Mopac

It doesn't matter what the dictionary says. The church has taught that God is the ultimate reality since the beginning,  and the evidence is in reading the historical writings of the church.

You mock what you don't understand, and so you never get understanding. Our way will always be obscure to you.

The reason I do not commit the folly of trying to prove God is because proof isn't the issue. It is an unawareness of what God means.

I don't need to prove that The Ultimate Reality is God. That is what we are talking about. If you refuse to accept what it is we are talking about, there is nothing to prove.

In otherwords, the kind of skepticism I am met with is not rational, in fact it is quite insane. Seeing that is a matter of believing that I speak in lucid terms, not woo, and considering what I say.

Lack of charity is what keeps the God deniers in the dark. And so it is shown once again that nihilistic thinking is wholly destructive and only retards the development of those who have been suckered into it.

I for the most part would say the same thing EtrnlVw did.

The Greek word here can also mean to love less when used in the context of a choice, that is, you are supposed to always love God more than anything, even family. It is also very easy to make family an idol before God. The word here actually denotes a preference.

Of course, you should love your family. 

You are mistaken to postulate an enabler of ultimate reality. The Ultimate Reality is not contingent on anything.

Iraq... Afghanistan... all these countries The US invaded in the last few decades border Iran.

I suspect that war with Iran is something The US has been preparing for.

You could say that God spoke the world into existence. 

"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

4 pages of denial. Lol.

You're an idiot. I'm not feeding you anymore.

You ask The Ultimate Reality for a name.

The Eternally Existing One speaks, "I AM THAT I AM"

That right there is a legit answer.

The orthodox view is more panentheistic. Pantheism would definitely be considered an error. God is in the universe, but also not circumscribed by it. God is bigger than the universe.

The word "God" means "The Ultimate Reality".

Once you accept that, we can talk about what God is and what God isn't.

There is no argument that stands against The Ultimate Reality.

The Ultimate Reality is God.

The deluded heathens stumble in their madness.

The Supreme and Ultimate Reality is what Truly Exists.

You are the one who is off topic. You are simply constructing an ad hominem argument.

I am irrelevant. The topic is God.

Get with it or I am not feeding you anymore.

Steven, you have to understand something. When you call me names and make pretense of having any understanding about these things when it is plain even to skeptics that you are incapable of admitting you are wrong, it only confirms in my mind that you are immature and haughty.

So now you don't even know what your own topic is about.

I believe that you probably consider this an "Aha!" question.

It isn't by the way.

I am interpreting it as your lack of respect for the subject matter, and so I will direct you to my first two responses to your question.

The Ultimate Reality is God. If you deny this God, it is a testament to your own wickedness. If you reject The Truth as God, strong delusion is the natural consequence!

Take me out of the picture, because you are debating God, not me. You have no argument that can stand against God, who offers himself as an argument. If you had The Spirit of Truth, you would see that God's argument is flawless. The only thing arguing against God does is make you look like a fool.

Self will can not overturn reality. This is not an arbitrary matter.

The Ultimate Reality exists. The Ultimate Reality is The One True God.

This is not an opinion, but the only certainty.

Why don't you discern what is being said in the rest of your post. In it is the real answer to your question.

All cre as ted things exist IN SOME SENSE. Only God exists in every sense. Existing is what makes God. If it doesn't exist, it isn't God.

Everyone in Russia right now knows that Christmas certainly exists, as today is Christmas in Russia.

But these things do not exist as God exists. God exists in a way that is not like created things. Created things exist in relation. They are contingent realities. By contrast, God is wholly other, The True Singularity, and is self sufficient. Not only does God exist, but God exists AS Reality in the truest sense. In comparison, all other existent things are illusion and do not truly exist. It is God that is ultimately real, and all existent things derive their being from God.

I KNOW God exists, and I can rightly say that anyone who denies the existence of The Ultimate Reality either has no idea what they are saying, or they are an idiot.

There is no in between.

It is futile to make an argument for Christianity when the audience refuses to get on the same page about what we mean by the words we use.

