Lemming

True, Offending the larger population, by over worrying about the smaller population,

Seems to me more likely to decrease, rather than increase enlistment,

Though I don't know statistics.

Mandatory sensitivity training. . .

I suppose there's logic in indoctrination (I don't mean indoctrination in a bad way)

But it's irritating to have to go, be it military or office,

Also annoying when it speaks views one doesn't agree with.

True, the dog mask photo is rather the 'opposite, of intimidating.

Russia. . .

Well, they're still losing the war I here,

Though that isn't necessarily a reflection on the soldiers,

Italian soldiers in one or both of the World Wars, were said to be excellent, but led by generals incompetent, maybe also badly supplied.

. .

Personally, military ad I'd prefer, would just be an honest, no glamour look and expectation of one's time in the military,

Might not recruit a lot of people though.

Of homosexual rape,

I don't know the statistics,

And maybe it's like a prison thing,

Surrounded by dudes all the time, even the straight people get a bit gay,

Or about dominance, humiliation, rather than sexual attraction.

. . .

Not that someone being gay means they're going to be a rapist.

A sailboat, need not be large, just large enough to have a cabin to sleep in, and store some small amount of effects.

It bothers me at times, that I've not the qualities in me,

To attempt to live long beyond any previous human lifespan,

Also bothers me that people I meet in the everyday, have never had similar desires,

Though such people 'do exist,

So sayth the internet, I suppose.

I think so as well,

No matter the people who claim slippery slope a fallacy.

Britain could have taken the world,

But they slacked.

@Greyparrot

They could probably keep more people, if they didn't require people rank up to stay in the military,

Plenty of people are good at their job, stay in good health,

Not as if the military 'has to hire people on for another contract.

Polygamy.

Just read, Porto Bello Gold by Arthur D. Howden Smith,

How greedy, those pirates in the novel.

I don't see myself why being able to survive out the womb, ought be the definition of personhood,

The time a people might 'choose to grant said existence certain 'rights, perhaps,

But personhood seems to me a different question.

My mind was actually on this topic a few days ago,

As I was thinking about Fantasy novels,

In some, intelligent animals or intelligent mythical creatures exist,

Sometimes intelligent carnivores exist,

I'd suppose such a world would at times have a sort of protocol,

After capturing prey,

Whether it is wearing clothing,

Try to remember if you've ever heard of this descripted creatures before,

Whether it has tools,

Uses tools,

Builds houses,

And so on,

Though,

Animals build burrows, dams,

Crows can use tools,

Some intelligent animals lack appendages to do many activities we associate with intelligence,

Or perhaps have different types of language, such as body language, or frequency we can't hear,

Have different socialization,

I've seen dogs in sweaters,

Might just be too scared to act intelligent,

Though all I say above, doesn't 'quite say what personhood ought be defined as,

Also 'this comes to mind somehow,

I suppose dogs respond to their names once conditioned,

Though I'm doubtful they think to themselves, my name is Spot.

. . .

I suppose if someone ate my dog,

I'd say they ate Spot,

Rather than they ate my 'dog,

But perhaps this is  anthropomorphizing?

Hm, I don't think so.

Though anthropomorphizing, to relate human qualities, is different than to relate 'person qualities, perhaps.

I suppose 'natural roads,

Such as roads created 'by travel, such as grass, wood, and bush, being tramped down into the ground,

That people 'happen to travel as an easy road,

Still, intentional roads, even untraveled, seem to me roads,

Fulfilling their purpose of shape, though perhaps not their use.

Ah, I see and read it now,

2022-110= 1912

Do you mean that?

Whether so, or not,

Well, I'm not really sure how China is classified,

What your constitution says,

You're a one party system I hear,

And that party has large power,

Corruption, tight control of power, can occur in a Monarchy, or Party.

I'd suppose complete freedom of speech, protest, strike,

'Can throw wrenches in the works of society,

Take America or Canada for example, trains and Truck, strikes, discouraged by the government,

Eh, or lot of other stuff in our history,

Society 'does change, if it's not tightly held, I think,

But holding it tightly can choke a society, not to mention abuses, safety in power, by those holding.

