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@Vader
RM thinks the list is an heirachy list,
Okay but would he still think that if he was not on it?
Well yeah I guess he probably would then he would be talking about how he should be on it.
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@Alec
God wants the people to cook so he will be angry if someone tells him we stopped them from cooking. The Bible makes it clear that making god angry is a bad idea. Why are you taking this as a joke? Billions of lives are at risk.
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@Alec
If Japan digs their own hole to hell, that's great since it frees the people there faster. It's possible that hell is below the surface of the earth.
It's possible that the Japanese government is secretly controlled by the forces of hell. If they get there first then they will warn Satan what we are doing. Then Satan warns god and god sends a plague upon mankind that makes all seven he sent to Egypt put together look like a weekend getaway to Khalahari as punishment for trying to plan this little jail break.
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@Alec
I think the part you are missing in what drafter is trying to say is that hell doesn't exist. That really is the key takeaway here. I know he might not have been too clear on that particular point so I just wanted to help clarify.
My point is a bit different. You ever watch that "Stairway to Heaven" documentary from South Park? It is the exact same thing you are proposing except with heaven instead of hell. Problem is the Japanese got there first and claimed it as theirs.
Alec, if we start digging a hole to hell the Japanese are going to catch on and start their own hole to hell. This is an arms race we can't afford to start because if we lose the consequences could be disasterous. Best to just keep the current status quo.
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@Imabench
I think you are focusing on the wrong aspect of this thread. If a man links a spreadsheet then starts talking about litterally excavating the afterlife you aren't supposed to read through the spreadsheet!
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@Alec
Let me get this sraight... In 2020 you believe that hell is an actual physical place within the Earth? That actually exists and is possible to dig to? That was put there by the big cheese himself and that you can just dig it up no problem? Is this, am I understanding this right?
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@3RU7AL
And (IFF) you accept that argument as fact (THEN) "YHWH" is incomprehensible and any words or laws attributed to it are twisted and unreliable "interpretations" by mere mortal worms.
Ah, okay I see where you are coming from now.
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@Vader
if you are taller, you are more likely to die sooner as well
Is this actually the case or is this just a statistical anomaly caused by the fact that the average man is taller and has a shorter lifespan than the average woman?
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I used to meditate and experience astral traveling. It felt very real and I could swear I was looking down on myself, but common sense and logic say that it is more likely it was just my mind playing tricks on me. The sensation of astral traveling was not evidence for it, and it would be stupid to call it evidence
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@Barney
That was initially a very confusing report
Figured it might be, that is why I included the explanation lol.
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@3RU7AL
Just watched the video. It is a good quality video but I don't see how it dismantles Abrahamic law. It just summarizes the book of Job, and a very short summary at that leaving out what I think are the best bits.
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@Mopac
Go find a post where I say that reality is not ultimately real. You won't be able to, but while you are looking you will find several dozen in which I say that it is lol.
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Premise one: The Ontalogical Argument requires a maximum being to necissarily exist in every possible reality in order to be sound.
Premise two: It is possible to imagine a possible reality where no beings of any kind exist
Conclusion: The Ontalogical Argument is not sound.
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@Mopac
If you refuse to accept that God is The Truth
I never did refuse to accept that, totally unjustified accusation on your part. In fact we can make that number two.
1) Jesus is part of the Trinity that makes up god.
2) God is The Truth
3)
Just need verification on whether it is possible to have a personal relationship with God and the list will be completed.
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I didn't say Job is easy to read and the rest is not, I said Job is well written and the rest is not. Those are two very different statements!
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@Mopac
This is not a topic about Christianity.
According to you this topic is about removing superstition "like weeds by the root". So, the idea that it is possible to have a personal relationship with God... Is that accurate or is that a superstition that needs to be removed?
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@Mopac
Certainly We believe in The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit.
Okay out of the three things I asked you for that can be number one.
1) Jesus is part of the Trinity that makes up god.
