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@Vader
If you watch porn (as the vast majority of guys do), then you're a hypocrite.
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@Vader
As a Libertarian who voted Trump, I think if there's one thing that I'd ban it would be porn. Porn has become such a plague to the youth and become way to accessible.
You can argue banning anything can be justified because it's a plague to the youth.
Banning guns can be argued to be a plague.
Banning the unvaccinated; same thing.
Banning Bitcoin; same thing.
Banning tobacco; same thing (it's different here because you can actually verify age, but if you couldn't, then would you ban tobacco for 50 year olds)?
How are you libertarian? I don't believe you are libertarian; but merely like to adopt edgy positions that you haven't thought through.
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@Lemming
Oh, Matt Walsh is going to influence Trump for sure.
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@WyIted
When he doesn't ban porn will you admit you are a retard?
He probably will ban porn, but if he doesn't, then I will admit I'm incorrect; but not a retard. You aren't retarted for making an incorrect prediction.
But don't play hide the ball; you would defend Trump if he did ban porn, so defend that position.
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@Best.Korea
Porn causes harm and brings no benefits to society.
So does tobacco. Will you ban tobacco? No.
Banning porn is probably one of the least libertarian things you can do.
He is a Christian. He has to ban it. What would Jesus do?
He's Christian; but there is a difference between being Christian and being a theocrat. Your religion is for you; not anybody else. Mormons can't drink coffee; they don't ban it for everyone.
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MAGA: Trump doesn't support Project 2025 which would ban porn.
Me: Yes he does; his staff admits to it here
Me: Yes he does; his staff admits to it here
MAGA: We agree with him!
Me: Anyone who supports banning porn should not call themselves libertarian.
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@Mall
What does that mean? I hate Trump.
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@WyIted
Or if you are retarded enough to think the teaparty is libertarian and not just a combination of libertarians, paleocons and fundamentalists who are negotiating policy with each other to band together against the greater evil
You can just say MAGA republican.
Actual libertarianism is very different from MAGA.
There is no point in arguing because you are a MAGA hack and I actually think for myself (which you like to think that you do; when you don't).
My experts went to Ivy League schools; your expert tells Americans to be in shape while being obese.
Case closed.
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@Savant
If he came in and ran as "ultra pro-choice guy," Reps wouldn't like him. If he changed to "ultra pro-choice guy" now, Reps wouldn't like him.
No; they would probably see it as attempting to posture to the left.
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@WyIted
The Maga movement comes from the tea party movement
P1: TEA-> Taxed enough already.
P2: Trump supports adding Tarriffs (aka a tax). You can say a tax on companies or consumers; but a tax nonetheless.
C1: Genuine TEA party members don't support Trump. People that like angertainment do.
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@Savant
If he had initially been pro all abortions though, he never would have become popular with Reps in the first place.
He was pro choice most of his life (and in 2015; most republicans hated Trump, so he had to at least say he was pro life to get republicans to back him). In 2015, when Trump wasn't even winning a majority in the primary (out of Trump, Cruz, Kasich), Kasich was the economic conservative; Cruz was the religious conservative, and Trump was the nationalist conservative (which definitely did have racist members in it as well as young conservatives who vote for whatever feels good and military people), and Trump was able to win the primary because Kasich didn't drop out and endorse Cruz. Maybe 20% of the country votes in the GOP primary; 40% of which supported Trump; and 25% of them are genuine racists; 2% of the country. But the cult grew; and at this point, the people that like Trump I think are almost entirely either genine racists (10% roughy) or vibesters (they aren't too political; but they like the way Trump makes them feel) (>85%).
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@Amber
Uh, no dear, it was not.It was all factually inaccurate.Subjective opinions are not objective opinions.
State one claim that I made that was factually inaccurate. If not, then you just said the statement to virtue signal to yourself and the people who already agree with you.
I believe every single person who liked my comment on this thread I disagree with massively a lot on other issues; but they know I'm correct here.
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@Savant
But there are definitely policy positions Trump could take to alienate his base. If he says "we need open borders," "make vaccines mandatory," or "legalize all abortions" all day long, this will harm his support among conservatives.
