of how well intentioned it is. I agree that's a problem with the MSM but it's also a problem with the "we'ere here to fact check the media!" crowd generally, which this video encapsulates for me perfectly.
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@Vader
@BearMan
I think you should do the game you want to do the most in the game you want higher quality players in Discord, and then do a second game in here IMO
Yeah I like the concept so I might create a game with the same theme for DART. I'll just make a new one. I'll go next! Write it down somewhere lol
BearMan you can skip me in line. I was on the fence about signing up for your game just because dying on DP1 or NP1 every game really does get boring (since DP1 is always a wash). But I think it's important that people who mod play in other people's games, so sign my ass up :)
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@Vader
I think those games will be separate from DART itself is what Mikal was thinking but I'm not sure. Maybe we should do this game on Discord, but it will be much more people IMO
So my game is called Riddle Mafia and it's basically just going to have clues from me sprinkled throughout the game (some more obvious or useful than others). It's already set up. I kinda wanted to play it with the Discord peeps cuz there's a higher quality of player there (no offense to everyone here), and I think some of them would appreciate it more than here where a lot of players are inactive or the stronger players tend to be killed off first. So if I save that game for Discord or create a second one for here then I'd let BearMan skip me in line. I wanna go next though :P
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@Vader
I had a feeling MC was busy IRL (but hey I never get a pass for that :P ). I would have settled on whiteflame being the last scum.
I was so salty about not being BP but you did a great job modding. Good game!
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@SirAnonymous
I once won a game as a Judas using lynchproof as a fake claim. That's probably the exception to the rule, though.
Lol that's ballsy - 99.9% of the time people are going to test the claim cuz WHY NOT. I didn't want to test it right then because I wasn't sure if it would end the day phase even if Luna survived (I never got clarification on that). And also because assuming he survived, a lynchproof mafioso just made no sense to me so it felt like a waste of time. It is definitely the most OP mafia role I've come across, though a little less if there is a Cop. I don't think it was a bastard role in this game cuz of the Sensor I guess. I didn't read the last DP yet so I dunno how that all played out.
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Another falsehood touted by ignorant talking heads is that Obama was a socialist. Of course every Democratic presidential candidate in 2020 was to the left of Obama which is a little funny/sad. But what's interesting to me is what while the fear mongering behind He'S CoMinG tO tAkE yOuR gUnS eventually subsided once realized that was entirely untrue, people still refer to Obama as a socialist to this day. Does anyone here believe that or deny that Obama was relatively moderate according to pre Liberty Caucus standards? After all the Liberty Caucus died the second Ted Cruz and Rand Paul started calling Trump "daddy." So I'm curious - by what metric is Obama a socialist? Unlike claims of him being a race baiter or cop hater, this one I'm seriously willing to entertain. I'm only 2% trolling here. I'd like to know why he is considered the antithesis of American values and capitalism by flag waving MAGA tools. I dunno if any of them can read or think very well but who knows maybe I'll get an interesting response from someone, anyone.
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@MisterChris
I mean, I dislike his policies, but the guy seems genuine to me.
Same. I did not vote for him either time. I'm curious how he is responsible for the racial division in this country though. Let's find out!
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Obama is responsible for a war on cops. This popular red herring from right-wingers to distract from any conversation about criminal justice reform is another one of my favorite idiotic talking points to dismantle. Of course it isn't true and I love watching people squirm when you ask for any type of evidence or justification for this lie. At best they will defer to a quote from William Johnson, the executive director of the National Association of Police Organizations, who went on Fox News to facilitate this smear without any substantive reasoning whatsoever. He claimed Obama "appeased violent criminals" and "actively called for the death of police officers" via BLM. He also said that unlike previous presidents, Obama did not condemn violence against police. I shit you not. This turd literally said this with a straight face on the most popular cable news network (even though any fucking idiot can Google that is explicitly and emphatically false) but to the surprise of absolutely no one, a ton of Fox News loving knobs actually believe it. If you're one of them, please cite everything Obama said and did to perpetuate a war on cops. Be prepared to argue that calls for reform is the equivalent of war. You know like how calls to reform social security is a war on social security... right? Isn't that how it works? I'm not sure but you fine people are going to explain it to me. Thank you in advance!
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A favorite talking point from right-wing troglodytes is that Obama started a race war. That's right, despite the existence of slavery which dehumanized black people for centuries; despite Jim Crow laws and segregation being the law of the land for decades after that; despite well documented systemic racism that has persisted and the fact that people still glorify the Confederacy, Barack Hussein Obama started a race war in this country... so the theory goes.
