Total posts: 19,931
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Easy to vote a lot when you don't have revenge or vote mods removing your votes to worry about.
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I would rather vote for a giraffe than for Trump.
I know that sounds sarcastic, I am actually deadly serious.
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@MisterChris
Ask someone else to host it then, I am not going to beg. I don't come to this website for mafia games anyway.
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@seldiora
I already got temp-banned and warned by bsh1 for the ramshutu comments. This is repunishment.
Virtuoso said, when he became mod, that all acts done prior to him being chief mod, were vindicated unless people had a permanent ban. I link to where he said that at the end of my post in the other thread.
It's best to just give this up, it's blatant that david/virtuoso has an agenda here and is pulling strings while ragnar takes the blame.
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@seldiora
What makes you think I'm trying to convince you? You are entitled to your ranking and I am entitled to mine. At the end of the day, Oromagi is the best debater in DART right now in every single category that is measurable. Did he play dirty at times and get unfairly voted to win because his opponent wasn't liked as much and he was known to vote for people who vote for him? That's another discussion to have and Mikal did similar things on DDO, though I will like to say a disclaimer 'theoretically'.
The fact is that in all borderline situations, Oromagi has an unwritten arrangement with Ragnar now and Ramshutu before, as well as others here. He has gained a following who enjoy him winning for a variety of reasons, not always to be voted for in return. We can sit and deny this exists or admit it does and that he does it well, within the technical rules and is very good at playing as dirty as he can get away with, even making other efficient debaters look dirtier (like me) for doing the same thing he does when he debates users who have left the site, banned or not.
Oromagi is a ferociously good debater and tactician, let alone strategist. Whatever you say about him, you cannot deny these things. I don't like him and he sometimes pretends to not dislike me but I respect his ability at what he does, because honestly he's the only guy here who pretty much equals me in every single category I excel at in debates, bar presentation, whilst being superior to me in many others. I think I could defeat him in weirder topics and also think I could defeat him in other arenas, games etc. He's a brilliant Internet debater on this website and this is due to all kinds of factors, including understanding voters.
Unwritten vote-for-me-I-help-you-out is in many things in the Internet and even IRL in workplaces. You can't stop it, you can only prevent the written solid agreements and official verbal arrangements if someone else overhears or one of them snitches. Oromagi knows what he is doing in every regard, both dirty and honest, and wins every single fucking debate he has now.
That is something to admit and respect, no matter what you think.
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@seldiora
I am not sure where you get your ideas from but whiteflame's consistency is due to him debating far less often and putting 100% effort into it with ease as he's only in 1 at a time. Oromagi takes on many and slays them all, often overkilling his opponent with brutal effectiveness.
Oromagi has improved significantly over time, whereas Whiteflame has plateaud. As for why I consider Oromagi the superior DART debater, that's blatant even statistically but also based on that he strives to give everyone a challenge at some point, it's others who fear him.
He's careful with his topics and sides but Whiteflame is even more so.
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@seldiora
Bsh1 has also lost, so what about that? Is everyone who beat him ranked above him?
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@seldiora
So what? Bsh1 wasn't above whiteflame on your list.
Also, beating someone once is like a poker tournament win, which you are happily calling luck in our debate. Even if you are saying that as a devil's advocate, the point I am making to you is that it's over many debates and the playstyle and a lot of other things, that we can determine superior players.
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@MisterChris
Ragnar's style is itself based on Bsh's it just has more formatting than Bsh1 tends to use. Idk why this is important, the skill of the debater isn't always in formatting.
I personally don't like Oromagi's formatting style at all, it actually gives me a headache to read at times because parts that are emboldened or capitalised should just be left plain and lowercase for a smoother read, that doesn't mean he's less of a debater but let's say he was equal in other areas to another, then yeah it would factor in.
Oromagi's only weaknesses are his formatting and that he tends to be less aware of how his case can go wrong than most top-tier debaters. What he does instead is hyper-builds attacks onto the opponent's case by researching things no one else would think of and using quotes and data in a destructive combination that allows his case to look less damaged.