Still, maybe it's just something to have in balance,

Let communities more self govern,

Discourage monopolies,

Try to keep 'enough central authority.

@Self

I wonder what it is that 'makes a people,

Just thinking this idly, in my lack of sleep, and thinking on the old world,

It's fluctuations of territory,

Shared culture, shared stakes, I'd suppose,

Blood, language, geography, government,

People often want to protect their group,

Seize land, expand,

Map lines beneath feet of similar speech.

. . .

Though, perhaps as world homogenizes, they become more as sports teams.

If people can choose to eat a food they find unpleasant at first,

But come to acquire a taste for liking it,

If people can choose to give in to their anger or calm,

Act one way or another,

Deepening a psychological rut in their mind, that is difficult to remove one's wheel from,

If one can feed sadness with isolation, lack of diet, and much pain,

What can't be chosen?

. . .

Well, some things I suppose,

But difficult to choose 'once addicted to a drug, or in a psychological rut, a tumor in one's brain, or weak will and peer pressured.

But practically speaking, generally speaking,

One's will can go in directions,

Be encouraged from inward, outward, here and there.

I hope not,

Though it'd be an interesting turn of events in my life,

Albeit torturous and deadly, in a number of scenarios.

What WW3 would you be expecting?

And what'd it mean for Romania?

I like extending my life, myself.

There are still moments I want out of life,

I'd think the same for others, but everyone has their own circumstances,

I hope there are still worthwhile, to you, moments in life as well,

So if joking about it helps, well, it helps.

If this 'was another life lived,

Myself as a movie,

Conscious the one feeling, thinking, memories,

Everything 'still happening in the brain, body, but not consciousness,

Consciousness watching, feeling a movie, learning,

Learning until enough is learned,

Then 'being One, with existence again,

But my Ego cannot stand such,

My imagination not perceive, such.

. . .

Hm, still reading opinions,

Simulation theory and a deity theory,

Both seem flawed to me,

Hm,

Eternal reoccurrence, in a some weird time way, where 9 seconds in, we wind back on the first second, not in repetition, but the first second occurs, until the 9th second? Time doesn't repeat, it just plays once, and ends on itself, without repeating,

I can't quite visualize time that way.

Also not sure it 'solves any more than the first two suggestions,

Even if a man was cloned, and the clone given exact memories, still just 'another guy, to my thinking.

I don't see it as a good argument against the soul,

Not that I believe in souls, I just don't think the above a decent argument,

If someone believed a simulation was real, and they were an evil person in the simulation, murdered for example,

What would they be out of the simulation?

Did any of the acts in the simulation 'matter?

I suppose they did, as the man was effected by them,

If other people were in the simulation, I suppose they did, as those people were effected by them.

But I can't imagine a simulation 'more than what we are now.

. . .

Plato's Cave, often talks about how great it is to leave the Cave,

Must it be so,

Outside might be cold,

Perhaps outside of the Cave is just a bigger cave.

I don't believe in simulation theory myself,

Though I suppose some theist beliefs, that there is a world beyond this one, match to that.

To some, Hell is not suffer for justice, or suffer for arbitrary,

But to purify,

Painful it is, to be in withdrawal, or see one's mistakes towards others, harm caused.

. . .

Still, I can't 'see myself,

In my mind's wanderings of consciousness, of soul, of action, reaction,

Having difficulty describing ghosts or out of body experience in video game,

I suppose it doesn't 'need to be explained,

But I like understanding things, or rational explanations,

Well, 'sometimes, admittedly there's a 'lot in plots where I just say, I don't care, it's cool,

Hm,

Maybe it's more a problem with 'reality, 'my problem with reality, I mean,

Though a materialist,

I don't find it satisfactory in explanation,

Though a nihilist, I don't find it satisfactory in explanation,

Absurd, madness, trying the same thing,

Same stone up the hill,

Ramble.

