Mopac

I have plenty of support for my position that the concept of God represents what I say it does.

But neither of you will accept evidence, because you can arbitrarily reject everything and prance around saying, "there is no proof!"

If I quote scripture, you will attack scripture.

If I quote theologians, you will reject them as being bias.

If I quote the dictionary, you will reject its authority.

Besides that, neither of you will accept that I mean what I say.

So... if either one of you want to debate through the debate system on this site, I will demonstrate that your opposition amounts to little more than vain posturing, arbitrariness, and lack of truth.

We are on a religion forum.

If you make God to be something other than The Truth you are not going by the proper theological understanding of the concept.

So we are actually debating. Your position is that 3 = 4, and I am telling you that is not correct 

The Truth is my God.

The Truth is your God.

When I say God I am saying The Ultimate Reality.

That certainly goes beyond our beliefs about it. I am talking about Truth in the truest sense.

So what is the problem?

I'm not telling you reality is anything other than what it is.

When I say The Truth, I mean The Truth as it truly is not what I believe or what anyone believes The Truth to be.

Mock and scoff all you want, but you are not respecting the ppremise of this thread which is to discuss the subject matter, not make a futile attempt at undermining it.

The topic is about the command of Jesus, not about your aversion to direction.

So if you would stay on topic, please.

I have scripture and thousands of years worth of theological thought backing me up, much of which was not in English.

Your argument is nonsensical. I know my God. The Ultimate Reality.

What I'm saying could easily be confirmed by someone who is honest and actually cared to know what was true instead of dismissing everything that goes against their aversion to anything to do with God and/or scripture.

Yet modern translations such as The New King James or The English Standard Version translate this passage in a way more faithful towards the original intended meaning.

The King James doesn't have copywrites, and for the most part it is an accurate translation of base texts that are closer to what the orthodox church uses(at least the New Testament). In this particular case, The King James doesn't capture the meaning of the text as well as it could. 

So you are actually the one who is at odds with scholarship. 

Sounds like interpretation to me.

And taking everything I said in context, it was more like "Maybe everyone deserves hell even if that isn't what they get."

And truly, the righteousness of even the best man is like filthy rags when placed next to God.

I have never been scared of hell. Maybe fear of hell motivates some, but not me. I love God because I love THE TRUTH, and my God is The Truth.

One thing at a time please, and I would prefer primary sources. As an example, the first statistical claim in the article you posted references a Brown University study.

If you could accomodate my request for ease of conversation, I would appreciate it, thank you.

It certainly does answer your question. Did you ignore my answer?

No, The God I worship and believe is The Ultimate and Reality, and this God is the one and only.

If you really wanted evidence, you'd already accept the God I profess as The God I believe. 

The God I believe is The Supreme and Ultimate Reality. This is my God. And thisnis your God whether or not you choose to accept it. This is not an arbitrary and vain declaration, but the evident truth. Your unwillingness to accept that there is nothing you can do to undermine the authority of that which is ultimately real means nothing. It is The Lord over your life.

You were born. You will die. Your life is but vapor, smoke, counted as less that dust on a scale. But The Ultimate Reality always was, always is, and always will be, because God is exactly what God is. The Supreme and Ultimate Reality.

What are you offering? Nothing.

The One who contains All Truth is God.

I don't use products that are tested on animals. I don't use products that need to be tested on animals.

If I do, I'm not aware of it. I go out of my way not to.

I don't use pharmaceuticals, and I use hygiene products that are not tested on animals. I do not use animal products. I don't eat animals or animal products.

I feel fine about it. 

The real problem with atheists is that God means The Supreme and Ultimate Reality, which means that atheism against capital "G" God is denial of The Truth.

Atheism against God is a self defeating position that exposes atheism for whatbit really is... an embrace of arbitrariness and pride.

It's pretty much satanism

No, threats of hell certainly never worked on me, neither did I find them as anything other than vain threats backed by impotence.

What brought me to God was love of The Truth, which turned out to be God.

I don't fear for my life. Fear has never been a motivator for me. My life motto used to be "No hope is what gives me guts".

I was a very reckless youth.

It has nothing to do with sharing my beliefs. If you don't love the truth, you have chosen delusion over truth.

There is nothing spectacular about this, it is what happens.

And what do you mean by live your life like a cliche?

A church/religion forum.

Seems appropriate to me.

If you love Jesus, you will follow the commandment. If not, you won't. There is no compulsion.

I don't see a scientific method being followed.

It is possible that abiogenesis is true (I don't know).

It doesn't look like science to me.

Maybe I wouldn't be the only one to gain from you explaining simply what you are talking about. Maybe I could add something to the conversation if I understood what you are saying. Who knows?

Would someone with a big ego admit ignorance? I don't think so. Why don't you teach me something?