Here is your chance to educate me! Please show me all the evidence you can find proving that Obama incited racism. Please show me all the ways in which he instigated backlash that sowed the seeds of racial division in this country as Republicans claim. I am not looking for opinions here; I want to know exactly what Obama said and exactly what Obama did, specifically, that led to hostility among the races and caused white people to fear/hate blacks or vice versa. Thank you.
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@Lunatic
@Vader
@ILikePie5
Thank you for tagging me @Pie! And I sincerely appreciate Supa calling out that it was my turn to mod. I have a game ready, but Mikal said something about possibly bringing forum mafia to Discord. I think he made a thread for it. In that case I'd prefer to host this game there -- can ya'll just gimme until later today when someone confirms to me if we're playing forum style games on Discord? If yes I will switch spots with BearMan and let him host now. If not I'll just post my game to DART instead. Do you guys happen to know?
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@ILikePie5
Contrary to Pie's assertions that it was "hypocritical" to not let him wait a day to claim:
1) Luna claimed info about his role right off the bat which already locked him into a claim, and we had more info about his role than we had about Pie's including a character claim. 2) 99.9% of lynchproof claims are real including Luna's, so it would have just distracted and stopped us from going after scum - we were about to lynch Speed that day had Pie not derailed us with his nonsense. 3) Luna was lynchproof, so even if he refused to claim and town punished him for it with a lynch, he would SURVIVE and his role would actually be CONFIRMED by him not claiming whereas Pie fucking died like an idiot. It was clearly not the same which is why everyone disagrees with Pie and recognizes that move was dumb. Just a totally unnecessary dick move meant to stick it to one's teammates because they felt annoyed they got pressured in the game (waaaah).
There is a time/place for refusing to claim but this wasn't it. And honestly I did not suspect Pie at all before that. Lunatic and Greyparrot brought him up as suspect and I routinely ignored it, but if someone refuses to claim without good reason (like there being a way to verify your role if you wait) I'm always going to lynch them. I highly suggest if Pie plays again he remembers to bring a pacifier and take a nap first so he doesn't throw another crybaby tantrum that hurts his team. Town needs to handle him with kid gloves going forward and recognize that he will "punish" you if you have the audacity to pressure him for a claim when he's playing scummy (lol at him refusing to lynch Speed because he called him a confirmed Cop). For this kind of behavior Pie should absolutely be the first one to pressure on every single DP1 going forward, and if he refuses to claim then just kill him off then. If we don't hold him accountable he will just do this in every game. That's the only way to deal with petulant players that think they can hold the town hostage through refusals to cooperate.
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Wow! That was great scum play by Luna! I wasn't giving him a second thought as scum with a lynchproof role so that was the end of that. I had scum pegged as Speed (I swear to god I knew he was scum since DP1 and never waivered), Skittlez, and I was deciding between Chris or whiteflame for the third. I was convinced there was someone more big brained in the mafia and assumed people might overlook whiteflame. Chris was playing much more low key than he did in the one game I've played with him before, so I would have probs decided who to FOS between them based on his claim. I wasn't sold on the Sensor role. So I def would have gotten Speed and Skittlez, but I very likely I would not have voted for Luna had I survived. I dunno what happened in the last day phase but I'm glad town figured it out.
I also want to make it clear that I was not Bulletproof :( Supa disappointed me. He called me Bulletproof in my role description but I was not Bulletproof at all so he just used the term as a tease. I dunno why he put it in the role description lol. I was the BODYGUARD. I was so bummed. Instead of me having extra protection from deaths, I had a role that made me even MORE LIKELY to die. Either I was targeted for the night kill by scum or I would protect the right person and die in their place. Faaaantastic.
I'd also like to reiterate on top of Luna's post that he was absolutely right about the 'like' thing so for everyone whining about how that was a "waste of time distraction" lolol joke's on you because it was accurate. Similarly last game when I called out oromagi's profile picture thing everyone said it was a "waste of time distraction" but I was right about that and caught scum DP1. I can see how these things COULD be distractions, but they could also be really good clues. I didn't put it past Luna to be making up that whole thing as scum (which I said DP1 - it could have been him who liked the post all along) but it was worth considering or at least use as a starting point for pressure. At that point we had nothing else to go on. Day Phase 1 in Forum mafia is brutal.
Btw did scum have fake claims or what info were they given before the start of the game?
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The predictable whataboutism is so pathetic lol.