. . .

What be,

Consciousness and First Cause?

How does cloning organs work?

Would one have to wait X years for the cloned heart to age/develop far enough that it can be transplanted?

To my memory, 'one of the causes of my Atheism, was Ego, Self Interest, Greed,

I loved myself far more than anyone else,

Generally speaking,

Likely there are theoretical situations, in which I would act against my own interests, maybe, conventionally speaking.

. . .

Even when I consider something such as Tolstoy's faith, and my own yearning,

Still, I love myself too much,

To let go of my values,

And I'm not talking 'good values, conventionally speaking,

But evil values, conventionally speaking, that make me who I am.

What's your opinion on women's rights,

That is to say, what rights do you think a woman ought have?

True that,

One wants for a comfortable body, and well functioning taste buds.

@#59

Well, I certainly think what you say, is worth thinking on,

Though I can't say I agree with 'all the implications or direction, that I think I see.

Thanksgiving.

: D

Some situations are more expected to occur than others,

I think committing a crime would 'greatly increase the odds of me going to jail,

I'd rather not get over feeling bad for conning people,

Eh, bit of an overstatement, to say work from dawn to dusk, or lazy.

I would agree you're right though, that people can get a degree in this or that, pursue higher paying jobs,

Or just jobs they enjoy more than other jobs.

I'm not brave enough to risk jail,

Also wouldn't feel good conning people, probably.

There 'are smart and lucky people,

People who find gold nuggets in rivers,

People whose idea light off, sell well, like Facebook,

Though in any of those, I suppose there's 'still work, effort,

Hm, I'm also a bit lazy, perhaps,

Also can't think of any ideas, paths, that I think are winners.

Well 'I'm not going anywhere,

I'm comfortable enough where I am.

Other people though, have different desires.

Governments at times, want for certain skills, or money, and encourage immigration.

Well, if I 'renounced Citizenship, I could save up money,

Might be some fee to join some other countries, I couldn't say.

Might be a person doesn't even renounce citizenship, just 'lives in another country,

Certain countries currency is worth more than others,

So one could perhaps save up money, then live in another country longer, cheaper.

Eh, looking at Google, there's a lot of technical and legal talk,

But people 'do move to different countries,

As you say though, can be a cost.

Justice System,

Rehabilitation,

Mitigation,

Revenge,

?

Caused me to remember this thread,

Of the situation, I say again, I don't think it matters one's intention,

The situation is 'still bad.

Of the individuals however,

Their intentions would matter I suppose,

As a person who 'thought their act was right, might be convinced otherwise,

As a person who thought their act was wrong, might be difficult to trust.

Then again,

Not always easy to convince fanatics.

While people who know their action are wrong,

Might be trusted by authoritarians,

That the individual will act in their own interest, and do what the authority 'wants done. Even be it conventionally evil.

. . .

A fanatic 'might be punished differently, as they might learn if convinced,

While the individual acting in their own interest, might require punishment and expect to be held accountable, to change.

They aren't punished differently because one is 'worse,

But because their motivations are 'different.

Hm, and yet, a person in a coma, 'still IS,

Though their thoughts are off,

Their body, brain, are there,

Consciousness still there, just beneath a blanket,

Seen as a violation of the person, to touch their body, or brain,

As their consciousness is still 'there, just under a blanket,

But is it 'possibility? Or under a blanket?

Or something else?

I don't know,

Might depend on how patriotic I felt, how much I felt like expressing such, even privately in donation.

Problem 'could be avoided, by government owning 'most of the land, resources, public utilities,

But such would require some form of single owning individual or notion.

So that donations become unnecessary to large governments function.

Though those forms of government, like all forms of government, have 'expected problems.

. . .

I suppose rather than donating your chosen 'percentage of income,

You are taxed a set percentage, but are allowed to say where it goes.