I am not making an argument for Christianity. I am telling you and everyone that this is what is meant by the word "God", and you can dispute this all you want, but it doesn't change what is true.

Atheists do  not get to tell us what is meant by the words we use. It is the evident truth that to do so is foolishness on the part of the atheist. This is, of course, consistent with the position they profess. The truth is arbitrary, reality is whatever you can get away with.

And not one of you is capable of arguing against God. To do so only makes you look like an idiot.

There already is a word for The Ultimate Reality. It is God. 

Obviously, God doesn't require worship. God doesn't require anything.

I simply said, "The Ultimate Reality"

You can't reconcile this with your own superstitions concerning God. 

The only reason you are accusing me is because you yourself lack charity, and are simply trying in vain to undermine what I say by attacking my character.

My character is irrelevant to this topic. 

It is easier to struggle with me than it is with God.

As Jesus himself says...

Your argument doesn't address what I said.

You provided me one example that contradicts every other account in the bible, even the book of omitted things(Chronicles).

And scholars both Jew and Christian agree that this is a copyist error.

It is also worth noting that the written Hebrew language changed drastically after the Babylonian exhile, and all of our earliest texts are translations.

The masoretic text, which is the source texts used by both Jews and Protestants, is in itself a more precise form of the written Hebrew that developed after Persian influences on Hebrew writing.

What I have confirmed is that the septuigant, the earliest translation of the texts in question, also contain this error about who killed Goliath. What that tells you is that this is a very early corruption of the text.

Elhanan slayed the brother of Goliath, and as the texts also show, there were more than a few Philistine giants.

So let me get this straight...

Your argument is to pick translations of the same source text?

It isn't nice to say they are going to hell if they don't  repent either.

That is the scripture he is referencing.

And what other than The Ultimate Reality can even fulfill that definition you presented? Surely whatever you think is less than The Ultimate Reality.

The Supreme and Ultimate Reality is God, and there is no other.

I stand by my observation, and no one is entitled to charity so you are wasting your effort trying to rebuke me in that  regard. I feel no guilt.

I am very nice to people, if you hadn't noticed.

If you say there is no Ultimate Reality, it is certainly the case.

Want me to lie to you? 

And everyone here knows it to, because who can say there is no Ultimate Reality? It is clear this is folly.

I am certainly attacking a position. Would you not say that someone who eats their feces is gross? 

I operate under the assumption that someone who denies God does not know what they are denying. This is a good assumption, because for 1 it is proven consistently to me, and for 2 it is charitable position to take.

What that means is that statement applies to those who are nihilists in the truest sense of the word. Those who are in denial of reality itself.

I agree.

God certainly was not invented.

If you knowingly deny God, you are delusional. You are a fool.

I am not claiming this. My position has always been that people who deny God don't know what it is they are denying, and that they are simply uneducated or badly educated.

The approach I am taking is charitable. The alternative is for me to assume and operate as if atheists are hopelessly and intentionally wicked.

Truthfully, someone who knowingly denies God can not be a good person. Denial of Truth itself is the kind of thing that people who take themselves as God do.

Have you ever been wrong? Have you ever been surprised? Have you ever learned anything? Have you ever seen an illusion?

It is naive to think that the reality you experience is the ultimate reality, because there is an overwhelming amount of evidence that works against the idea that reality as it is perceived to be is reality as it actually is.

It is no semantic trick of ours. Our faith is older than the language you speak. We have always understood God as such. The issue is not me redefining language, the issue is that YOUR language is being confused by anti-christs who don't want you to understand what we believe. That way, when these same people end up treating faith as a mental illness, locking us away to be the subject of chemical experimentation, you'll already be at the point where you can be swayed into accepting it as good for society!

But what happens if you believe I am telling you the truth? EVERYTHING CHANGES.

What am I telling you? The Truth is God. These people say God doesn't exist. Someone who claims that God doesn't exist shouldn't be trusted to know what they are saying.

The Ultimate Reality is God.

Your language hasn't been confused longer than our acceptance of this obvious fact.

