Mopac

Wroooooong.

One day you'll get honest I'd hope.

Orthodox consider it a heresy.

The Church Fathers existed since apostoloic age, this is not a backpedaling. The Orthodox position has never changed. The Orthodox Church has nothing but reverence for the bible, and in my experience, we use it more than other churches. Even let it speak for itself.

You are simply uninformed.

You don't know what the bible is, You are groping in the dark.

I'm not saying anything the church wouldn't say.

More usual foaming at the mouth. No charity.

Boring.

Then you must believe in truth.

Well, here is some good news. The Truth is God.

You don't have to be an atheist anymore.

There is your good news for the day, fellow flawed human being.

"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

There are thousands of years worth of Church Tradition preserved in The Orthodox Church. No other church has better knowledge of the bible.

To all the non-Catholics in the west, know that your ancestors were right to break away from Rome, because they are a renegade church... However, you have lost much in the process. Consider joining back up with the rest of us. Give Orthodoxy a look see. It is the Church descended from the Apostles. It is the true church. 

To all the Roman Catholics in the west, consider returning to Orthodoxy. The Roman Church has corrupted the creed, has waged "Holy" Wars, and has done more damage to Christendom than any other institution on the planet. The Bishop of Rome is not king of Christendom, Jesus Christ is. The Catholic Church at the time of the schism was made up of 5 "Popes". What makes more sense, that 4 Popes rebelled against the 1 or that 1 Pope rebelled against the other 4? Consider that The New Testament is written in Greek, not Latin! 

Christians of the west, consider Orthodoxy. It is the Apostolic Church.

For those who make The Bible an idol before God, as well as the atheists who argue as if The Bible is God, I came across this while reading, and I thought it was well put and worth repeating here....

"There emerged in the Orthodox Tradition the position that the Bible is the record of truth, not the truth itself.. According to the Church Fathers, the truth itself is God alone." ~Father Theodore Stylianopoulos, Professor of New Testament at Holy Cross School of Theology

And I'd also like to note that The Orthodox Church's liturgy is almost entirely scripture, so there aren't many other churches where you'd get a bigger dose of the bible. 

Atheists take themselves as being God, that is why they say there are no gods. Competition, you know?

That is also why they embrace arbitrariness. This is more obvious in the ones who aren't very bright. Less so in those that don't speak enough to give themselves away.

But they really don't know what they are doing.

I'm only useless to engage in because I'm the first person you've ever debated who actually has an understanding of theology.

But by all means, keep debating the children, heretics, and cranks if it makes you feel smart.

Believing in The Truth is a logical fallacy.

lol

The Ultimate Reality exists

But if you want to keep saying, "It is the truth that there is no truth!".

I'm not the one who has adopted the loony toons position.

All someone has to do is take themselves as being God and they will never lose an argument. They will always believe they are right, because they have made themselves the measure of what is right.

How miserable are those who embrace arbitrariness. 

I'm not really impressed with your WWE posturing ad unsubstantiated assertions of dominance.

Look how haughty you are, telling me what I believe. You are deserving of mockery.

I was raised on sex, drugs, and rock and roll, and the religion that I came to on my own is certainly not evil. I think I would know my religion better than you, who have a predisposition toward presumptuousness.

I am always happy to cast away the shadows of ignorance with the light of truth, and is my desire that all come to knowledge of The Truth.

The church is the proper interpreter of scripture not you.

Funny how the church doesn't agree with anything you ever say, isn't it?

Really, you don't even have the right to appeal to scripture, because it doesn't belong to you.

The writer of that song wished that the Babylonians received what they gave his people. What did they do? They slaughtered their children. This was not a song written by God, it was a song written to God by someone who was VERY HUMAN.

Yet the Church teaches to bless those who curse you and repay not evil with evil.

You are like the ancient Romans who accused Christians of cannibalism because they didn't understand the mystery of the Eucharist. You don't know what you are doing. I forgive you. It would be better for you in the end if you repented and turned away from your wickedness. 

Nobody I know teaches that only Christians are moral.

Godliness with contentment is great gain.

If your happiness is contingent on the vanities of this world, you do not have real happiness. 

Maybe you would be better off not attaching paganism to your charity.

There is actually a secular humanist charity in my area. They go out once a month and hand out food and coffee to homeless people. You know where they do it? At a big gathering organized by Christians.

Charity work is built into Christianity. 

Not because feeding people is the religion, but because the love of Christ makes this a real pressing issue of the heart.

I am not a Roman Catholic. My church excommunicated the Roman Catholics almost a thousand years ago.

My church has been persecuted by the Roman Catholics.

And we know the truth, that they broke away from us, not the other way around as they would have you believe.

But everytime you accuse my people of evil because how our persecuters have behaved, you are adding to the fire that my people are chucked into.