I'm not sure it'd even be possible to remove all of one's senses, yet remain conscious,

After all conscious of pain,

Conscious of thoughts, attention,

Sure, remove the 5 senses, and some others,

Still we're sensing ourself,

Our thoughts, memories,

. . .

To not be conscious of oneself, is to be 'unconscious, coma, no longer aware, to cease, off mode, frozen in ice,

. . .

Our thoughts after all, sofar as I know, are electrons moving in our brain, electrons of our thoughts,

Also 'subconscious thoughts, unconscious reactions, heartbeat,

Much we need 'not be aware of, yet functions,

. . .

What does pain look like?

Is it a symbol?

Do the electrons and paths line up in some 3dimentional fashion, and 'this is pain?

Can only certain materials line up in the rune?

Is it a consensus instead?

Pain imaginary creation of a caucus?

3 stars in the sky, unconnected, make a triangle.

Ahhh, nonsense.

@Athias

I don't see how societies power is an illusion,

Though I would agree it is made of smaller groups,

Perhaps country the largest group, then smaller factions within, smaller faction withing those factions, and so on.

I would agree there is some inconsistency in the terminology of consent, even for adults,

But would argue this is why additional clarifiers are often made in arguments, such as informed consent, in medical for example.

I'd agree I see great value in one's right to themself,

A society that uses people for the good of the many,

Or some utilitarian goal,

I find a bit dislikable,

And admit such is even in American society, the military draft for example.

For younger individuals,

They've yet to acquire the ability to make living wills,

As opposed to older individuals,

If an older individual failed to make preparations, then lost their mind, it can be difficult to know what they would have wanted.

@Intelligence_06 #25

While I'd agree that preferences can be discovered,

I'd also argue that preferences can be conditioned,

I would admit though, that I think it likely people have inherent preferences, nature,

But if someone by nature, is inclined to be an alcoholic,

Just being 'inclined isn't reason to become or stay an alcoholic,

I'm not saying gays or trans are as bad, by my alcoholic example,

But that unless a society or individual views the natural inclination as good or neutral, That it is an inclination, is not reason enough to pursue it.

@#41

What are, the modern social expectations at a modern social cost?

Freedom, 'is important to people, often.

Societies interest takes priority, because of power.

Society, assumably has more power than the individual, or few,

Though the individual or few may still wish to follow their own values.

I'd agree it's a fair bit cr*ppy, to be 'born into an expectation/contract.

Children put their name on their homework, signifying ownership of the answers given to the questions,

Though that's not quite a 'contract, I suppose.

Going by this random bit of internet,

. . .

It doesn't sound that minors can contract, generally speaking,

Though it sounds more 'legal, than philosophical.

Going off the grid is required, I'd argue,

Due to interactions had with society,

Laws are ever existing in humans,

Even in gated communities, city limits, small laws exist.

Of being informed and parity of power,

I'd suppose that we use ages of consent as 'rough guidelines,

There exists adults of weak information and power,

There exist minors of information and power,

But minors perhaps are more often 'not informed or in power, also hormones, in care of guardians,

Very old individuals, also at times not informed, not in power, dementia, aged weak muscle, in care of nursing home.

Our interest matter, if our power and/or laws say they matter,

America is still big on individual power, but 'not 'completely.

People aren't property though,

Not objects, that is, (kind of)

Guardians are limited in 'what guidance they can give charges,

'Required to provide minimum living standards by society.

Measure of extreme is decided by society mostly,

Also individuals involved I suppose,

Society makes laws,

Some kids run away,

Other people's measure matters because of power.

Society doesn't like it when parent breaks their babies bones for crying, and society has the developed morals, laws, and power, to hold the  guardian accountable.

I suppose the anecdotal accounts give example that we are 'not islands unto ourselves,

Mob rule, well , yes, I suppose,

Basic Social contract - Wikipedia theory, I'd say,

It's mildly annoying to be influenced by society at times, I suppose, but unless I want to go off the grid into the wild. . . .