This is because he initially leaned into the opposite. If Trump in 2020 won and advocated to make vaccienes mandatory initially, then the MAGA base will become pro mandate (especially if he ties unvaccination to blacks from Harlem).
The right's consistent ethos is intial and sufficiently leaned in Trumpism. If Trump leaned into something initially and stuck with it sufficiently, then the MAGA world believes it. Trump initially leaned into anti CSA beliefs; but it was a very short and brief time. Trump has been pro vacciene, but only after he initally was anti COVID vax publicly for a long time.
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@WyIted
There is a bit of a difference between being pro free speech and also being willing to call out propaganda. Not sure why anyone would be retarded enough to believe that calling out propaganda means you don't respect people's right to hear propaganda
To you, "propaganda"="fact/opinion that I disagree with". If you are unwilling to be convinced by what you deem propaganda, then there is no point in trying to change your mind.
Liberal vegan- ban meatConservative vegan- keep it legal but personally discourage it.
90% of the population eats meat. It's not going anywhere. Conservatives have actually wanted to ban lab grown meat.
Liberal gay person- force preachers to marry meConservative gay person- maybe we should find somebody willing to marry us and not get the government involved to force some preacher.
I'm with the conservatives here.
Liberal non smoker- let's ban indoor smokingConservative non smoker- let's not patronize businesses that allow people to smoke.
And here
Lets add some others:
Liberal religious person: Finds homosexuality sinful; doesn't want to ban gay marriage and force their beliefs on gay people at the state level (ie banning gay marriage in Alabama).
Conservative religious person: Finds homosexuality sinful; wants to ban gay marriage and force their beliefs on gay people at the state level (ie banning gay marriage in Alabama).
There's a reason why liberal and liberty have many letters in common.
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I made the poli program viewable. My bad.
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@Greyparrot
Yes, but if you're not willing to be convinced, then there is no point in exchanging free speech with you.
Are you willing to be convinced to support Harris over Trump? If not, then there is no point in people exercising their free speech to you on these issues and therefore, if you are unwilling to be convinced to hate Trump, then you cannot convince me to like him because the willingness to be convinced must be 2 way; otherwise there is no point in us wasting each other's time.
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MAGA: Hate speech is free speech! If it's incorrect, then use counter speech to correct it.
Me: If the counter speech comes from a left source, then you say it's leftist propaganda. If the counter speech comes from a neutral source, then you say it's deep state propaganda. If the counter speech comes from a right wing source, then you say it's RINO propaganda.
Counter speech doesn't work on those who are in a cult! All speech they disagree with they assume is propoganda and they dismiss it, no matter how accurate the propoganda is.
That's why I think the only type of political speech that should be allowed is speech that adds to the following program produced by the free market:
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@Greyparrot
@Intelligence_06
@Double_R
@Savant
Pretty sure most of America disagrees with those programmed premises. On both sides.
I'm going to tag some anti Trump people to see if you might be correct. I doubt it.
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@Greyparrot
Everything I said was correct, but you're not changing your mind because you have a party to stick too and I've fucking given up.
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You love Trump because of policy group A (which can encompass multiple policies or maybe just 1). If Harris enacted everything in group A, then you would still hate her.
You hate Harris because of policy group B (which can encompass multiple policies or maybe just 1). If Trump enacted everything in group B, then you would still love Trump.
You don't have any consistent moral worldview; you just follow a cult of personality.
If Trump did a rally in a Klan uniform and argued the Klan isn't racist; they just stand for their people; then you would simultaneously believe the KKK aren't racist while claiming the democrats are racist for getting endorsed by the KKK (allegedly).
If Harris defends legalized IVF; you call her a baby killer. If Trump does it, you say he's pro family.
If Harris does inflation; you get angry at her over it. If Trump does it, then you don't care.
Trump can give free gender surgeries to illegal immigrants in prison and you guys don't care (but would be outraged about it if Harris did it) (Did Trump offer medical care to transgender prisoners? | verifythis.com).
You guys will criticize Trump for taking the vaccine, but that's only because he trashed it for so long.