When he is against me, for instance, you will find that he rarely addresses my rebuttals as much as focuses on the points of himself I failed to destroy, he then builds them more and angles them very gently back at my rebuttals. He basically regenerates health, rather than being high in armour or magic-resist, if we talk from an RPG perspective. Ramshutu and I are much more defensive than the top 3 debaters, who are primarily offensive. Ramshutu and myself react a lot more to the pace and structure of our opponent, putting in less effort vs a lazier opponent and more effort vs a tryhard (even if they are weak at debating). This is because we both structure our cases 'around' the other, generally speaking. His only non-forfeiting loss is against me and he also has beaten me brutally by baiting me well to debate something that simply is too hard to prove in the debating arena, I don't regret taking it though as I am happy to lose sometimes. Losing is a part of winning, it's healthy to lose and humble yourself.
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@MisterChris
I didn't rank this solely based on 'superior rank will defeat inferior rank in a 1v1' there's quite a few factors involved and tbph me and ramshutu are joint fifth but I don't want to deny his success in the ring just because he was the main reason outside of the ring that I lost mine (voting).
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@MisterChris
You don't structure that differently, he just makes it look prettier, you make it look chunkier as you mimicked Oromagi.
The whole 'vote Pro' or 'vote Con' thing at the end is something Bsh1 was the first to make mainstream on this website. On DDO that was more normal I think.
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@MisterChris
That's because he debates similar to you.
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@MisterChris
okay, he has taken a stance supporting polygamy but let's not ignore that his opponent was barely trying whatsoever, his opponent's weakness is why he won. I guarantee he will have stumbled if Wylted was more like Thett3, Ragnar, Oromagi or someone like that.
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@MisterChris
It takes a few clicks and some time and you will have seen what I have seen. He is uncreative, 'copy paste edit mainstream argument' robotic but he is very good at being it compared to most who try to be that way.
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@MisterChris
Why shouldn't he be? He only beat me due to Whiteflame completely misunderstanding my case and only wins on very popular sides of very mainstream topics. I have never once seen Bsh1 take an unconventional stance or carry out a creative noobsnipe. He's a machine of popular deduction and those ranked above him do what he does better or are more creative (or both).
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I think some right-wing nutjobs need to reread what they posted to this thread later on and question how ashamed they are of their behaviour and abusive language.
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- Oromagi "Genius of Research, MMA Kingpin."
- Ragnar "Tai Chi Guru of the BoP shift"
- Whiteflame "Extremely Charismatic Nerd"
- Ramshutu "Merciless Exploiter of Weaknesses"
- RationalMadman "Kung Fu Multidisciplinary Beast"
- Blamonkey "Hermitic Ninja"
- Alec/TheUnderdog "Jiu Jitsu Propagandist"
- Trent0405 "Valiant Knight of Solid Citation"
- TheRealNihilist "Brutally Aggressive Case Builder"
- MisterChris "Karate Propagandist"
- SemperFortis "High IQ Chameleon"
- Zaradi "Revered Wielder of Philosophical Artillery"
- Discipulus_Didicit "Ramshutu's Apprentice"
- Intelligence_06/User_06 "Prodigy of the Dark Arts"
- Bsh1 "Rhetoric Warrior of the Left"
- Speedrace "Sumo Master of the Defensive Rebuttal"
- Imabench "That Legend Everyone Forgot They All Remember"
- bmdrocks21 "Merciless Underdog"
- Death23 "Drunken Fist Zombie"
- ArmoredCat "Brick-Breaking Rebuker"
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I wonder what it's like to rank someone below the top 10 who you keep losing to and who is willing to lose to you and even forfeits to you sometimes but keeps winning anyway.
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@MisterChris
“Choose old people for enemies. They die. You win.”
This has to be the worst advice to give anyone both morally and strategically. Depending on which old person your cowardly ass picks on, you will have made a wise, inescapable enemy that will show no mercy and has nothing left to lose.
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@MisterChris
Which fact isn't straight?
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@MisterChris
You're the dumb one, speedrace is spot on.
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@Sum1hugme
Do the inverse, stick to the points that can and will bait out rebuttals that you know how to shut down.