What is there to tell you? You seem to think that if someone believes they won't die that is foolish, so you must already have some understanding of the concept. What more can I telll you about death?

The word that gets translated in John 20:17 to "touch" is in the original greek "ἅπτομαι" which is closer to a clinging to rather than a simple poking.

This is consistent with what Jesus says earlier that is is necessary that he goes away(the Son of man Jesus) so that his disciples would be granted The Holy Spirit, or Spirit of Truth.

The idea here is that they are not supposed to be clinging to this human from.

Indeed, Christians are not supposed to worship a man as God. Otherwise, why is it written in Romans..

"Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man"?

So in other words, it is a problem that arises because of translation.

You are not making an argument, you are simply making assertions about my character while contradicting what I say.

If you are willing to clarify what it is you are actually saying, I will gladly address what you are saying.

And you know, I don't think it's fair if you assume that I'm being dishonest. Surely you could show me a little more charity than that?

So you aren't going to help me understand? You think a 5 year old would understand what you are saying?

Like you know? You're just parroting off political propaganda and BS. Drugs are illegal. It is the police's job to enforce the law, and if someone doesn't cooperate, they are going to be treated rough. If someone pulls out a gun, they are likely to get shot. I don't think you understand how much these gang banger drug dealers screw everything up. Children become collateral to their turf wars.

And you know what I think? I think if you blame the police for this kind of stuff, you need to move your tail over to the projects of Chicago or something and tell me that the people who get shot for being criminals with a "they'll never catch me alive" attitude aren't asking for it.

You don't know what YOU are talking about. I grew up around this stuff, and I know what it's like to face violence every day and to have my people decimated by drugs.

It's got nothing to do with race, and I don't appreciate you associating LOW LIFE CULTURE to race. It offends me greatly, and that is what you are unintentionally doing.

There are plenty of succesful minorities. In fact, some minority groups on the whole are very succesful in terms of financial prosperity.

So no, this is not a valid example, and I refuse to accept it as such because I KNOW BETTER. So if you would please move on and five me another example....

Resisting the police is stupid, and will cause more problems.

You are literally underminig your own argument and proving my point.

There are other factors besides being a minority.

Where do you figure?

Of course I die.

But The Truth lives on.

What comments? Your trinity doesn't even make any sense to me. Can you simplify it into English?

I am certain there are other variables at play here than being a minority.

Like, you know, behaving supiciously, not cooperating with police, or actually being engaged in criminal activity, flashing weapons at police, etc.

Besides that, not all ethnic minorities are "low income".

Give me another example, because I don't buy into this one. 

Not all Christians use images. There are many Christians who would not use pictures of Jesus.

Jesus the son of man is not really the object of worship so much as it is worship of God through Jesus The Word of God.

Jesus the son of man is much like the serpent lifted up in the wilderness by Moses. The Jews don't worship the graven image of a snale any more than Christians take a man as God.

I don't think that police are brutal towards people simply because they are "minorities". Got another example?

If a truth dies, does The Truth die with it?

Give me an example in modern day America of ethnic power over another group.

I can. You presuming to know what I believe.

But I am not selling anything, neither am I trying to make myself out to be something. How am I commiting fraud?

The Supreme and Ultimate Reality is God, and this is the creator of all. There was none before, and there will be none after. My God is the eternal God, The One True God. 

I am pointing to God, who is not myself. I have nothing to gain.

It's just what had to be.

Simple enough, right?

I freely give the good news, that The Truth is salvation, The Truth sets you free, and what can be better news? We don't have to lie to ourselves or believe in ridiculous things. Abide in The Truth.

I never called you delusional or insinuated that you are.

I also think you are overreacting to what I said, because I never implied that anyone was going to hell.

You are talking to someone who has been accused of being a universalist plenty of times in his life, fyi.

What I'm getting here is that if race is at all a factor in your thinking, you are thinking mighty racist.

I guess no one thinks Jew is a race.

No, when I say ultimate reality, I literally mean what that means. The way I understand that is irrelevant to what it actually is.

You shy away from that, you are in denial of what God, with a capital "G" means. We are not talking about gods, but God.

And all of this is really off topic for this thread, so if you want to talk about this somewhere else or even challenge me to a debate, I'll discuss there 

If you believe in truths at all, you must believe in that which is ultimately real. If there is no ultimate reality, there can be no reality or truths. So, I don't think you understand what you are saying. I don't believe you really understand what I'm saying either. In fact, you are offended at what I'm saying, which I find rather baffling.

If there isn't an ultimate reality, nothing is true, there is no such thing as truth. And since we are clearly existing, that really settles the matter quite conclusively. God exists. That is what Ultimate Reality means.

You know there is truth.