You guys will wrap yourselves up in the 1st amendment until Trump calls for banning radical Islamic anti semitic speech, then you will say, "We got to ban hate speech" (only when it's Muslims; not white nationalists).
Your party is a fucking joke; it is a cult of personality, and it's why I left the GOP in August.
Good fucking riddance! GOP = MAGA and I'm out. I have TDS and I'm proud too have it. If it offends the MAGA snowflakes on here, IDGAF!
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@Best.Korea
If a plant matters more to you than a human; then don't eat your next meal with any plants. You think it's worse than cannabalism.
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@n8nrgim
trump supporters - do you acknowledge that trump has a cult based on personality?
deep down they do; but they know if they are upfront and say they are in the Trump cult, then they know it looks socially unacceptable, so they dodge the question.
This is cowardly. If someone asks me if I have Trump derangement syndrome, I don't dodge the question; I answer, "Yes" (because I have balls; unlike the MAGA crowd) and having Trump Derangement Syndrome (TDS) is the correct position as Trump is a threat to American democracy!
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@Sidewalker
So are the experts right when they say 2nd hand smoke is worse than smoking?
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@HistoryBuff
Yeah, but there have been more votes than the # requested. I would assume a delay even exists because people may wait a few days before voting.
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@zedvictor4
It's also foolish to think that deliberately inhaling smoke and it's contaminants is still cool.
I'm not saying 2nd hand smoke is good; I'm saying 1st hand smoking is worse (and the experts disagree).
And if people weren't so lazy and were more content with being in one place, then the luxury of personal vehicles would not also be an addiction.
You can be pro public transit whole acknowledging the obvious that more lanes -> less annoying traffic. If you say more lanes will still have more traffic than trains, then fine; don't claim though that 3 lanes of traffic has worse traffic than 2 lanes; otherwise interstates would be one lane roads everywhere.
And a continent is a delineated area of Planet Earth, incorporating smaller delineated areas.
You could say that about a country. It's not a good enough definition.
Maybe continents shouldn't exist; every landmass surrounded by water on all 4 sides is an island, even Eurasia and North and South America.
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Apparently, there are more republican voters that have cast a ballot nationally then republican voters that requested a mail in ballot to begin with.
Why is that?
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The experts: Climate change is real! Solve climate change! We are trustworthy. When have we been wrong before in the 21st century?
Me: Some examples. You've said:
- 2nd hand smoke is worse than smoking. Why? To guilt trip parents into stopping smoke (for the incorrect reason that their children will be worse off from their smoking habit than they were).
- More lanes on roads makes highways more congested. Why? Because Elon Musk supports expanding road infastructure.
- Can’t define what a continent is by any means other than a list; says they exist anyways.
I don't trust you guys.
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@FLRW
OMG, are you really Arnold Schwarzenegger?
What would make you think that?
This thought is incorrect; it should be terminated.
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If Harris'es reason for not doing the Rogan show is she believes virtually no voters are gettable and would rather just energize the voters she already has, I don't agree with her opinion on this, but I respect this and would therefore change my preference from Trump > Harris to Harris > Trump.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I've seen you use the genetic fallacy many times
How am I using a fallacy?
If you're claiming that Dr. Franklin can't simultaneously agree with project 2025 and recognize that Trump has not embraced it as a policy platform at the same time then this is yet another example of your false dichotomies
If you agree with project 2025 and I accuse Trump of wanting to enact it, then you say, "Project 2025 is good because ...". Saying, "Trump isn't pro Project 2025." only makes sense if you don't agree with project 2025 (or you do, but you want to hide that support which is just decietful).
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Your bias is that you think you are smart enough to dismiss people for being party loyalist but you aren't.
I've never seen DoubleR buck orthodoxy with his party (or Dr. Franklin).
Dr. Franklin said in 3 days that Trump does not support Project 2025 and when he was told that if Trump did, then Dr. Franklin would agree, then Dr. Franklin said he would.