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@Greyparrot
I explained why everything you said was wrong; you ignored it and responded with useless links I'm not going to bother clicking. On the other hand you responded with paragraphs upon paragraphs to SupaDudz because you know he's not going to call you out on your bullshit as effectively as I do. Weak.
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@Greyparrot
Presidents are remembered by how the country changed, and it wasn't that great under his 8 years. Especially the economy.
The Obama administration inherited the worst economy since the Great Depression. If you want to pretend that a president is responsible for the market, then by the same logic Trump has been a monumental failure considering the way the coronavirus has turned the economy to shit. After all Trump was in office so it must be "his economy" right? He must be responsible for it right? Is that how it works?
Unemployment has been steadily declining since 2011. Economists agree recovery from the recession happened under the Obama administration and Trump's admin continued the same trajectory. Keep in mind Trump is constantly at odds with the Fed and always lamenting their regulatory actions, so is Trump really to thank for how it's worked out? He's always calling for the exact opposite of what Jermone Powell does but of course he will take credit for how it's worked out lol. Typical Trump, and of course his supporters are too stupid to realize it.
What Trump can take credit for is a confidence boost in the market, but of course the stock market =/= the economy and the market works in cycles. The 'boom' under Trump was always going to come to an end for some reason or another, and indeed it has.
BLM was created under Obama's administration which also helped to give rise to the terror group Antifa.
BLM was created in response to Travyon Martin's death, and the fact that you would attribute this to Obama is beyond stupid. Obama is not the reason so many people got sick and tired of racism in the criminal justice system. People have been protesting that for decades. BLM was not a "response" to Obama; it was not "because" of Obama and Obama did not encourage the formation of either one of these groups. ANTIFA has nothing to do with Obama -- you literally made that up, there's not a shred of evidence for that and you can't justify that claim -- so now you're going to gloss over it and pretend you never said it which is good. Don't waste our time.
Obama supported the radical anti-police groups by publicly shaming the police multiple times.
He's shamed bad policing: racism in law enforcement and not adhering to the oath. That isn't "anti police" and the fact that you can't tell the difference is pathetic . Someone can say we need REFORM and need to IMPROVE and that would not qualify as shaming (though let me be perfectly clear when I say that cops need to be shamed much more than they ever have been before -- most of them should be downright humiliated for their failures to abide by their oath and the things they get away with, but Obama never said that -- I did). That's like saying if you're against child abuse you're "shaming parents." Fucking dumb.
Show us Obama "shaming" the police multiple times. I need to see this. I can't wait to see you post quotes of him saying things like "we need to be better" and call that shaming. Lol. Meanwhile there is quote after quote and clip after clip of Obama praising police, calling them heroes, saying we need to respect the law, etc. But please do show us the best you could come up with. Like, the very best. I want to see Obama really put cops down. Show us!
Obama did nothing to create economic opportunity zones in Black Communities.
I can tell you that real estate investors loooove Trump's "opportunity zones" lol. More than 90% of the billions invested in this initiative have gone to real estate deals - woo! I can tell you that investors have made a lot of money (and I got great bonuses <3) while the tax cuts do little to nothing to assist needy residents. I can tell you that the residents may even be displaced depending on what kind of investment is made. I can tell you there's no way to quantify the benefits, because Congress and Trump's treasury department refuse to document and disclose the program's impact -- so can you explain how Trump has done much better than Obama in this area? At the very least can you PLEASE explain to MisterChris why this type of economic planning touted by Trump is not libertarian at all :P
Obama ignored the Blacks competing for the low wage jobs monopolized by illegal immigrants in inner sanctuary cities. Obama offered no actual solutions for Black unemployment, Black fatherlessness, and Black violence.
It's funny seeing people who are usually for "state's rights" and local government lament the lack of force and reject local sovereignty in favor of federal government control - yet another way Trump is not remotely libertarian (lol that kid is seriously confused). And similarly people who call themselves "capitalists" suddenly have a problem with people competing for wages -- the horror!!! I cannot BELIEVE Obama would let people compete for jobs and drive down prices for the consumer!!! Capitalism is the fucking DEVIL and Obama should be crucified for allowing it. Right kids? Can Trump supporters please explain to everyone why capitalism sucks?
And yeah its obvious that Obama did nothing to stop illegal immigration except deport more people than Trump.
Can you explain what kind of "solutions for black employment" the president is responsible for? More curiously, has Trump done anything to help the situation of black fatherless people? Has he done anything to quell racial tension and violence? If not then... what's your point?