Only in the last century, over 20 million Orthodox Christians have been martyred for their faith. We do not call crusades, we are at the whim of the evil forces of this world that even deceive you.

That is why we pray unto God, Forfive them, they know not what they are doing. And that is why we happily go to the grave for our faith, because we know where we are going, and our love is such, that we lay down our life for our friends. 

I am not a Roman Catholic. They have altered the faith, and are not Orthodox.

I can think of at least 2 churches that feed hundreds every weekday, 4 that feed hundreds every weekend, many others who walk around with wagons and food, several clothing closets, and likely a great. deal I am missing... right here in the city I live in.

I found this to be the case in most major cities in The United States with few exception, and even then not a totally absent presence, Christian organizations doing this.

There is a food bank as well in my city, and it tends to operate out of church pantries. 

The Christians in my city help the homeless, low incomes, single mothers, orphans, etc.

The work is getting done.

The point I am trying to make is that the vast majority of real charitable organizations I know of that I can actually see doing these things are Christian.

That isn't to say there aren't ones that aren't. There is a particular charity in my area that has done a great deal of good for kids living on the street that is not a religious organization. There are a lot of people who work in that organization that do so because they are Christian though.

Doing these type of works are buikt into the Christian faith. There are some protestants that incorrectly believe that you are saved only by faith, but it is well understood in Orthodoxy that faith and works are inseperable from eachother. Not that we are saved by works, there are no works that will save you, but that if you have faith the works come naturally.

I feel very compelled to do good for the homeless and disadvantaged, and it is not a certain time of year for me, it is an all year thing. There are many who come to volunteer and help around thanksgiving and Christmas, but there are 10 other months of the year, and loving people is more than a quick conversation and a gift.. it's an ongoing relationship. 

And that is what Christians are supposed to do. Love people. Help people. Not because they deserve it, in fact, no one deserves it, but out of love. I say this because wicked entitled people like to accuse Christians and guilt them into giving. Charity dooes not come from guilt, it comes from love, and charity by nature is not an entitlement.

That's a shame, because by in large, Christian charities are actually the ones who are going out and feeding people.

Year round.

Don't believe me?

Give up everything and wander the streets for a time, you will see who is actually doing the work.

The saints are pretty inspiring if you ask me.

Bust out the scotch and cigars

Orthodox Christians, by the way, is nicknamed the church of martyrs because there is a rich tradition of the church getting screwed mercilessly by every evil in the world while people like you blame usnfor everything heretics and schismatics do in the name of Jesus.

The Romans? They sacked and looted Orthodox Churches during their crusades and tried to replace our church leaders with Latin Bishops that bowed to the Pope.

They altered the nicene crede that all the churches agreed on.

They deposed metroplitans in the west so they could expand their influence.

They crowned a frikken Emperor who expanded the Pope's ecclesiastical authority to pretty much all of western Europe.

They fabricated documents in order to create an Earthly Kingdom in central Italy.

Hell, I can list a million evils of the Romans. The first Orthodox martyr in America was an Aleut who was tortured to death for not submitting to the Pope in Rome.

In fact, if they coukd. I am pretty sure they would continue to do all this stuff, because it's the friggen church of the antichrist.

And all these protestant breakaway churches who have lost their roots from Orthodoxy would not likely even exist if it wasn't for how tyrannical and evil the Roman Church is.

Anyway, we love Romans Catholics too. Their church has gone renegade though, and they have added way too many innovations to the faith. Thry don't even let their priests marry. Their clergy is overrun by perverts. It's shameful.

The Roman Church was excommunicated from the 4 other orthodox churches because The Roman Bishop was trying to make itself king over all of Christendom, and indeed the world.

We said, No, Jesus Christ is the king, you can't do that.

They have done more harm to Christianity than any other institution, and they still have it all wrong.

Not Roman. 

Orthodox Catholic.

Big difference.

Killing people for their beliefs is not a Christian thing to do. We don't burn people at the stake.

Orthodox Christians have been killed by Roman Catholics, Muslims, Atheists, etc.

You don't understand my faith. It is not faith in knowledge of truth, it is faith in the truth.

There is a difference.

Your faith is in fabrications of your mind, understandings, and knowledge falsely so called.

My faith is a living faith of relationship with The Truth. It is an active thing. 

I know what I believe in. I have true knowledge. It is not gnosis, it is epignosis. It is experiential knowledge. I know my God. My God who is also your God.

The only thing you know about my faith is what you see on the surface. There is no real depth to your understanding of it. I can see very clearly what you believe. It isn't the truth.

You alone.

People are tortured and killed for what I believe in. Over 20 million just in the last century.

Do you even believe what you are saying is true?

Gnosticism is faith in knowledge.

This isn't the same thing as faith in The Truth.

Live for vanity or live for Truth.

That is really the decision.

God gives a peace that surpasses understanding.

Vanity will ultimately lead to suffering and unfulfilment.