All it takes is for Trump to endorse the KKK and the MAGA right will become klansmen. All it takes is for Harris to say, "All right wing speech is hate speech; it's discriminatory to people of color, women, the LGBTQIA+, and poor communities. Ban right wing speech." and then her base becomes anti first amendment.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
You are always accusing someone else besides yourself of being biased.
It would be projection if I did that.
Everyone has a bias.
I accuse people of being partisan hacks, of being sheep (for the republican media machine), and for not speaking their truth (democrat party machine).
But people don't have the IQ to actually buck orthodoxy with their party and that's unfixable, so anytime I hear Double R talk I think, "Liberals saying liberal things". Vice versa for GP.
Even the libertarians do this (which is why I loosely call myself libertarian; I disagree with the party a lot) (death penalty and electoral college; 2 examples).
The libertarians take an unjustifiable position here:
In addition, the electoral college is Affirmitive Action to marginalized groups (called states with small population counts). A National Popular Vote is the only way to not have a diversity quota for states won. If you're worried this will give the left an advantage, then I would be fine with raising the voting age to 21 to balence things out.
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@Double_R
Every thing you've ever done in your life is subject to world wide scrutiny and every word you speak will be played on an endless loop if you screw up so I really don't know why this narrative convinces you.
Whether a Harris flaw is something as harmless as speeding or something as serious as giving someone HIV (or same for Trump), this election demonstrated that MAGA won't change their minds on Trump (and vice versa for the dems).
Bernie Sanders was accused of having r@pe fantasies; nobody who initially liked him cared. Tim Waltz has a DUI to his name; the people that like him don't care.
Why you seem to think Joe Rogan is so much more intimidating than everyone else on planet earth. But whatever, you're entitled to your opinion.
Not intimidating; but influencial. If Obama, Jay Z, DeSantis, or Kid Rock endorses someone, it changes virtually nobody's minds. Joe Rogan endorses someone; a bunch of people change their minds. Same with RFK; if he backed Harris, then it would have helped Harris in the election; she might be at D+9 by now (initially D+5, but Trump would get angrier and more unhinged, boosting Harris'es numbers). But he backed Trump; so that made the election close.
For the same reason she along with every presidential candidate does anything they do this close to an election; because they along with their team calculated that there is a more effective use of their time.
How is Beyonce more effective than Rogan? Virtually every big Beyonce fan is voting for Harris; her fan base is black urban women. The ones that like Trump won't change their minds and are willing to listen to an artist they disagree with.
I listen to Billy Joel sometimes; he could endorse Trump or Harris; it won't change my support; but I'd still listen to his music.
Rogan is not like that at all to a lot of people.
You said you don't take any of her claims seriously, and yet the claims you are talking about are being made pretty much everywhere in the country including many times on this site.
Yes; but in terms of the evidence for and against those facts, I don't expect randos here left or right to have all the facts to defend their position. I'm sure some people are fast; but I wouldn't place them in a 100 meter Olympic dash. I would save that for the people who actually train and make that their life's work.
Harris is the one who has to actually train and make good arguments for her positions that she can tell Rogan. Same with Trump. For anyone who's a supporter of either; training (ie research) is optional; so they're less likely to do it nearly as well.
The claim that Trump is fascist is proven by playing his actual words that he has publicly uttered many times before.
Those words Harris can state on Rogan and Rogan would provide decent counters that Harris would be expected to be able to rebuttal.
Plus the fact that the people he appointed and worked side by side with him are telling us this is who he is behind the scenes as well.
Why Trump has a high turnover rate; I don't know. Harris can bring up this point in a Rogan interview. See what Rogan says; if he can't say anything and endorses Harris, then it will help Harris in the polls (which she needs at this point).
So why do you care what Kamala tells you to believe, do you not have your own opinions?
I do, but I am not going to put as much effort into them as someone who's litterally running for POTUS. Just like I may run occasionally, I'm not going to put in as much effort as the top 5 active marathoners.
But not every Harris supporter will go out and vote, neither will every Trump supporter. Undecided voters at this point in the campaign are a tiny sliver of the population, what's far more important at this stage is energizing your voters to go out and cast a ballot.