For the if they can't consent, they can't refuse,

Well, I suppose it's a bit gray, (Depending on age)

How well informed, minimum parity of power, 

Of course kids 'do express preferences for this or that, make choices.

. . .

I suppose as you say, society can just say 'legally can't consent.

Somehow I don't like the idea,

Suppose we had a pill that could give instant abs,

If I'm not the type of person to diet and exercise,

I feel as though I ought not 'have abs,

Sure physical appearance, not 'always reflection of inner person, habits, outward efforts, . . .

. . .

Course on another hand, video game avatars I use don't look like me,

But that's more like pretending to be someone else,

Or watching a movie of a character as you move them about,

Or playing with action figures.

What is a good life?

Is it to eliminate the basic fears,

Of war, hunger, shelter,

But when work is not necessary,

What remains?

Play?

Discussion?

But how can factions 'fail to develop,

As they argue on what to value?

Then returns war, hunger, exposure.

Restrict the factions ability to war,

Are chains then, the ideal?

No one able to infringe on each other's freedom, one might say, the epitome of freedom, to some.

Yet how bothersome it'd be,

To know oneself, in no control, a pet,

How great the fear, that one is helpless, if evil intentioned seized the control.

Remove the fear,

Is this 'living as a human?

I ramble.

Song was a random recommendation on YouTube, made me think of this thread.

The part about 'questioning people of their politics, makes me frown a bit, though rest I like.

America 'does have problems, in the past, now.

But I suppose our military 'is strong,

Communities are able to make their own laws (To a degree),

Number of freedoms,

Speech, travel, upward mobility chance, somewhat just justice system.

We 'are a nation of immigrants 'still in my mind though, people traveled because they didn't like their previous spot, why not travel again?

Perhaps 'forever, given the modern tech of travel, and how eager 'some people are for open borders.

@#7

I'd prefer to say, charge of their guardians,

Than slave of their parents, myself,

We restrict children from certain pursuits,

Encourage directions,

'Force directions,

So long as it's not so extreme that society disagrees, what's the issue?

By restrict certain pursuits, I mean children are given curfews, restricted from associating with certain people,

. .

By directions, I mean we indoctrinate our children, 'even the hands off free range parents, I'd argue, doing nothing is a choice, if one chooses to live in a certain area, say certain ideas, molding is occurring.

. .

Force directions, school, timeouts, spankings in some families.

. . .

. . .

In some families, children work, do chores,

Born into life, conscripted into life,

Though free when of age, except in some societies.

. . .

. . .

I'm a bit leery of a kid choosing their sexuality, at the point of surgery,

,

Might be I'm making an unconnected argument,

But if a kid is old enough to chop their d*** or t***s off,

Then wouldn't they be old enough to consent to sex?

Which I've always argued against in the past,

And still do now.

I wonder how one might turn off all their senses, numbing agents?

I'm still thinking on that life after death question,

And because of the question of what consciousness is,

I find myself unable to answer,

Not that I've not doubted my own existence or narrative before,

But because the question was brought up,

I've now recalled the question differently, or 'am different myself.

But how can I say what will happen after,

If I can't quite pin down what 'I, we, you, 'are?

P1: What happens to X after death?

P2: What happens to 'what after death?

P1: X.

P2: What?

P1: X.

P2: . . .

Of course I know the practical answer,

Practical to conversing with oneself and others,

But that practical answer doesn't feel 'true, fulfilling,

Nor do the offered possibilities.

Well, I'm glad that you have a professional you can talk to,

Even if it's a difficult topic to discuss.

I am disappointed, that this is not a thread about sharing types of food we like,

Incidentally I like Swiss cheese,

Acquired the taste after eating in hospital so much, salad bar had cubes of cheese.

I don't mind sharing food in a restaurant,

Adds more variety, isn't much to ask for,

Though I don't ask for other's food, I do accept a bite or two on occasion,

Sometimes they or I aren't hungry enough to eat all, so sharing solves a problem.

Sorry to hear that,

Any reason in particular?

Well, perhaps we're all dice.