Gnosticism is a heresy

Yet The Church does not teach this.

The book is called "Revelation" by the way, that is singular.

No, you are very deceived. Satan is not your friend.

"I don't understand something, so it must be all lies"

Jesus is not a star. Jesus is The Word of God.

"All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."

Jesus is the light, not the bearer of light.

No, you don't understand. The communists want to eradicate all these religions because they are putting in its place state religion.

Christianity is certainly not communist, but you are right in that human dignity is built into Christianity.

I use The King James because it is public domain. The Greek it translates from is closer to what the Orthodox Church texts read than the modern base texts compiled from textual criticism. I do like The King James.

That said, The King James still doesn't translate everything as well as it could.

I say that as someone who reads the texts in Greek.

But none of that really matters.... Your beliefs are simply not what the church teaches. 

One thing the gnostics all have in common is that they don't really agree on much. What gives them their name is that they place their faith in what they believe is knowledge, their own understanding.

Both you and Stephen argue as a gnostic would. You have to understand that gnostics have been around for thousands of years, and recently in history there has been a great upsurgence of gnostic ideas.

The reason why this is the case is because there really are people who are trying to confuse people when it comes to faith.

Why? Makes it easier for the communists to persecute the religious.

And that might sound like conspiracy business, but I think you even know enough to realize there may be some truth to that.

I am not God.

If I insult you or offend you, I am sorry. But I am not God.

There is nothing reasonable about not believing God. You think I am just saying this? Hear me out.

The Ultimate Reality.

If this doesn't exist, there is no reality. Why would anyone believe is? 

Well, I know this is a convenient thing to believe if you wish to believe in yourself. After all, if nothing is true, that means your truth isn't any less true than anyone else.

That is why it is not written in vain, "And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: that they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."

If everything is equally invalid, these words will be meaningless words to you, because meaning is simply whatever you decide is meaningful.

It is not my intention to be mean, I sincerely want you, and indeed everyone to come to knowledge of The Truth.

You should talk to Stephen.

Even though you are both crazy, you'll probably end up agreeing simply because it's anything but the truth.

Come on madman, I'm being honest with you. You might be clever, but all of this is bunk. There are plenty of wingnuts fabricating things like this with scripture. It isn't that hard. Even I could do it.

But this isn't what the church teaches, and though you may poo poo that all away, it is relevent. Maybe the church isn't what you think it is?

The Truth doesn't change, Keith.

Because he's a discordian, that's what they do.

This is simply not what the church teaches.

I am very aware. This is why I love to call atheists and uneducated because they demonstrably are.

Know it all dipshits.

They think they are so smart, well... now they are denying Truth itself! So enlightened!

No, truly deserving of mockery. Forgive me!

And believe me, I would love to spend my time here calling people names, mocking, and tearing people down through wittisms, but that isn't why I am here. I am here to educate, and so I must fight my natural inclination to have fun while tearing people down in order to show them charity for the sake of edification.

So my intent to make fun of ignorant people in order to make myself feel better. I am here because I want people to come to The Truth, and my part in this is to sow seeds and show charity. I may never get to see these seeds grow. It is fine, I have done my duty.

And God knows I'm not perfect, but if perfect vessels were required to do this kind of work, there would be no one to do the work.

I am motivated by love, not glory.

If someone doesn't have the drive for truth, they are simply going to stay wherever they are at, no matter what environment they are in.

I would not claim that spiritual advancement can only occur in the church, nor would the church make this claim.

And when I say The Church, I mean The Orthodox Church, because it isn't like other Christian Churches.

No, thats what it means.

Can't compromise on this.

The Ultimate Reality

The Supreme Being

The Absolute

Any compromise on this does not benefit the atheist who is WRONG. I can not compromise on this anymore than I can compromise on the meanings on numbers in basic arithmetic.

A 2 is not a 3 or a 2.2... its a 2...

And this can't be compromised, because every atheist argument is contingent on compromising this, and nothing better exposes atheism as a foolish position than showing how atheists will still argue against God if that means The Truth.

In fact, you can get a whole forum of atheists to believe that The Ultimate Reality exists. As soon as you tell them that this is what God means, they will argue ahainst The Ultimate Reality.

That is because atheism by nature is the embracing of arbitrariness, it is not a valid position, neither does it deserve the charity of being entertained as valid.

It is wholly destructive, and I suhhest you ponder how what I am saying is true and get on the same page. 

Atheism is a superstitious position.

That's really that.

While there are probably some atheists who are taking part in a war against reality and truth, I think the more likely explanation is that most of them are simply uneducated or superstitious.

But I will say this, someone may not believe that they have a god, but if you look at what motivates them and makes their life worth living, you will often times find a god.

The self professed atheist, of course, doesn't really know what gods are, which is why they deny them. Even to the point of denying The One True God, which is The Truth itself.