This is a good point; I just think most people are as energized enough to vote for either candidate if they support them. If you're energized on September 1 to vote Trump out; then it's likely that lasts for 2 months. In the 2020 election, there was the least amount of state by state swing out of any election since 2000, and Trump was running against someone many thought had dementia. People have largely made up their minds, and even though the undecided voters are a small part of the population, they are the annexable ones and should be treated as such.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
You say that about anyone who expresses an opinion or gives an argument, so, yawn....
When I do it, it goes after both sides. When most people do it; they say, "Become democrat (or a RINO)" or, "Become republican (or a DINO)".
I tend to respect any ethos that is consistently, "Pro (something undeniably good)" or, "Anti (something undeniably bad)" even if it's not my own.
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@Double_R
Trump has been cancelling appearances left and right and refuses to do another debate after getting his ass handed to him in the last one, but Kamala Harris who unlike Trump did the 60 minute interview and went on Fox News is the coward because she hasn't yet gone on with Joe Rogan?
For me though; Trump going on CNN or Harris going on Fox or either going to favorable stations doesn't take much guts. If Trump goes on CNN, CNN asks him a question, and Trump dodges it, then anyone who would have already voted against Trump would still vote against him and vice versa. Same with Harris going on Fox News.
Trump or Harris going on CNN or Fox is like them campaigning in California or South Dakota; there's no point.
Trump or Harris going to battleground states/battleground people (like Joe Rogan) takes courage because Rogan's audience is much more independently leaning; so if Trump said, "the Haitians are eating the pets" on the JRE podcast, then it would be much more devastating to his campaign than if he said it to Fox or CNN or even a national debate (because virtually everyone who watches national debates has their mind made up; this isn't nearly as true for JRE's audience).
A national debate is like a US POTUS election without AZ, NV, MI, and the other swing states as pretty much everyone watching those debates made up their minds; a JRE podcast is like an election with just 6 swing states and maybe 3 left and 4 right wing states. Rogan's audience is way more persuadable then a national debate's audience.
Virtually nobody who watches a 60 minute interviews regularly is genuinely open to voting for either; they made up their minds on Harris I think (which is fine; but it's pointless for Trump to try and win people with a Delaware mindset (Delaware mindset= slightly left, but no way are they voting red)).
If you're voting for Trump this is not why.
I didn't vote Trump; I voted for Chase Oliver; but I prefer Trump to Harris right now.
Setting aside why you think Joe Rogan is the political god that all presidential candidates must answer to...
- Rogan covers politics.
- Rogan is the biggest podcaster in the world.
- Rogan is an independent guy. He is left on some issues (abortion, gaza, medicare for all, weed) and right wing on others (guns, vaccine mandates, free speech).
- His audience largely leans the same way on the left/right spectrum.
- He is curious; not argumentative.
The evidence that Trump is a fascist along with every other claim being made against him is not because Kamala Harris said so. It's because of the things he says and does everyday along with the testimonials of the people who worked for him.
Alright; if Harris believes these things, then why doesn't she go on JRE's podcast and defend those views? She'd rather tour with Beyonce (which doesn't win too much support because everyone can assume Beyonce would be a Harris supporter; being from Hollywood and all that). It would be smarter to try and win over auto workers and construction workers and the way to do that would be to get Rogan's endorsement.
You would benefit from exercising a bit more critical thinking as you assess which candidate would be better for the country.
You would say that about anyone who disagrees with you on who's better, Trump or Harris, so, yawn....
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@Greyparrot
If Harris drops out, then we basically have one party rule (which I'm not a big fan of). I want Harris to stay in the race and make her case on platforms where a lot of persuadable people will see her, and JRE is the place to get that done.
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@JoeBob
He won’t show up for another debate, but why?
Probably because he's a coward (which don't me wrong, I absolutley don't respect Trump).
But I prefer action to talk. Trump says he won't do another debate, he got a Rogan interview done. Harris said she would challange Trump anytime any place, she didn't show up to Rogan.
In terms of actions:
Trump: 2 debates, 1 JRE visit.
Biden/Harris: 2 debates, 0 JRE visits.