And you say The Ultimate Reality exists. Good. Now you know you believe God exists. 

Because the word "God" means The Ultimate Reality, I am not being as arbitrary as your mindless rebutal would suggest.

It's written plainly in the passage what happened, and there is no finally accepting anything. You are talking to your imagination again.

And obviously you have nothing to say.

It isn't a matter of explaining anything away. It is a matter of you accepting an explanation you are given. Every other reference to this event says it is David who killed Goliath. The one that ascribes Goliath's death to another is actually talking about the brother of Goliath. This is clarified in the book of things omitted, or Chronicles.

It is a copyist error. 

If you can't accept this, what is the profit in arguing over uncertain things? There is none. 

The Bible is not intended to stand alone, it can not be removed from the context of The Church.

It's the scripture Jesus referenced from the old testament. It is from proverbs.

You know, the topic of this thread.

You don't know how scripture has been taught for 2,000 years, because you don't really respect the subject matter.

I don't understand what ebuc is saying.

A lot nicer than calling someone mentally ill, eh?

I never agreed with your defining of my language. 

The Truth is The Way It Is.

ACTUALITY.

An honest statement? No, thats obviously ridiculous. Instead of assuming I'm crazy because you can't make sense of what I'm saying, why don't you try a little harder. Try listening. Try asking honest questions with the intent to clarify, not mock.

I only recognize The Ultimate Reality as God, and there is only One. It is the evident truth that The Ultimate Reality is sovereign over all things. 

It is the evident truth that denial of this God is superstitious; that atheism towards this God is the most extreme form of nihilism, utterly self defeating, unjustifiable, and patently STUPID.

As it is an obvious fact that The Ultimate Reality is True God, and anyone who dare dispute this an IDIOT, it should be the case that anyone professing atheism should be understood as someone who is uneducated or petulant. The proper way to deal with someone who is so confused should be with charity. A real intent to guide someone suffering from such a delusion toward The Way and knowledge of The Truth. A real patience to endure abuse with long suffering. A true desire to humble oneself before The One True God, and to understand that righteous debate is about edifying one another, not the making oneself out to be something.

Dare anyone dispute it? 

There by necessity is Ultimate Reality.

The Ultimate Reality exposes all sophistry, rhetoric, science falsely so called, delusion, pretense of reason, and self will for what it is.. transient, mortal, temporary, dust in the wind. Nothing but vanity. Your life is not even as long as a blink in eternity. The Ultimate Reality always was, always is, and forever will be.

The Ultimate Reality makes an argument, and His argument is Himself. 

Dare you say, "The Truth is a lie!"?

Dare you say, "Prove to me it is true that The Truth exists!"?

Are you out of your mind?

There is no argument than can even so much as make pretense of challenging God. 

Authentic spirituality is not vague and full of woo. Authentic spirituality is abiding in The Way, not vain imaginings. It is the casting out of delusion, not the embracing of it. It is purifying of the heart, not trying to paint over it. 

It is the very real discipline of taking into account the tool you are using to measure and making sure the lens is always clean and everything is calibrated.

Real spirituality is therepeutic and makes for a more rational, emotionally stable, and dispassionate person.

Fake spirituality is toxic and leads to irrationality, emotional instability, and slavery to passion.

Real spirituality is to abide in The Way, and it sculpts someone into being a living icon of The Truth.

Fake spirituality is preoccupation with created or imagined things, and often times serves no other purpose than to puff up the ego of someone who already is blindsided by their pride.

Real spirituality comes from humility.

Fake spirituality comes from pride.

I don't respect your opinion. You should know better than to expect a different result.

You don't determine what is taken as offensive.

I already told you how psychiatry was weaponized against my people by militant atheists to torture and slaughter us.

If you guys are confused about this issue, it's because the rise of "pentecostalism" has infected evangelical and protestant churches with the idea that speaking in gibberish is speaking in tongues.

The church has never recognized babbling in an ecstatic emotional gibberish as speaking in tongues. 

I would go so far as to call it prelest.