As for the points you don't know for sure you won't have turned against you, mention them quietly as a passing remark.
This is strongest against medium opponents. It is weakest against terrible/troll opponents as their rebuttals, if they occur, will be out of left field so you should not restrain yourself as much with them. Against competent opponents, you should slightly do the pre-raise and shut down thing but when it's possible to bring up the rebuttal-to-their-rebuttal as a contention of its own, this is the best way to handle competent opponents.
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@Speedrace
Not at all. Christianity is debatable but I don't consider it valid.
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@Lunatic
@Mikal
See above post
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@David
@Barney
@Vader
@Speedrace
@MisterChris
Hello deluded mods and Supadudz, here we see Seldiora explicitly explain that he can't debate in support of my ban:
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You tolerate verbal feuds and insults. I can't risk giving the mods a reason to lie and ban me again and also don't enjoy being verbally abused so from both angles that's a bad thing for me.
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@K_Michael
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@BearMan
You swapped around 3 and 1 in what you just said.
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@WaterPhoenix
my chair doesnt have armrests.
then your upper arm will suffer or your wrist will, take your pick.
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@BearMan
You said 'every single criteria'. That's exactly what Croc's says.
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2 and 3 are the same argument, I'm happy to have credit for 1 but that's an ancient idea invented by parents who refused to pick a favourite child, I'm merely the messenger.
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I have only now realised that I lost the sources point most decisively because my best sources (which come in Round 2) all were not able to be seen as shorturl has temporary lifespan to its shorturls. This is actually extremely terrible as it means someone could link inappropriate material and it would randomly assign the URLs I have used to that. I had no idea shorturl works this way and deletes the link to the longer URL after some time.
Do not use shorturl.at
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@BearMan
Let the conspiracy theorists have their theories.
If you have no significant health-based excuse to not wear a mask and are in an enclosed space like a shop, restaurant etc. You should absolutely wear it. Why not? Even if you believe it doesn't help stop the spread (which is false, as it does help stop the spread) what reason is there to not make others feel safe around you?
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Do you know what they leave out of the story? Where/who was the human animal of the female sex that he brought onto the arc?
Also, we aren't all children of Adam and Even as such, it's more accurate to say we are all children of Noah and whoever the woman was.
It's rumoured he brought several wives on and this is why the story is so popular amongst Mormons.
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@Lunatic
I didn't say I am a victim, I said it's ashame I can't just ping people and they say /in just like that.
If I truly wasn't a 'victim' of any kind (despite me not saying I am one originally, I will now explain it), you wouldn't dare host this in competition with me based on the assumption I'm too unpopular of a host to get a game going.
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@Lunatic
I am just saying that if anyone meets the definition of one, it's more likely you than me based on the definition.
I didn't call you a true bully, I said you were being baited by someone and were in turn lashing out back at him. Bullies rarely are innately born, they usually are instigated by other bullies and turned bad.
I said the moderator should step in to prevent either of you bullying each other and the situation escalating.
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@Lunatic
His lack of response shows he doesn't want to engage further and dropped the issue. Bullying someone is basically kicking someone while they are down.
He responded through actions and backstabbing behind the scenes. You have no idea what you are talking about when you imply he did nothing to me. If the authorities abuse and erroneously punish someone, they can't suddenly play dead when the victim gets furious and calls them out. Your analogy to bullying is ridiculous, I was the victim.
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This politics forum section is like one big comedy series.
What the FUCK entitled US to annex Panama?
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@OntologicalSpider
Nothing can come from nothing, there must be an eternal entity that exists and can generate other entities.
Think logically, end of discussion.
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@Lunatic
Shame I'm not in the cool kid clique.
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@Lunatic
It is you who has the bullshit definition of 'bullying', not me.
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@Lunatic
He is fighting back, he's the one who started it. He wants me banned for six months and is responsible for the pure lies that Ragnar is saying I did, such as multiaccounting and doxxing.
David is the one pulling strings even now. You don't understand that my beef is with him because he's refusing to face me after getting me banned over his lies.
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