2)
3)
We were also taught that it is possible to have a personal relationship with God through things such as prayer and faith. Would you agree with that or am I being delusional?
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@Greyparrot
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@DynamicSquid
Okay, just curious then about what your opinion regarding toasted bread on subs is. I understand you are against it for regular sandwiches but subs are certainly a different food altogether. This is (probably) my last question for you.
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@EtrnlVw
@Mopac
@Etrnl
And now with post 121 you see my other point. He avoids at all costs making any statement that is not a truism because it hurts his proto-ontological script.
@Mopac
As I have told you before in the past I have been to quite a few Orthodox Church services. One thing they definitely agreed on is that Jesus is part of the Trinity that makes up god. Did they get that part right in your eyes Mr. Wiseman?
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@DynamicSquid
I've never ordered a BLT from subway...
Do you eat at Subway occasionally and if so what do you usually order?
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@EtrnlVw
Yeah, read post 119. He actually gave a straight answer this time. You see what I mean now right?
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@Mopac
I can not teach Christianity to someone who thinks they already understand it. In fact, that is my biggest obstacle here. People already think they understand Christianity when they don't.
Teach us then. Let's start simple, how about you tell us five facts about God? I will even fill in the first two for you.
1) God exists
2) God is ultimate reality
3)
4)
5)
Fill in the other three yourself to teach us a bit about Christianity, then you won't have to whine about how everyone is ignorant of Christianity anymore!
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@Speedrace
@PressF4Respect
Post 29 by me is a reply to a post that has since been deleted. Because of this post 29 by me no longer makes any sense and makes me look like a crazy person. Please remove post 29 for this reason Mr. Forum mod dude.
Obviously if one of you look at post 29 and it is not by me then the other of you already got to it so don't delete it in that case. Oh, feel free to remove this post after post 29 by me is removed thanks.
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Job always was my favorite book from the Bible because the narrative actually makes sense and has some decent quality writing as opposed to other books of the old testament that tended to be like "okay first this happened then this happened then this happened then this, the end."
Have not watched either of the videos yet. Will probably do so sometime tonight.
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@BrotherDThomas
It sounds like you are truly doing God's work brother. Keep it up! Praise Jesus!
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@Mopac
I didn't say that God wasn't conscious.
Okay so you don't say he isn't. Would you be willing to admit that you do think he is?
Also still need to know whether you think Santa is real.
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@EtrnlVw
I guess what he's trying to say is that sense God exists despite your unbelief, so does the Ultimate Reality whether you claim it or not.
@Etrnl
That is not at all what he is saying. He is saying that I secretly to believe in God and am just not willing to admit it. Watch this.
@Mopac
As you know I have said many times in the past that I believe reality is ultimately real but I don't believe it is capable of thought or intent or that it posseses personhood etc. Do I believe in God? Please tag etrnl in your answer to this question so they can see it.
@Etrnl
Assuming Mopac gives a straight answer to the above (he sometimes does, though admittedly it is rather rare) he is going to say yes. Another way to think of it is like this:
Statement A: Ultimate Reality exists and is consious. We call this god. Nobody can deny that ultimate reality exists but there are some such as Discipulus that think it is not conscious therefore Discipulus does not think god exists. He is incorrect on that point and I would like to have a discussion with him some day regarding the merits of our opposing views.
Statement B: Ultimate Reality exists and is consious. We call this god. Nobody can deny that ultimate reality exists therefore nobody can deny that God exists. Discipulus says he does not think god exists but that is wrong, he believes reality is ultimately real so that is his god. Either he doesn't know he thinks god exists or he is unwilling to admit it. Since we already agree on this no discussion is really required, I just need to make him realize/admit that he already agrees with me.
Read statement A and B carefully. I think you will find yourself agreeing with A and disagreeing with B. Mopac is the opposite. He says he disagrees with A and agrees with B.