That's how Obama is remembered. He sowed the seeds for a race war that would have happened no matter who was elected in 2016.
I agree that Obama's presidency is largely to blame for racial tension, because this country is so chock full of fragile little white cucks who got very upset at seeing a black man in the White House while their own livelihoods continued to deteriorate (admittedly a lot of the free market policies Republican politicians and myself embrace have a lot to do with that). The "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" crowd has always been the most whiney, most weak, and the fastest to blame others for their economic problems while lamenting liberals for doing the same. They want to blame immigrants, they want to blame politicians, they want to blame Hollywood, they want to blame Wall Street, they want to blame everyone but themselves and Obama was the perfect scapegoat (cuz they're racist) even though they don't have a god damn leg to stand on in their criticisms.
If anything liberals and progressives should complain about Obama for being such an ineffective MODERATE. Granted he had a Republican Congress and they literally conspired to stop him from accomplishing dick, but Obama was straight up moderate and faaaaar to the right of all Democrat presidential candidates today. Obama's ONE BIG ACHIEVEMENT was the ACA which is very popular; even Republicans largely support government healthcare.
Aside from that he didn't do anything that would rile up conservatives, yet they still went ape shit cuz they're fucking racist. Period. They keep calling him a "socialist" even though he wasn't at all. They created this entire false narrative about how he is responsible for every single thing they dislike (please explain how Obama was a race baiter... god I wish there was an eyeroll emoji on here). They blame Obama for other people being racist towards him and because of him which is insane. Obama did not "sow the seeds of a race war" and did nothing to foster or promote racial tension. He acted on his best behavior and said all the right things - the OPPOSITE of Trump. Trump dog whistles to racists (sometimes it's loud and clear) and told the Proud Boys to "stand back and stand by" but you think Obama prepped people for a race war? Give me a fucking break. Virtually everything you've said in this post is wrong. Just unsubstantiated regurgitated rhetoric from Tucker Carlson. I wonder if you looked as constipated while you typed it as he does when he's speaking.
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@ILikePie5
If he was Deathproof he would’ve been adamant about lynching himself. He just gracefully doesn’t show up until a no lynch is there. His entire argument is based on WIFOM. He’s nowhere to be seen contrary to his town meta where he’s literally on an interrogation path with everyone. His scumread on me makes zero sense
Right, we should have lynched Luna last DP and maybe he's lying. But the fact that you want to lynch him this DP when it doesn't help us at all on balance, and that you continuously ignore all of my other points (especially re: Speed) it just makes me read you scum. I didn't before when Luna called you out. Now you're sus.
Good luck with that.
Lol then die for all I care. You're either scum or you're town in which case your play style sucks and you deserve to die. You'll be lucky enough to win with us in the end or you'll lose with us as your play style deserves. Either way I don't think anyone minds lynching you.
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There's enough reason to get a claim from Pie this day phase and we can proceed where to go from there. I suspect we'll be lynching one of the two this DP so it's not like we're going to reveal a lot more. VTL Pie for a claim.
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@ILikePie5
Are y’all not even a tadbit concerned that Lunatic has been AWOL for so long. It literally goes against his entire townplay.
True, but Luna said he's willing to test his claim of lynchproof meaning he's lynchproof. It makes no sense to have lynchproof scum for aforementioned reasons, and the fact that you would ignore this means you seem to kinda be tunneling Luna - and you have since last DP.
"It would be anti-Town for you to not claim. I ended up claiming to not be lynched. Maybe you should do the same if you are town" - Pie, post #106 last day phase.
I just re-read it to see if I could find your alleged soft claim. I could not. I also noticed you had a little back and forth dialog with warren. To be honest though I didn't read you scummy until this DP when you seemingly just believed Speed's results. I think it's weird you called Speed a "confirmed" cop last day phase in post #480 as well.
Also, regarding "playing by the same rules"I did with Lunatic, Luna claimed a big part of his role last DP so... it's not the same.
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@whiteflame
Not sure how I was threatened by warren
I said I could see you being threatened by him (not that you were) just based on his knowledge of the theme. It seems like you and he know it the strongest. And you, Speed, Pie, Luna and GP are the only ones who would seem smart enough to get rid of someone like warren.
Maybe whoever the mafia targets for a NK is recruited to the PM if its their buddy and killed if it's not. Either way I could see why warren would be a good target and I dunno if Bear, Croc and skittlez have the wherewithal to see it (no offense). So from those possibilities Speed and Pie seem most sus to me atm. I dunno what to make of Chris yet.
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