And I'm willing to say this right now; if Harris goes to JRE and doesn't severely screw it up (her opponenet after all, is a convicted felon who did Jan 6), then I will have no problem preferring Harris to Trump.
But I don't vote for cowards (and I'm consistent here; I prefer Warnock to Walker).
Actual consistency pisses a lot of people from both sides off.
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@Moozer325
Rogan is pro choice, pro weed, and has the following take on Israel:
He takes the Pro Palestine position.
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@JoeBob
If it’s as bad a dodging a debate, why do you support Trump more? He didn’t want to do a second debate with Harris.
I am an Eagle Scout; to do that, I needed guys for my project to lead to accomplish it.
Person A says they will assist me on the project. They don't show up.
Person B says they won't assist me on the project. They show up.
Who do I respect more? Person B.
Trump said he wouldn't debate and he showed up to a Rogan interview. Harris is all bark, no bite.
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Harris: Trump is a racist, sexist, homophobe, transphobe, xenophobe, convicted felon, and a threat to democracy! He quotes Hitler!
Me: If you believe these things, then will you go on Rogan's podcast and defend these claims?
Harris: No! I have more important things to do (like campaign with Beyonce to a bunch of people who will already vote for me instead of Rogan's relatively independent audience). I like echo chambers. I'll accuse Trump of being a debate dodger even though he showed up to the Rogan interview (reaches about the same # of people as the debate, and probably a better quality of people because Rogan viewers are more open to changing their views than POTUS debate watchers).
Me: Now, I can't take you seriously. Any bad claim you make about Trump I just can't take seriously if you're unwilling to defend these claims to Rogan (who is not extreme at all).
To me, this is as bad as dodging a debate. I don't support Katie Hobbs, Herschel Walker, and Kamala Harris for the same reason; they don't have the guts to defend their positions to the genuine swing voter. I don't vote for cowards. Trump had the guts to defend his views to Rogan; Harris didn't.
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@Barney
@HistoryBuff
@FLRW
Read post 31. It is the truth about virtually every person that still supports Trump to this day.
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@Greyparrot
Trump Says NO INCOME TAX As He Nears 2024 WIN
Why didn't he get this done from 2016 to 2020? He's not going to fufill this.
You have TCS (Trump Cult Syndrome) and I have TDS (Trump derangement syndrome). There is nothing I can possibly imagine Trump can say that will get me to vote for him or vice versa for you. Accept the stalemate and move on.
Trump can r@pe your daughter in front of you (so you have the needed evidence) and you would still vote for him.
Am I wrong? If yes, then state what other things would disqualify him. If no, then you do not deserve the right to reproduce if you would sacrifice your daughters to Trump if he asked. If you refuse to answer this question within 24 hours, then we will assume your answer is no.
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@Greyparrot
If I'm being blunt; then there is no point in me debating with you about whether Harris is better or worse than Trump because Trump could nuke SF to destroy woke Silicon Valley and you'd still vote for him because of inflation allegations (which are under control now, but you don't really care about inflation).
You hold Trump to a looser standard than Harris and you always will.
Good day.
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@Mall
It's stupid to try and appeal to voters you know you won't get because it pisses off your own base.
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@Greyparrot
So do you give Harris credit then on inflation? Her maximum inflation rate was comparable to what it was under Reagan.
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@Swagnarok
The thing about dogs and cats was fake, but what's true is that Haitian refugees were hunting and killing ducks from the local park.
The only honest people that can complain about this are non-meat eaters.
I could if I wanted too (I'd have to get as angry at people eating steak, which I'd rather not).
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@Best.Korea
Chicken is smarter than a dog, yet you eat it.
- Dogs are smarter.
- I've been vegan for 2 years.
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@Greyparrot
Literally the price of almost anything.
The inflation rate currently under Harris is comparable to what it was under Reagan. If you don't like inflation, then blame the federal reserve; Harris can't control the federal reserve. Harris appointing 22% of the fed is irrelevant; it's like getting mad at the principle of a school because your kid failed a class; if your kid fails a class, then get mad at the teacher, not the person who hired the teacher.
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