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@EtrnlVw
It's not a far fetched proposition to consider that reality is indeed aware
Whether he is correct or not isn't the point. The point is that he is trying (poorly) to convince people that they already agree with him when such is obviously not the case.
You are familiar with Mopacs script right? The whole "you believe reality is real therefore you believe God exists" bit that he does?
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@Mopac
God is The Ultimate Reality, not "reality+consciousness".
So god isn't conscious then? God is incapable of thought, action, speech, etc.?
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Reality + consciousness = god
Mopac believes that reality exists and that it is conscious, thus he believes in God.
There are people that believe reality exists but do not believe it is conscious, thus these people do not believe in god.
Pretty simple concept. It has been explained to Mopac enough that he definitely understands it by now, he just willfully ignores it because his proto-ontological apologetics fall apart if he does not.
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@EtrnlVw
Basically in a nutshell it's the conscious reality of God we are proposing that would be the ultimate reality. Since nothing exists outside of that or independent of that it is the ultimate, sounds cheesy I know lol, but it's actually legit. Mopac just doesn't know how to articulate that for whatever reason.
The reason is because he prefers to stick to truisms rather than actually talk about what he believes because he thinks he can morph that into a big "gotcha!" with every one of his posts. The underlined portion of your post is an example of this. It is not an obvious truism that reality is conscious so Mopac avoids mentioning that he thinks that it is because he knows he has no good justification for this claim.
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The church has taught that God is the ultimate reality
Also that God is consious and spoke the world into existence and a dozen other things.
Is it delusional to believe reality is concious? Is it delusional to believe Jesus was just a normal human? Why or why not?
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“He’s black” (racism)
Isn't he supposed to be blue? I thought he was supposed to be blue.
Anyway I haven't seen it either. This is the first I am hearing of it.
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@Mopac
You could say that God spoke the world into existence.
Sure, and I could also say that Santa gives coal to naughty children. I would have to substantiate that with something a little more concrete than "The dictionary says that Santa is Father Christmas and you believe Christmas exists therefore you believe in Santa."
The act of giving coal is an extra attribute given to Santa that is not given to Christmas.
The act of speaking things into existence is an extra attribute given to God that is not given to reality.
Do you believe in Santa btw?
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@zedvictor4
As David Icke said. Sometimes I think that we "out sheep the sheep".
Tbf he also said to all his sheep followers that the world is rules by interdimensional lizard people.
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@Greyparrot
"Not My President"
You are acting like the blue ties invented this phrase. Pretty sure I heard a lot more red ties say this in the first week of Obama getting elected than I have heard from the blue ties during Trump's entire term.
"Orangemanbad"
This I have 100% never heard from a blue tie.
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@zedvictor4
Obstinate may have been a better choice of words.
What I mean is that the both of them are intentionally going out of their way to avoid advancing the conversation. That is not what the word debate means. It's like a pair of six year olds shouting "yeah-huh" and "nuh-uh" at each other repeatedly.
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And his list is nothing when he puts Dr.F, the king spammer that spammed 3k posts and was banned for spamming as a "must read member"
Verified.
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Mopac: God is just the super reality, I am not going to ascribe any other attributes to it.
Also Mopac: Oh by the way the super reality can talk also it definitely said this specific thing.
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@drafterman
@SirAnonymous
@Singularity
So anyway eventually he will either admit he doesn't think Santa exists or he will say something like "Santa exists in people's minds as a figment of their imagination" or something like that (which is the same as saying Santa does not exist).
Once he does that just cite the dictionary definition of Santa in my old thread and follow the hypothetical 7 year old childs script (same as mopacs script but with two words changed). Make sure to bring up the dictionary definition of Santa = Christmas. Mopac loves dictionaries.
I have to go to work now so... Have fun I guess.
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@Vader
Sadly, only the greek women and the guys touched the lamb.
Non-Greeks are a bunch of nerds (says the guy that is like, 90% Anglo-Saxon).
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